New Purchase - Advice needed!

[theanomaly20]

hello all!

I'm going to look at a 2010 sho with 68k miles this weekend with strong intention to buy and was looking for a little advice. The carfax is clean and shows service records for every 4k miles or so.

I've negotiated a great price but keep reading about issues with the transmissions. Can anyone chime in to help clear up my concern?

My questions:
Do all 2010 sho's have transmission problems?
I read that there were several tsbs out for the transmission issues, do those completely fix the issue?
Is the tsb work out of pocket or covered like a defect? And how much did it cost you if you had it done?
I'm thinking maybe I can call a dealer, give them the vin, and see if any tsbs have been logged for the transmission. What do you guys think?

Really hoping I can figure this out so I can join the sho community on friday! Any help is greatly appreciated!

Sean

 

[SHOdded]

Welcome, and good luck in your search for that perfect SHO Glad you are doing your research first! If the color is CINNAMON, you will be getting a rare one

1. No, all 2010 SHOs do not have transmission problems. If there are enough reported incidents, a TSB or a recall is issued. One of the major flaws has been believing Ford's initial fluid change interval of 150,000 miles. That is total bunk. Maybe if they are mostly highway miles and you do 30K plus a year ... The older recommendations of 60K fluid exchange (no FLUSH, since filters are not replaceable) is better. I would be more concerned about the PTU and RDU though, overall, and make sure those fluids are exchanged along with that of the transmission.
   
2. I will leave this up to folks who have had trans work done to fill in.
3. TSB (purely an advisory bulletin) work has no correlation with warranty. If you have existing warranty that covers the parts involved, then yes the TSB is covered.
4. Great idea! I don't know how many will be upfront over the phone. They might do that if you are in the salesroom negotiating with them, but even then the probability is low. They are supposed to have done recalls prior to sale (it is the law), but I see enough people reporting that that is not true. Sometimes dealers are slack, and sometimes parts are not yet available. What you want is an OASIS report (part of the Ford reporting system), but that will only cover work done at a dealership. The TSB may have been performed elsewhere, and if they did not report to Carfax/Autocheck/etc. you will have to depend on maintenance records that came with the vehicle.

I always look for an existing OEM warranty, preferably a year or longer at the time of purchase of the vehicle. If this SHO has an extended warranty such as ESP/Protect Premiumcare to 100,000 miles, that would be a real +. If there is no warranty, you should have it inspected at an independent mechanic familiar with turbocharged cars prior to sale. If that is not an option, walk away. WITH warranty, at least you have time to have things looked over. The only real way to check the car out thoroughly is on a lift.

 

[StealBlueSho]

Call the Ted Britt Ford, Chantilly, Virginia and talk to the service reps. They are awesome, I have called them several times with VIN numbers so they can tell me what all has been addressed with the vehicle. Just be up front with them about buying a Ford and wanting to know if it has been taken care off...

 

[theanomaly20]

Thank you so much for the detailed answer! I really appreciate it. I'm guessing you have a cinnamon girl?
This one is black on black, seems to be the most common combo, but I'm ok with that.

1. the carfax shows that the transmission was flushed around 34k, so I'm taking that as a good sign the car was cared for. I've read about the importance of the ptu and rdu fluid changes but not sure I fully understand what they are. Is ptu lubricant for the turbos and rdu the rear different fluid? at 68k I'm guessing that should be on the quick list of things to do if I purchase.

2. hopefully someone can chime in!

3. unfortunately at 68k there is no longer factory warranty and I'm leaning towards not getting an extended one due to added cost. I'm a mechanical engineer that's spent a good amount of time under older cars so I feel confident I can handle at least general issues. I don't want to rebuild the transmission though!

4. the carfax shows routine, even conservative fluid change intervals and one tsb repair for the license plate lamp assembly. I went with StealBlueSho's recommendation and called Ted Britt Ford (thank you for the recommendation!) and asked for any info they could give me. he verified the lamp assembly repair and told me the vehicle had new injectors installed in 9/14. no transmissions issues reported, and no other issues except that license plate assembly recall still being open. but that would be a free fix.

I definitely agree about finding a vehicle with a warranty. if I could afford one with lower miles still in the warranty range I'd be all over it, but at this time 2010 68k with no warranty is what I can afford. I'm going to see what shops are near the dealer and see if I can arrange a diagnostic. I have a buddy that knows a guy with a dyno shop in the area so I may see if he's willing to look at it. I'll call his shop when they open tomorrow.

