StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
I'm going to re blead the cooling system and see what happens.
I'm going to give the KOER test one more shot. I wish this was like a 1 senor deal, seems like I've got multiple codes going on here.
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HELP! Just bought an SHO, and having issues!!!
- Thread starter StAnGbAnGeR
- Start date
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I'm going to re blead the cooling system and see what happens.
I'm going to give the KOER test one more shot. I wish this was like a 1 senor deal, seems like I've got multiple codes going on here.
StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
Wow! I can't even get it to stay running now. It start up, idles at about 500 - 600 rpm, then dies. I have to prime the fuel pump to get to start again, then it does the same thing. I'm going to borrow a fuel pressure gauge and see what the fuel pressure is. Being that this thing has eaten pumps in the past, maybe that is part of what is going on. When I took it out earlier, if I drove it normal, and didn't get into the throttle that much, it didn't break up. Now I can't even keep it running. I'm hoping the fuel pump is the suspect. The check engine light did not come back on after I un plugged the battery and hooked it back up to erase the codes, and drove it. Maybe the fuel pressure regulator could also be a suspect???
Sorry for the play by play.....I just want to get this car fixed so I can drive it. Sharing a mini van with my wife and 3 kids sucks!
Sorry for the play by play.....I just want to get this car fixed so I can drive it. Sharing a mini van with my wife and 3 kids sucks!
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Slo-Sho
It wasn't me!
Try Ether (starting fluid).
StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
Ok. I FINALLY got it started again, and it was idling on its own. This car is possessed!!! It will run one time, then the next time you start it, won't stay running. I don't get it. Here's the last KOER (properly done with moving the steering wheel, and goosing the gass). I did the KOER test first for fear that it would not start again, then I did the KOEO test right after. These are the final codes. Here's the last youtube video for these codes. But remember, I did the KOER first, and KOEO second.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLHRU5-ApYA
I'm still going to check fuel pressure, probably tomorrow, I will borrow a fuel pressure gauge from one of the technicians at work.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLHRU5-ApYA
I'm still going to check fuel pressure, probably tomorrow, I will borrow a fuel pressure gauge from one of the technicians at work.
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StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLHRU5-ApYA
So this is what I have, and correct me if I'm wrong please:
KOER (first test conducted; was affraid it would not start)
159
121
538
KOEO:
111
111
121
154
221
143
It did throw a code for the goose test; the car will not take a goose in throttle, falls on it's face. Am I right on the codes? Some of them I could not find on the list. In this case with all the codes I've pulled and posted vids of, where should I start first?
I'm going to check the sender out tomorrow night, to make sure that it's not shorting my fuel pump out. I will take pics of it, James seems to think there is a sender issue. The crank sensor is only $30 from advanced, so I may just order one. The TPS is out of range too according to the code above, so looks like a crank sensor, and a TPS so far.
So this is what I have, and correct me if I'm wrong please:
KOER (first test conducted; was affraid it would not start)
159
121
538
KOEO:
111
111
121
154
221
143
It did throw a code for the goose test; the car will not take a goose in throttle, falls on it's face. Am I right on the codes? Some of them I could not find on the list. In this case with all the codes I've pulled and posted vids of, where should I start first?
I'm going to check the sender out tomorrow night, to make sure that it's not shorting my fuel pump out. I will take pics of it, James seems to think there is a sender issue. The crank sensor is only $30 from advanced, so I may just order one. The TPS is out of range too according to the code above, so looks like a crank sensor, and a TPS so far.
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SinisterSHO
Rust free
I believe you will get the TPS code if you are not snaping the throttle during the test
There are more experienced mechanics than I comenting but I did chase a very similar problem in my 93 mtx replaced a lot of stuff before I found it was a cam sensor- the problems I had were very similar and very unpredictable.
StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
The car did throw a crank sensor code earlier today. I've got a number of routes to take. I'm going to look at the fuel pump first since it threw a code for that too. I'm gonna check fuel pressure at the rail.
159 = mafs out of test range - you will need to fix this to get it to run right. is the connector on properly? if so, I would swap in a different mafs.
121 = tps out of range - you will need to fix this to get it to run right. this is the first thing I would change.
538 = operator error on test
KOEO:
111
111
121 = tps out of range - this must be fixed for it to run correctly.
154 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
221 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
143 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
I would change the tps first.
The pcm will set a fuel pump code if the engine stalls, and since that has been happening, the fuel pump code may be meaningless, or not. The fuel pressure test should give you some guidance there.
121 = tps out of range - you will need to fix this to get it to run right. this is the first thing I would change.
