still too hot

[Millersho]

Dude, please don't waste your time on this!

The only other thing to try is to get a real coolent tester hooked up to it.

I fought with this for 2 years, until finally one day, my gauge stopped tripping out and now reads on the bottom end of gauge instead of near the top.
I replaced, waterpump, temp sender, termostat, coolent, put coolent cooler, new radiator, etc etc etc etc bla bla bla.

It's your gauge man.
That or there's some air in your coolent system somewhere.

 

[BeatDaSHO]

that's why i was smart and got an electrical gauge. it reads 220 degrees until the fan turns on, then it moves down to 215. and it keeps doing this. i just replaced the radiator, fan, lower radiator hose, and a different thermostat all from another SHO that works fine. Same damn thing. It got all the way up to 220 degrees and then went down to 215. i am so sick of this. i want my damn car back. i checked the dipstick for any coolant and i couldn't see any and i never lose any coolant so i don't think it's a head gasket. The only thing left is bypassing the heater core but you guys say that won't do anything differently. so now what??? i have no SHO now. ever see a man cry before?

Greg

 

[shojuan]

220 degrees doesn't sound excessive.

Rick

 

[sdpatt]

Yes, 220F degrees is excessive. The cooling system on the SHO is designed to be more than capable of maintaining the temperature at the thermostat temperature setting as long as sufficient air flow is provided to the radiator.

BeatDaSHO, you said that, "cruising on the highway... the temperature was between the R and M when it used to be between the L and A." That is the difference between the 190F (88C) thermostat and the 180F (82C) thermostat. If the cooling system is able to maintain the system temperature at the thermostat opening temperature with adequate air flow, then your problem may indeed be the air flow through the radiator.

Has your radiator ever been replaced? Most likely. Check for the foam seal between the A/C condensor and the radiator. This seal is on the right and left sides to channel air through the radiator. Also, is the 3" tall, radiator-width, plastic air dam present under the front of the car? Is the upper radiator bulkhead seal still attached to the underside of the hood? Are your wheel well splash gaurds in place?

You have two situations creating your cooling deficiency. One is the incorrect, high temperature thermostat. Your car requires the 180F version. The second is a limited air flow through the radiator. Check for all of teh air flow management pieces identified above.

 

[BeatDaSHO]

SDPatt.......I used to use the 192 before all of this happened and it ran at the L and A. I actually changed the thermostat last night back to the 180 degree Napa (i know this one is supposed to run cold because i have had it in there before) and the temperature got all the way to 220 degrees still. That is when the fan kicks on. Then it just drops to 215. I put in a different radiator, fan, lower radiator hose last night with no change in temperature. All of those seals that you mentioned are intact. The front air dam is there and the wheel splash gaurds are there. I have no idea what is wrong. I guess i'm going to try another flush. I am going to use the prestone flush this time. Do you just hook it up to the heatcore lines? Do u think it could be clogged somewhere? The only thing left would be a head gasket....but for 120,000 miles, that seems unheard of. please help me out.

Greg

 

[Markus]

I have the 192 degree thermostat and the temp gauge reads between 'A' and 'L' when on the highway with AC off. My cooling fans don't come on until the gauge reads 'R'. I have replaced: radiator, radiator cap, both coolant sensors, all radiator/heater hoses, coolant (50/50 mixture). I'm pretty sure that, when the car was new, the temp gauge never got above 'M' before the fans would come on.

I have concluded that the accuracy (or non-accuracy) of my gauge has changed over the years.

 

[Markus]

Scott, are you sure that there should be two foam seals between the condenser and the radiator? My car has only one. It is on the passenger side of the car.

 

[BeatDaSHO]

there should be two. I know i have two.

Greg

 

[BeatDaSHO]

well today i got the prestone flush Tee thing. I hooked it up to the inlet hose of the heatercore line. Did the flush for about 20 mins with the engine running. After it was done, i disconnected the hose and left the water in there and started it up. It heated all the way to 220 degrees until the fan came on and the thermostat opened and then it went down to 215. NO DIFFERENCE . I don't get it. I am about ready to just get rid of the dang car. does anyone else have any more info because my brother and i are out of ideas and i have tried everything you guys have said but nothing has worked.