Thanks again for the responses guys! I've got until Friday to think about it before I drive up to deal. I'm open to other suggestions/opinions on things to look out for in the meantime. trying to convince myself it's low risk so I can be cruising in my new to me SHO this weekend

 

[SHOdded]

The SHO is an AWD vehicle, so it needs to have some way of controlling power output to all 4 wheels. That's why it has two differentials, the front differential (the PTU or Power Takeoff Unit/Power Transfer Unit), and the rear differential (the RDU, or Rear Differential Unit). The PTU is the command center for power transfer. Due to the AWD being primarily a FWD platform, power is sent to the front wheels only, 90% of the time. This puts a HUGE amount of workload on the PTU, which is not that big of a unit, and to top it off only holds about 18 ounces of fluid. Compare that to the nearly 350 ounces the transmission holds or the 36 ounces the RDU holds and you begin to see the concern.

The RDU, not being under so much stress and having more lubricant to keep it cool, is much less of a problem.

Most people will change BOTH the RDU and PTU fluid at the same time though, to be on the conservative side and extend the units' lives. Ford very thoughtfully has designed them both with only a fill plug (!). So you drain and fill through the fill hole. These two I would change out right away.

As far as warranty goes, look up online pricing at floodfordesp.com. Plan that into your budget for the future. One repair (powertrain or electronics) will recoup the cost of the warranty. That's just my 2 cents worth. If you can do most things handson, more power to you, I would love to see that. The turbos would be a possible area of concern, but I think they are covered under emissions warranty, you might want to confirm with Ford (or the Ted Britt dealership). 7/70 I think.

 

[theanomaly20]

Thank you for that SHOdded! I couldn't find a good explanation anywhere else I was looking and your write up was perfect! I need to look up the procedure to see if I want to do it myself but for the heck of it I called around to get costs.

Ford wants 200 just for the PTU fluid but I called a well respected shop in town and they'll do the PTU for 95 or both the PTU and RDU for about 150. so that's not too bad.

I checked out the extended warranty site and it won't let me enter 2010, just back to 2011. maybe it's not an option anymore, too old? idk.

I'm a little worried about the life of the turbos but I'm not sure how to check that. I asked the ford dealer what the used car diagnostic covers and he said it was a long list of normal wear and tear stuff. I asked if hey looked at the shape of the turbos or anything in depth and nada. I may try a speed shop but again, not sure how they could diagnose the health of the turbos.

 

[SHOdded]

Mainly they would look through the plumbing for any signs of oil leaks that would signal issues with the turbos. Also leaks from the turbo oil feed lines.

Check out lombardfordwarrantys.com, anderson koch, and zieglers as alternate online dealer sites.

 

[StealBlueSho]

Yea, the 2010s were the first run of the gen 4's...the the list of TSBs goes on forever lol... I know... I have one

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[theanomaly20]

So you think a ford dealer would do a thorough enough inspection? or would you take it to a small shop? leaks would really only require new seals or hoses right? I wouldn't think it would signal the turbos have other issues.

Thanks for the suggestions, Ill take a look at them after work tonight.

Haha don't tell me that StealBlueSho! have you had many issues with your vehicle? specifically past the 60k mileage mark. I'm hoping that this vehicle having 68k and no record of commonly reported issues (Trans, leaks, etc.) I may have just found "a good one". I guess you haven't tried to steer me away yet, my desire to own a sho takes that as a good sign

 

[SHOdded]

The seal I refer to is internal to the turbo, so it would have to be disassembled, inspected, resealed and reassembled. Not worth the expense. So what you DON'T want to see is any oil pooling in the turbo housing when you pull the pipe off.

As to where to take it, IDK where you are located, but generally I look for a shop with good reviews, non-dealership just because of the rates, unless the dealer service dept has a very good reputation. If you are planning to pursue buying a Ford warranty right away, I would skip the turbo inspection entirely. The warranty people are going to do an inspection prior to approving the warranty, they won't get into that much.

Not to scare you off, but this is a fact: the main concern is to make sure the car has not been in an accident that is not reflected on the Carfax, and any accidents have been repaired properly. We have had at least one case recently where a SHO buyer was terribly misled about the condition of his vehicle, and when extensive damage was discovered after the fact, the warranty was not honored.

