Using 87, is 93 worth it?

[Ecoboost_xsport]

Well, the saying for today is sh*t happens. I took @Ta2dResqr's advise and googled for 93 Octane gas stations near me, nothing in my county. Closest one is in Oakland California about an hour away. At about 6 PM I set out for Oakland in search of that sweet sweet 93. After an hour or more of driving I arrive to find that they have 87, 89, 91 AND ****** 100. So Im sitting there, thinking about why would anybody be needing 100 Octane, but I am not one to give up easily. The next nearest place is THE Sonoma Raceway (It was closer then Oakland I was just nervous to go there). So I set off for Sonoma Raceway, after another hour I get there and I am immediately greeted by security who are confused about a 16 year old kid asking for 93 Octane at 8 PM. Regardless they let me check out the pumps behind the entrance and I kid you not, then had EVERY SINGLE TYPE OF GAS OTHER THEN 93. IM TALKING 116 to 91, but 93 was no where to be seen. I didn't intend to buy any since I had to fill up at Oakland since I had enough to make it there from my house and planned to fill on 93 but that did not happen. Anyway Ill be running 91 instead of 87 for the time being.. but I refuse to be defeated.

Welcome to California. Where do you live? I'm in Sacramento. There isn't any 93, at standard gas stations, anywhere in CA that I'm aware of.

As for 100, we have one station that sells it at the pump here and some places sell it at the pump, though that's more common at race tracks. Most people buy it in small barrels. It's pricey though.

I didn't read all the responses, so I apologize if I'm rehashing what's been stated already, but essentially the higher in octane you go the less you will have engine knock. Engine knock causes the computer to retard the engine, losing power. Higher octane, less knock, the more you can advance timing, creating more power. This all has a limit, though. The higher octane fuels should really have a tune used for. The factory "window" the car operates in is pretty narrow and a tune will open that up.

You could cheat slightly by adding a bit of e85, but you have to be careful. Too much and the car won't run right, if at all. E85 has a higher octane (~108) but also has a different AFR requirement than reg gas and adding too much will shift that out of the computers ability to compensate. Anything over e30 (30% ethanol to 70% gas) will require a tune.

Or you can be like me and just convert it over to completely run on e85. Lots of power, a decent availability in California, but you'll get ****** MPG.

 

[kryptto]

Welcome to California. Where do you live? I'm in Sacramento. There isn't any 93, at standard gas stations, anywhere in CA that I'm aware of.

As for 100, we have one station that sells it at the pump here and some places sell it at the pump, though that's more common at race tracks. Most people buy it in small barrels. It's pricey though.

I didn't read all the responses, so I apologize if I'm rehashing what's been stated already, but essentially the higher in octane you go the less you will have engine knock. Engine knock causes the computer to retard the engine, losing power. Higher octane, less knock, the more you can advance timing, creating more power. This all has a limit, though. The higher octane fuels should really have a tune used for. The factory "window" the car operates in is pretty narrow and a tune will open that up.

You could cheat slightly by adding a bit of e85, but you have to be careful. Too much and the car won't run right, if at all. E85 has a higher octane (~108) but also has a different AFR requirement than reg gas and adding too much will shift that out of the computers ability to compensate. Anything over e30 (30% ethanol to 70% gas) will require a tune.

Or you can be like me and just convert it over to completely run on e85. Lots of power, a decent availability in California, but you'll get ****** MPG.

Thanks for that explanation, I was stating that as well. You however explained the part I didn't.

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[kryptto]

I live in Sacramento, they don't have 93 anywhere that I'm aware of, but there is one single station with 100 at the pump. It's a Flyers gas station that sells Sonoco 100oct Race Gas at the pump....it's pricey though.

Thanks for all the work you do blogging how to improve this platform. (Hats Off)

 

[MaxxLE]

Welcome to California. Where do you live? I'm in Sacramento. There isn't any 93, at standard gas stations, anywhere in CA that I'm aware of.

As for 100, we have one station that sells it at the pump here and some places sell it at the pump, though that's more common at race tracks. Most people buy it in small barrels. It's pricey though.

I didn't read all the responses, so I apologize if I'm rehashing what's been stated already, but essentially the higher in octane you go the less you will have engine knock. Engine knock causes the computer to retard the engine, losing power. Higher octane, less knock, the more you can advance timing, creating more power. This all has a limit, though. The higher octane fuels should really have a tune used for. The factory "window" the car operates in is pretty narrow and a tune will open that up.

You could cheat slightly by adding a bit of e85, but you have to be careful. Too much and the car won't run right, if at all. E85 has a higher octane (~108) but also has a different AFR requirement than reg gas and adding too much will shift that out of the computers ability to compensate. Anything over e30 (30% ethanol to 70% gas) will require a tune.

Or you can be like me and just convert it over to completely run on e85. Lots of power, a decent availability in California, but you'll get ****** MPG.

I live in San Rafael in Marin County just north of SF, just about an hour and a half from Sacramento. Thank you for the advise I am gonna look into E85.

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

I live in San Rafael in Marin County just north of SF, just about an hour and a half from Sacramento. Thank you for the advise I am gonna look into E85.

Be advised, you can't just put full e85 into the SHO. If you don't have a Flex Fuel vehicle, it will likely not run at all, or at least run like crap. As mentioned, you can mix UP TO e30 without doing anything, any more than that, you'll need a tune. And if you're going to go full e85, you'll need a tune AND a few upgraded parts.

 

[Greg2013SHO]

I raised my own octane question last year. The dealer gave me the OK for regular in the 2013 non-PP SHO he sold me. Premium maybe every 4th tank the clean things out. I did that for years and got an average of 23 MPG. But I asked the Forum after hearing scattered advice. The responses might have been over-eagerness but I did premium-only for this past year. Performance certainly feels better but more diagnostically my MPG has been 25-27 over the same roads. I stretched one tank from Montgomery AL to Lafayette LA. I wouldn’t do that usually but it was at the end of a long trip and I wanted to get home quick. Traffic was light.

