shifting into first and reverse is next to impossible

[HoustinoJillian]

ok here's the scenario: 95 mtx, and its very hard to get into reverse... to get into first its a good shove and then it clicks in, but its not easy, to get into reverse its almost impossible, the only way to do it without grinding the gears and not ging in is if the car is at a dead stop(well duh on that part) i put it in first, neutral, clutch out, clutch in, first, reverse. anything different and it usually doesn't go, even if the car is started from cold after being parked in first, anything i can do to fix this?

 

[FordLover]

after my 3rd MTX SHO, I've found that using 3rd rather than any other forward gear, then moving straight back and over into reverse works better than any other method I've tried. For first? usually I move it into first before I come to a complete stop (rolling ever so slightly).
Basically it sounds like it's clutch time to me if your having alot of difficulty. Also the longer you go 'making it work' you will wear out other parts that are more expensive and difficult to do than the clutch.

 

[bradman]

As already mentioned, it sounds like you need a clutch. If you keep grinding you'll damage the tranny internals. If you need to nurse it along until you can do the clutch job, you might try turning the car off, putting it in reverse, then restarting. If it works, it's better than grinding all the time.

 

[PROPHET]

Reverse is tricky on almost any car, first should be easy.

Like stated before at a slow roll to a stop going into first seems to be the smoothest way to do it.

Unfortunately for you it seems like clutch replacement time.

 

[HoustinoJillian]

i'd have to disagree, its not grinding like its time to replace the clutch, let me rephrase my question. for first, it's always been hard to get the car into gear, but its not actually getting ti in gear thats the problem, its like the rod gets stuck on something, the problem doesnt seem ot be with the clutch and engaging gears itself. for going into reverse, i didnt mean grinding, its the noise when.. i dont know how to word this... whatever engages with reverse is spinning forward, and reverse is not, so it does not engage, not a grinding as much as some other sound thats like 2 gears going opposite ways just barely touching. the clutch is fine, there is no slippage or anything, and this car has been like this for as long as i can remember, just wondering if there's any other piece, like the guide for the rod or something, that could have gotten loose, or if i could adjust the synchros, or something, because i shouldnt have to click/shove first in. again, its not the gear thats the problem, but almost like it's getting stuck on the path from neutral to gear. hope that made some sense

 

[masho95]

i'd have to disagree, its not grinding like its time to replace the clutch, let me rephrase my question. for first, it's always been hard to get the car into gear, but its not actually getting ti in gear thats the problem, its like the rod gets stuck on something, the problem doesnt seem ot be with the clutch and engaging gears itself.

Do you know the prior history of the car, like when the clutch was last replaced? Having it going into gear hard is not normal, and perhaps the clutch has been slowly going out on you since you got it.

for going into reverse, i didnt mean grinding, its the noise when.. i dont know how to word this... whatever engages with reverse is spinning forward, and reverse is not, so it does not engage, not a grinding as much as some other sound thats like 2 gears going opposite ways just barely touching.

That would be a description of gears grinding.

the clutch is fine, there is no slippage or anything, and this car has been like this for as long as i can remember, just wondering if there's any other piece, like the guide for the rod or something, that could have gotten loose, or if i could adjust the synchros, or something, because i shouldnt have to click/shove first in. again, its not the gear thats the problem, but almost like it's getting stuck on the path from neutral to gear. hope that made some sense

Sounds like a problem with the 1/2 synchro too. I reinstalled my 1/2 synchro with the alignment tabs not lined up on the synchro and it felt the same as yours did. It was like there was something blocking the path on the way into first gear and even when it felt like it was in gear I would let up the clutch and the shifter would just pop back into neutral. You probably don't have a problem with a mis-aligned synchro but it could be on it's way out the door along with the clutch. The synchro's themselves can't be adjusted and to replace them you need to remove the transmission from the car and open the case halves.