Greg

 

[BeatDaSHO]

by the way......i have checked the oil for coolant and found none. And i never lose coolant so i highly doubt it's a head gasket.

Greg

 

[SHOZ]

The fan coming on is normal at 220F. That;'s what the PCM turns it on at. you can easily add an adjustable fan controller for about $25 and turn the fan on at what ever temp you want.

<small>[ September 25, 2002, 08:32 PM: Message edited by: SHOZ ]</small>

 

[DougLee25]

Does everyone understand that no matter how long the fan is on for, if we override it and leave it on for 10 minutes, the temp will not come down??? This is equivalent to riding on the highway at 70 miles per hour. This does NOTHING to bring down the temp. It still runs at 220. We have flushed the ENTIRE cooling system, chaged the pcm, changed radiators, changed coolant temp senders, temp switches, thermostats, radiator hoses, and put in an aftermarket guage. The problem is STILL NOT SOLVED!!!!! Putting an adjustable fan relay will not fix the problem. Even if the temp did come down with the fan on, it would only band-aid the problem. The problem is will still not be fixed. Could a hose somewhere be clogged? I am clueless as to what this problem is. HELP!

Doug

 

[shojuan]

Seriously, 220F does not sound like a problem. Scott is wrong on this one. The thermostat won't even be at full open until 210F. Take your new gauge and hook it up in the same way to Doug's car to confirm the temp reading to give yourself some peace of mind. Note: you *will* see different temperatures if you take the reading from the radiator opening vs. the gauge sender hole vs. the ECT sender hole.

Rick

 

[rangerj]

Beatdasho,

Before you take it out to the back 40 (acres) and shoot it, here are some additional thoughts.

Have you done a pressure test of the system?
Did you replace the radiator cap?
Are your catalitic converters partially clogged and causing back-pressure AND heat?
Are you sucking in air at a hose connection?
Are your brakes dragging due to a caliper piston that will not retract, commonly a cocked piston?
Have you done a compression test on the cylinders for the dreaded possibility of a head gasket problem? It is unlikely, but not impossible!
There are test kits that will tell you if there is exaust gas in the coolant, and are sold at most auto parts stores.
The water pumps impeller could be coated with mineral deposits, and not effectively moving your coolant through the system.
All of these are unusual circumstances that can cause a hotter than normal running temperature. It seems to me that you have addressed all of the usual causes of higher than normal temperatures.
If your radiator had a lot of mineral build up in it, then a chemical cleaner and a "backflush" may not be a bad idea. A back-flush is a pressure flush (garden hose), pushing the water through the system in the opposit direction of its normal flow.
Are your condenser (A/C condenser) fins plugged up and restricting air flow through the radiator?
Lastly, us humans don't think to well when we are in a panic! So, calm down and think! rangerj

 

[rangerj]

Beatdasho,

Before you take it out to the back 40 (acres) and shoot it, here are some additional thoughts.

Have you done a pressure test of the system?
Did you replace the radiator cap?
Are your catalitic converters partially clogged and causing back-pressure AND heat?
Are you sucking in air at a hose connection?
Are your brakes dragging due to a caliper piston that will not retract, commonly a cocked piston?
Have you done a compression test on the cylinders for the dreaded possibility of a head gasket problem? It is unlikely, but not impossible!
There are test kits that will tell you if there is exaust gas in the coolant, and are sold at most auto parts stores.
The water pumps impeller could be coated with mineral deposits, and not effectively moving your coolant through the system.
All of these are unusual circumstances that can cause a hotter than normal running temperature. It seems to me that you have addressed all of the usual causes of higher than normal temperatures.
If your radiator had a lot of mineral build up in it, then a chemical cleaner and a "backflush" may not be a bad idea. A back-flush is a pressure flush (garden hose), pushing the water through the system in the opposit direction of its normal flow.
Are your condenser (A/C condenser) fins plugged up and restricting air flow through the radiator?
Lastly, us humans don't think to well when we are in a panic! So, calm down and think! rangerj

 

[Millersho]

I think your trippin dude.

Everyone is so over tech this issue.

Most engines run around 210 and 220 degrees!

My other car, a Chevy Blazer 4.3 Gen1 vortec (9.5:1 compression), runs at about 215 to 220.

You people are TRIPPIN!
Enjoy your new radiator.