538 = operator error on test
KOEO:
111
111
121 = tps out of range - this must be fixed for it to run correctly.
154 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
221 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
143 = does not show up on my list of possible codes
I would change the tps first.
The pcm will set a fuel pump code if the engine stalls, and since that has been happening, the fuel pump code may be meaningless, or not. The fuel pressure test should give you some guidance there.
sperold
Last to Know
This is why you should get a code reader.
I will list the code explanations from my help book, when they have an expanded explanation:
Your 121 code reads that your closed throttle voltage is higher or lower than expected, and that is why you cannot maintain an idle. If it were always low or always high, you would see a slightly different code. So yours is all over the map when closed
Your 538 code reads that you had insufficient rpm change during your dynamic response test, and that may not have a bearing on your issues. When you do the test again, make sure you watch the tach and get some good rpm (above 3000 rpm, lets say) in your wide open throttle pedal push.
Your 154 code is wrong, all the codes in the 140s and 150s have to do with O2 sensors or MAF sensor faults.
Your 221 code is a spark timing error. (Often a crankshaft position sensor issue.)
Your 143 code is wrong, but see the note for code 154 above.
This is a repeat of Rubydist's list, but hopefully the expanded explanation will help you make your buying decisions.
I will list the code explanations from my help book, when they have an expanded explanation:
Your 121 code reads that your closed throttle voltage is higher or lower than expected, and that is why you cannot maintain an idle. If it were always low or always high, you would see a slightly different code. So yours is all over the map when closed
Your 538 code reads that you had insufficient rpm change during your dynamic response test, and that may not have a bearing on your issues. When you do the test again, make sure you watch the tach and get some good rpm (above 3000 rpm, lets say) in your wide open throttle pedal push.
Your 154 code is wrong, all the codes in the 140s and 150s have to do with O2 sensors or MAF sensor faults.
Your 221 code is a spark timing error. (Often a crankshaft position sensor issue.)
Your 143 code is wrong, but see the note for code 154 above.
This is a repeat of Rubydist's list, but hopefully the expanded explanation will help you make your buying decisions.
ElliottBrent
New Member
:thankyou::thankyou::thankyou::thankyou:
__________________________________________________
Nissan shocks and struts
Nissan quick strut
Toyota shocks and struts
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StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
yes sir...that shifter is the stuff. As soon as I get some things figured out on this car, I'm aiming for one. My rod shifter setup has seen better days.
This SHO has a lot of problems coming from a member who has wrenched 40-60 hours on it. 
I'm sorry, but anyone and everyone can keep throwing ideas at you but the problem will not fix itself. You need to take your mechanic skills that you say you have, and get to working. It's not that hard to check the fuel pressure. It's also funny how you ask if it can be the fuel pressure regulator when another member has already brought that up. With an oversized pump in the year model you have, it can and will damage the regulator like already mentioned. There's no miracle answer out here, the miracle is in your hands and getting to work.
You can't help someone who can't help theirself.
I'm sorry, but anyone and everyone can keep throwing ideas at you but the problem will not fix itself. You need to take your mechanic skills that you say you have, and get to working. It's not that hard to check the fuel pressure. It's also funny how you ask if it can be the fuel pressure regulator when another member has already brought that up. With an oversized pump in the year model you have, it can and will damage the regulator like already mentioned. There's no miracle answer out here, the miracle is in your hands and getting to work.
You can't help someone who can't help theirself.
St Louis SHO
Rollin' coal
This SHO has a lot of problems coming from a member who has wrenched 40-60 hours on it.
I'm sorry, but anyone and everyone can keep throwing ideas at you but the problem will not fix itself. You need to take your mechanic skills that you say you have, and get to working. It's not that hard to check the fuel pressure. It's also funny how you ask if it can be the fuel pressure regulator when another member has already brought that up. With an oversized pump in the year model you have, it can and will damage the regulator like already mentioned. There's no miracle answer out here, the miracle is in your hands and getting to work.
You can't help someone who can't help theirself.
Oh nice. Forgot to say the car hasn't been to me for 2 years... :wave:
Also the 255 was REMOVED in exchange for a stock unit.
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The point is, 40-60 hours of wrench time should produce a healthy SHO. You can do an entire 60k, clutch swap, trans rebuild, suspension overhaul, fuel pump replacement, radiator replacement, and much more in that time. This is why I am surprised with all of the problems, something isn't adding up. It's not pointing fingers to the mechanic, it can be the previous owner not wanting to address and pay for another problem to be fixed. If something is being ignored, who knows what else has and the problems being built up from it.
