Headgasket Finally Went

[Shamwow]

Looks like SHO Source came through with the ARP head stud kits! I ordered one today.

http://www.shosource.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=61_43_78&products_id=747

 

[Dirk37]

After talking with my dad about some things I think I'm going to downgrade turbo sho back to normal sho for the time being. I need a reliable vehicle for school and work and don't want the headgasket to blow again. In the mean time, I'm planning to get the 3.2 I have lying around built with forged pistons and cometic gaskets and get the mitsubishi transmission swap figured out. Then hopefully I can finally have 500 hp somewhat reliably.

 

[luigisho]

After talking with my dad about some things I think I'm going to downgrade turbo sho back to normal sho for the time being. I need a reliable vehicle for school and work and don't want the headgasket to blow again. In the mean time, I'm planning to get the 3.2 I have lying around built with forged pistons and cometic gaskets and get the mitsubishi transmission swap figured out. Then hopefully I can finally have 500 hp somewhat reliably.

I think 500hp on a 220 car and have it be reliable is a tough road to ***. Get another car for boost and keep one for regular driving. As for this car, you don't know what keeps failing so get the 3.2 swapped in to drive and if the block is a later one you can bore it over to fit forged pistons if you can get the mating surface right. Otherwise get another 3.2 somewhere

 

[shopartsnw]

Looks like SHO Source came through with the ARP head stud kits! I ordered one today.

http://www.shosource.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=61_43_78&products_id=747

Thank you for the post. I will get picture up on the site as soon as we have a set in hand.

Mike

 

[yamahaSHO]

Stick with the stock gaskets. They've been proven for many years at high power and if you switch to an MLS, your RA requirements on your heads and deck become more important.

 

[Dirk37]

Stick with the stock gaskets.

The only gaskets I can find for the 3.2 are the cometic ones. I'd have the block and heads decked on this 3.2 build so the surfaces shouldn't be a problem.

 

[luigisho]

The only gaskets I can find for the 3.2 are the cometic ones. I'd have the block and heads decked on this 3.2 build so the surfaces shouldn't be a problem.

right. Previous post stated downgrade current engine to n/a to drive for school. I recommended pulling the current engine and putting the 3.2 in because it should not have head gasket failing mating surfaces. Then take the bad block and rebuild it for boost later or get another while this car is still driveable.

If you want a 500hp daily driver and you are in school this is not the car. A 500hp GenI/II is a hobby car not a daily driver from what I have seen since owning my first car in the late 90's to today.

 

[Dirk37]

The headgasket in the current motor lasted about 2 weeks, it blew the night after I rebuilt my turbo and really got on it. I think it has something to do with boost which is why I'm going back to N/A for a while. The 3.2 I have needs a lot of work which is why I don't want to swap it in right now.

I've daily driven the car for the past 4 years, 2 of which it has been turbod, and this is the first time its really let me down. I know its not the most wise idea but I want to do it anyways.

 

[yamahaSHO]

The only gaskets I can find for the 3.2 are the cometic ones. I'd have the block and heads decked on this 3.2 build so the surfaces shouldn't be a problem.

Verify with the machine shop what RA they can achieve. I had to send my heads out on my Subaru as nobody local could get the finish smooth enough.

 

[luigisho]

Now that you mention RA (average roughness)-- from what I remember (maybe faulty), Cometic head gaskets are very finicky about mating surfaces and they have to be very smooth and tight to work well.

 

[black92]

I always though cutting the deck and heads was not suggested because it changes timing. Input on this guys?

 

[Dirk37]

It won't change timing but it will raise compression slightly. If the compression is bumped enough though it could require a reduction in timing to prevent pinging.

 

[luigisho]

I always though cutting the deck and heads was not suggested because it changes timing. Input on this guys?

It's been a long time and I've only had my heads shaved once waayy back maybe early 2000's. Didn't have alot of material removed so I didn't notice it running worse. Although it ran like crap before I had it done so there is that. Used to have some of this archived on the forum long time ago about how much could be removed and timing and possible change to interference vs stock noninterference. I can't remember the details but they were discussed some time ago

 

[yamahaSHO]

It won't change timing but it will raise compression slightly. If the compression is bumped enough though it could require a reduction in timing to prevent pinging.

It will alter cam/crank timing.

 

[Dirk37]

It will alter cam/crank timing.

Will it change timing enough to effect anything?


Would you guys recommend building a 3.0 or a 3.2? Seems to be more parts for the 3.2 but the only headgaskets available are cometic ones from shosource. It doesn't say if they're MLS or not so I emailed them asking.

Edit: Mike at shosource replied (Very quickly I must add) and said "The gaskets are CFM-20 which is a perforated stainless steel with fiber reinforcing. This material is very similar to the factory gasket material."

Sounds like a 3.2 would be the best thing to build.

 

[Devin]

3.2 has more parts? That statement surprises me. I always thought 3.2 owners got the short end of the stick.

 

[sperold]

I have both a 3.0 and a 3.2 in a manual transmission car, it might be just me, but I don't sense a difference. But full disclosure, the 3.2 car has an aluminum flywheel, so the driving experience is quite different, especially the initial pull away from a full stop.

I would not rule out a 3.0 because it is smaller in displacement. Nor, would I rule out a 3.2, if that is what my parts bin favoured.
I have never heard that one engine is more reliable than the other, so that is not an issue.

If your car is a 3.0 now, I would stick with a 3.0 as a replacement. Too many parts are different between the 2 engines, right down to the exhaust manifolds.

 

[luigisho]

If oem head gaskets are still available for 3.0 then I would go that route for safety. I would prefer the extra displacement but having to sweat the HG especially with boost isn't worth the aggravation. However, that is all just conjecture with no data to support that choice.

 

[yamahaSHO]

Will it change timing enough to effect anything?

Not likely, but it gets worse the more you take off from the heads and/or deck. I didn't worry about it with my SHO, but on my STi, I got some adjustable idler pulleys as it affects each head in the opposite direction.

 

[Shamwow]

Back to the failure... why not pull it again and see what happened? Kind of interested to know

1) how did you prep the block? Scraper? Sand paper? Check for flatness?
2) did you coat the cometic gaskets with anything?
3) did you clean the bolt holes before installing?
4) use a good torque wrench?
5) did the machine shop check the head for cracks? Did they deck the heads?

Really dont want to have the same result as you did..