 

[DougLee25]

Sorry Millersho, but I think you need to do a little more studying. Most cars do NOT run at 210 to 220 degrees. None of my cars ever have run this hot. In fact, I've had a '62 Impala with a 427 big block, and it didn't run past 190. The other three SHO's that I have don't even run as hot as my bro's. The SHO's cooling system is very efficient and therefore, should not run at 220 degrees. Something obviously needs attention. How about we trade SHO's then? My bro's for yours if you feel so comfortable? Black on black was always my favorite. thumbs_u

 

[SHOZ123]

Here is the Ford specs for the cooling fan operation.

"
Cooling Fan

The fan control system consists of a two-speed fan on all 3.0L, 3.2L SHO and 3.8L engines with ATX or a one-speed fan on 3.0L SHO engines with an MTX, attached to a fan shroud located behind the radiator. The cooling fan is wired to operate only when the ignition switch is in the RUN position, thereby preventing cooling fan operation after the ignition switch is turned to the OFF position.

The cooling fan is controlled during vehicle operation by the Constant Control Relay Module (CCRM) and Powertrain Control Module (PCM) which will energize the cooling fan under the following conditions:

l Cooling fan is turned on for the 3.0L SHO and on at low speed for 3.0L, 3.2L SHO and 3.8L if:

a. Engine temperature is higher than normal. (Fan starts running at 102°C (215°F) and stops running at 99°C (210°F).

b. A/C is on and vehicle speed does not provide enough natural airflow. (Fan starts running at speeds at or below 69 km/h (43 mph) and stops running at 77 km/h (48 mph).

On 3.0L and 3.2L SHO engines with ATX, low speed cooling fan motor operation is achieved by using a dropping resistor in series with the motor/motors.

The 3.8L uses a dual winding fan motor in which low speed motor operation is achieved through the low speed motor winding circuit (no dropping resistor).

Normal operation and cycling of the engine cooling fan will cause the temperature gauge indicator to read between the mid-point and upper portion of the temperature gauge scale. The slightly higher indicator reading will return to mid-point when fan operation begins."

in addition...

"..when vehicle speed is over 72 km/h (45 mph) and coolant temperature is below 104°C (220°F). The fan will then automatically shut off."

I have a'97 SHO that had the factory 192F t-stat in it. The temps usually ran around 205F-210F in the summer. These are normal temps IMHO.

I put in a 170F t-stat. The car would run at the cooler temp until the heat built up from heat soak or extended driving. I installed the adjustable fan control and now the car runs at the temp that the control turns the fans on, 175F.

On my '93 in the summer the car will run cooler with the A/C on because the fans are on. There is a lot you can do to better control the air flowing through the grill to enhance cooling. The most two of the most benificial changes you can do are a bottom valance panel, which will force all the air entering the grill to either go through the radiator or around to the wheel wells (cooling the brakes). And a front spoiler which forces much more air into the grill area.

My front spoiler is rather crude in this picture but is very effective none the less.

 

[Millersho]

Black on Black is what the SHO should be!! thumbs_u

The thermostat doesn't even kick in until 190!

After that your going to get around 15-30 degree's more then it flatlines, depending on the ambiant temp of course.

He's replaced every gosh dang part in the cooling system!! Unless there's air in the line somewhere, that could be causing it.

 

[aberdeenSHO]

I had the same problem with my car... does your a/c overheat it all the way? i had the fluctuating temperature like you... The only thing i can think of is my cats are bad. Which i've been told that by one person that looked in them, and another guy said they were fine. But i've seen a few people on here with this problem and i've never heard of anyone looking at their exhaust as a fix. I replaced the water pump, head gasket, thermostat.... the fan comes on at the right time blablabla... I am almost positive now that it's my catalytics but i don't even want to dump another penny into the car... It's an awesome car but i can't deal with looking at the temp gauge more than my speedometer or the road for that matter cuz i'm so worried about overheating. If you keep the car check the cats... i don't know much about cars but that is the ONLY thing i can think of that no one has tried to look at with this problem. and i have heard that they will overheat a car so good luck with yours i can't stand it anymore as nice a car as it is... btw what do you all think of the 2000 monte carlo SS. i can get a good deal on one through my family? how are they with reliability and all with that 3.8 liter?