The 255lph pump can be removed but the damage that can be brought with it being used, would already be done. You can't remove it and expect the problems it can cause in other parts of the fuel system to be eliminated.
St Louis SHO
Rollin' coal
Dude, for one, im not a *******. Let me make this clear:
This car used to be highly modified. It had a 255lph with a shonut regulator. It had a quaifed trans, coilovers, cobra brakes, cams, cowl hood, and all the other trick shit. I put a clutch, gen 3 subframe, coilovers and some other odds and ends while i had it the first time. Then, at that time, for what the PO was going to do with it, I decided he needed another car to start with. So, the PO bought another body. I completely returned this car to stock. Struts, springs, subframe, trans, clutch, fuel system, wheels/tires, brakes, cams, etc. At that time, the maintenence (besides cam seals) was up to date. Ive seen this car a total of 2 times in the last 4 years. Theres the history of the car... Dont jump to conclusions without having all the information.
This car didnt do any of the above when I had it, except the fuel issue. Which only happened once, I shrugged it off as a fluke, but it resurfaced later after the PO drove the car for a few months. Again, I shrugged it off as a cheap fuel pump, which he changed, and the problem went away. It resurfaced later, which we discussed diagnosis, but he needed a reliable DD. He sold the car with said issues, and was honest about the condition of the car. I firmly believe that the fuel issue is the main part of concern here. Me and the new owner have exchanged PM's about how I would go about diagnosing the issue at hand, and he is doing what he can to deal with it. So, with your permission, I will go back in my hole, and be from what i see in your posts, a complete ***** and terrible technician.
Have a nice day.
- James
This car used to be highly modified. It had a 255lph with a shonut regulator. It had a quaifed trans, coilovers, cobra brakes, cams, cowl hood, and all the other trick shit. I put a clutch, gen 3 subframe, coilovers and some other odds and ends while i had it the first time. Then, at that time, for what the PO was going to do with it, I decided he needed another car to start with. So, the PO bought another body. I completely returned this car to stock. Struts, springs, subframe, trans, clutch, fuel system, wheels/tires, brakes, cams, etc. At that time, the maintenence (besides cam seals) was up to date. Ive seen this car a total of 2 times in the last 4 years. Theres the history of the car... Dont jump to conclusions without having all the information.
This car didnt do any of the above when I had it, except the fuel issue. Which only happened once, I shrugged it off as a fluke, but it resurfaced later after the PO drove the car for a few months. Again, I shrugged it off as a cheap fuel pump, which he changed, and the problem went away. It resurfaced later, which we discussed diagnosis, but he needed a reliable DD. He sold the car with said issues, and was honest about the condition of the car. I firmly believe that the fuel issue is the main part of concern here. Me and the new owner have exchanged PM's about how I would go about diagnosing the issue at hand, and he is doing what he can to deal with it. So, with your permission, I will go back in my hole, and be from what i see in your posts, a complete ***** and terrible technician.
Have a nice day.
- James
StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
And James I thank you for ALL of your help. I also want to thank the other members for also helping. Like stated before, I'm an ex- Ford mechanic that has been out of the business all together for 8 yrs now due to a back injury. I don't have the tools I used to have, because I sold most of them to a friend who is still in the business. Not alot of people know about these SHO's. This is why I'm asking questions here, and I'm thankful that strangers that have never met me are glad to help.
MOVING ON~
This is what I've found. I borrowed a fuel pressure gauge from one of the Tech's at work. Much to my surprise, when I hooked it up, primed the pump, the gauge did not move. I double checked it to make sure it was all the way on the schrader valve, and checked to make sure the line to the gauge was not kinked. I started it, it ran really rough. I have 12 psi and the car won't idle. So in conclusion, the pump is either bad, or there is a restriction somewhere, or maybe the regulator is bad. Now it is narrowed down. I'm going to start with the regulator since Steve has said that they've replaced the fuel filter. The confusing part for me is that how can this car run and drive with only 12psi? When I shut the car off, the pressure immediatly goes back to zero. I don't see a leak in the fuel lines anywhere either. So with this, I know what needs to be looked at. I will start from the motor back.
~James~ PM me again please, I would like to know what you think about the regulator, or IF ANYONE has any further input.....I'M ALL EARS! I'm also going to check that sender to look at that wire as well that we talked about.
THANKS IN ADVANCE TO ANY ONE WHO HAS TRIED TO HELP!!!!:thankyou::thankyou::thankyou::thankyou::thankyou::thankyou::thankyou:
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St Louis SHO
Rollin' coal
Regulator is good... check the ground on the sender....
StAnGbAnGeR
NavistarEngTec
Ok will do.......man I can't wait to actually drive this car.
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