 

[StealBlueSho]

Haha don't tell me that StealBlueSho! have you had many issues with your vehicle? specifically past the 60k mileage mark. I'm hoping that this vehicle having 68k and no record of commonly reported issues (Trans, leaks, etc.) I may have just found "a good one". I guess you haven't tried to steer me away yet, my desire to own a sho takes that as a good sign

So... No issues yet.. just windshield cracking a couple times... But I am **** about maintenance... And it sits in the garage because it's not my DD...

51K miles on the car so I couldn't help you with longevity concerns, however I have had very fluid flush out of this car at 50K... And plugs replaced..etc..

Lots of guys have high mileage that might chime in...

SHOdded is a wealth of good recommendations and knowledge... Listen to him and you should do OK

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[rubydist]

while I historically have not been a fan of extended warranties, I have changed my thinking over the past few years. you can buy a good Ford warranty for less than $3k. the average repair bill on any vehicle that needs repair work (repairs, not maintenance) is nearly $3k. that means that if you have just one issue over the period of the warranty, you broke even, and if you have more than one, you are ahead. btw, turbocharged cars have higher than average repair bills.

so, it depends on how long you plan to keep this vehicle, but many people would rather spend the $3k and know they are protected than chance a big bill at any random time.

 

[theanomaly20]

I appreciate the advice SHOdded. I contacted a shop with a lot of great reviews in the area and they are going to do an inspection for me that will at least check the frame for any damage, look for any repairs and run the vin for tsbs and any history, check the electronics, suspension, etc. that sounds like as good as I can get without starting to tear things apart. I would love to get a warranty but don't think I can pick up the extra cost right now. Unfortunate, I paid for it on my last ford and I'm trading it in with some extended warranty still intact.

Poor guy...hope they were able to figure something out...

StealBlueSHO, glad to hear you'll be getting years of fun out of that garage queen
I checked with a shop in town and was quoted $95 to change the PTU fluid and about $150 to do both PTU and RDU fluid, so that's not too bad of a bill to make sure it's off to a fresh start.

I'm with you rubydist, I did the extended warranty with my current vehicle, I like safety nets. I don't think I can make the deal work plus a warranty right now though. I'm going to explore those sites mentioned earlier and see what the most aggressive rate I can get is. If I can make it work, I'll go warranty!

 

[theanomaly20]

The more I read about potential issues the more a $2k warranty sounds like a likely hit to my savings...I really wanted to avoid it but it may be inevitable. it looks like I can purchase one at anytime though as long as the vehicle doesn't have a known issue that will fail inspection. so maybe I can give it a few months as a wallet buffer.

I'm going to see if the extended warranty I purchased for my current vehicle, also a ford, can be cashed in to help offset the new one. what is the consensus on coverage level for the plans? they seem to offer four levels, powertrain only up to most everything. I figure electronic coverage would be nice so I'm leaning towards maybe the second to top option, for as long as I can afford. what do you guys think?

 

[rubydist]

yes, you can get a pro-rated refund on a Ford warranty that you cancel early.

you want either the top or next to the top, because you are more likely to have a computer failure than a drive-train failure in my experience.

 

[StealBlueSho]

yes, you can get a pro-rated refund on a Ford warranty that you cancel early.

you want either the top or next to the top, because you are more likely to have a computer failure than a drive-train failure in my experience.

Really? When you say computer does that include sensors? I see more ptu, turbo, and lately water pump failures on the forums?

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[rubydist]

keep in mind I'm looking across the model line, not just at EcoBoost vehicles, but yes electrical stuff is more likely to fail in my experience.

 

[StealBlueSho]

keep in mind I'm looking across the model line, not just at EcoBoost vehicles, but yes electrical stuff is more likely to fail in my experience.

Haha, you sound like my best friend who is a mechanic for Ford... Everytime I start to ask him a question he cuts me off and says it's probably a one of "those electrical boards that controls ****"...

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[theanomaly20]

Looks like I can get about $400 back out of my current warranty so that definitely helps. zeigler appears to be giving me the best deal so far. lombard isn't far behind, flood isn't an option because they won't take older than 2011. the extracare plans seem to have the powertrain covered well, and the turbos which I worried about. but they don't seem very extensive on the elctronics. is that right or am I missing something?

 

[SHOdded]

http://www.factoryplans.com/assets/cms/files/brochure_FordESPPlanOptions.pdf