I've had no problem finding 93 octane.

BTW I posted the topic of using the car’s trip read-out vs. my own gallons-used against miles-driven. It can be off by a gallon or more from what I actually pump in. I believe only what I compute by hand.

 

[zak]

Your twin turbo SHO engine was probably stock tuned for 91 octane anyway, since 93 isn't available everywhere particularly at higher elevations. Just put 91 in you will get more spark advance and likely a couple psi higher max boost pressure - once your octane sensor picks up on the improvement.

 

[Greg2013SHO]

Your twin turbo SHO engine was probably stock tuned for 91 octane anyway, since 93 isn't available everywhere particularly at higher elevations. Just put 91 in you will get more spark advance and likely a couple psi higher max boost pressure - once your octane sensor picks up on the improvement.

I'll give it a try. Thanks!!

 

[zak]

Just mix the 100 octane with the 91 octane to get 93. Probably only need 3 gallons or so of the 100.

 

[kryptto]

OK boys and girls, not close to the house 35-40 mins away. So my tune is for 92, though we have 93. I just don't trust quality. So if I want to mix this what do I do? I get I need to talk to my tuner, since the ratios will change. Any veteran suggestions?

I am using this calculator: http://www.bazellracefuels.com/Calcs/OC1.htm



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[luigisho]

I think you have to use mixing math calc. THere is no physical tester for octane that isn't an octane test with an engine running it as far as I remember.

Like this https://cfrengines.com/octane-rating-unit/

 

[MaxxLE]

Your twin turbo SHO engine was probably stock tuned for 91 octane anyway, since 93 isn't available everywhere particularly at higher elevations. Just put 91 in you will get more spark advance and likely a couple psi higher max boost pressure - once your octane sensor picks up on the improvement.

How long does it take for it to pick up on it?

 

[David Klopper]

I’ve found that a fairly easy way to get to around 93/94 octane is to mix 14 gallons of 91 + 3 gallons of E85 to get a full tank. It should keep you below E20 levels (depending on how much ethanol is in your 91).

Here’s a good blend calculator: http://www.wallaceracing.com/ethanol-mix-calc.php

On the subject of ways to increase octane, has anyone tried BOOSTane? Looks like it would actually be cheaper than adding race gas.

 

[kryptto]

On the subject of ways to increase octane, has anyone tried BOOSTane?

So I had done some poking around in the past about BOOSTane and other MMT additives. The same two items come up - cats get clogged - which I don't have - and burns up spark plugs. AS with any additive - use modestly.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/lets-talk-about-mmt-octane-boosters.61670/

 

[Cheesehead]

Not sure if you can get it in California lol I feel sorry for you guys, but I use 91 octane ethanol free gas with 3 gallons of E-85 on top and it's wakes the car right up, especially with my tune. Worth every penny

 

[kryptto]

Not sure if you can get it in California lol I feel sorry for you guys, but I use 91 octane ethanol free gas with 3 gallons of E-85 on top and it's wakes the car right up, especially with my tune. Worth every penny

 

[Ta2dResqr]

Not sure if you can get it in California lol I feel sorry for you guys, but I use 91 octane ethanol free gas with 3 gallons of E-85 on top and it's wakes the car right up, especially with my tune. Worth every penny

Out of curiosity, is the 91 ethanol free more expensive? It is here in Ohio. If it is, why do you use it? The main benefit of ethanol-free is for marine/small engines/Powersports. Anywhere that it will be stored for extended periods of time or that it will be in wet/humid environments. 91 octane ethanol free is the same octane as 91 with up to 10% ethanol (regular 91 gas). By mixing in E85, you are taking all of the benefits of ethanol-free gas away. The only tiny advantage I can see is one less variable in your math (not knowing if it is 10% or 7%).

 

[Cheesehead]

Ethanol free 91 is about the same price as 91 with ethanol and the one station in the area that has 93 with ethanol. So with 3 gallons of E-85 I am saving a little money on the last 3 gallons I put in. For some reason I get better gas mileage (21 as compared to 19) when I do this mix. Straight up 91 ethanol free I can get 23. To be honest it's a convenience factor. Kwik Trip's all over town have both 91 ethanol free and E-85 so I just do that. I am going to get an octane sensor and that will give me an accurate reading. Until then it's all guesswork lol. But once I get the sensor I will get an e-30 tune and maybe a fuel pump.

 

[Ta2dResqr]

Ethanol free 91 is about the same price as 91 with ethanol and the one station in the area that has 93 with ethanol. So with 3 gallons of E-85 I am saving a little money on the last 3 gallons I put in. For some reason I get better gas mileage (21 as compared to 19) when I do this mix. Straight up 91 ethanol free I can get 23. To be honest it's a convenience factor. Kwik Trip's all over town have both 91 ethanol free and E-85 so I just do that. I am going to get an octane sensor and that will give me an accurate reading. Until then it's all guesswork lol. But once I get the sensor I will get an e-30 tune and maybe a fuel pump.

That must be nice. I do not know if it is because of the water around us and being able to charge more for the boaters or what but, our ethanol-free 90 octane is about $1 more than regular 87 octane or $0.40 more than premium 93 octane.

 

[Cheesehead]

That must be nice. I do not know if it is because of the water around us and being able to charge more for the boaters or what but, our ethanol-free 90 octane is about $1 more than regular 87 octane or $0.40 more than premium 93 octane.

Still not cheap around $4.15 per gallon but it is what it is I guess