There isn't really anything on the rod shifter either to adjust. But you may want to check the rear of the shifter where the black box is. The shifter is supposed to slide back and forth at the rear. There are two white blocks that slide back and forth on a metal plate. If you think your are mechanically inclined enough I would say remove the rod shifter and clean and **** the white slider blocks.

 

[HoustinoJillian]

sounds like a plan, i'll give that a look this weekend, my dad has had this car or a long time, before that it was a coworkers company car. my dad's been driving manual cars since he had his license, and SHOS for over 10 years, so trust me, when he says its not the clutch, it is not the clutch. i'm betting its sonething like the misaligned 1/2 synchro, because this would keep it from sliding into first easy, and since reverse is designed so that you ahve to lign up the synchros by putting it into first, this would also be the problem for having it give me grief about getting into reverse. i'll take a look this weekend, and let you all know whats going on, i could be dead wrong, but for now i'll stick with what my dad(daily driver of the car for about ~6 or so years) says about the clutch.

 

[masho95]

my dad has had this car or a long time, before that it was a coworkers company car. my dad's been driving manual cars since he had his license, and SHOS for over 10 years, so trust me, when he says its not the clutch, it is not the clutch.

Just because he's drove manuals for a long time doesn't make him a mechanic. So if he's had the car that long when's the last time the clutch was changed.

i'm betting its sonething like the misaligned 1/2 synchro, because this would keep it from sliding into first easy, and since reverse is designed so that you ahve to lign up the synchros by putting it into first, this would also be the problem for having it give me grief about getting into reverse. i'll take a look this weekend, and let you all know whats going on, i could be dead wrong, but for now i'll stick with what my dad(daily driver of the car for about ~6 or so years) says about the clutch.

I seriously doubt it's a misaligned synchro as the only way it can be misaligned is if it was installed wrong. And I'm sure you would have noticed the problem as soon as the transmission work was done. Reverse gear isn't synchronized which is why it requires you to put the car in a forward gear before trying to shift to reverse. You should be able to engage reverse without ANY noise by shifting it into a forward gear first... any of them not just first.

I'd put my bets that you have a blocking ring/synchro problem combined with a clutch going out.

 

[masho95]

Here are the actual instructions that come with the car to get it into reverse.

 

[HoustinoJillian]

i don't need instructions on how to shift into reverse, thank you
this :

I seriously doubt it's a misaligned synchro as the only way it can be misaligned is if it was installed wrong. And I'm sure you would have noticed the problem as soon as the transmission work was done.

is why i DO think it's a misaligned synchro becasue this is how the car has been for as long as i can remember, but since i havent been the daily driver, and now i am, now i care.

Just because he's drove manuals for a long time doesn't make him a mechanic. So if he's had the car that long when's the last time the clutch was changed.

that doesn't make you or me mechanics either.. but any respectable MTX driver can tell when thier clutch is going, heck, i've only been driving for about 2 years on a MTX, and i could tell when the clutch was going on my old SHO. i say again, it is NOT a clutch that needs replacement, it is something else.

 

[masho95]

Try shifting into 1st gear with the car not running. See if you still have that bump getting into 1st gear. If you don't it's not rod shifter related and you can assume that there is a problem with either the clutch or synchro/blocking ring.

 

[masho95]

i don't need instructions on how to shift into reverse, thank you

I was posting that for everyone's viewing, not trying to say you don't know how to engage reverse.

is why i DO think it's a misaligned synchro becasue this is how the car has been for as long as i can remember, but since i havent been the daily driver, and now i am, now i care.

You would do well to find out about all the car's previous service especially conserning clutch and transmission work. The only way I could engage 1st gear, with a misaligned synchro, was by hitting another gear first and then 1st. And it still didn't always hit 1st gear. I can tell you that I'm 99% sure you don't have a misaligned synchro.

that doesn't make you or me mechanics either.. but any respectable MTX driver can tell when thier clutch is going, heck, i've only been driving for about 2 years on a MTX, and i could tell when the clutch was going on my old SHO. i say again, it is NOT a clutch that needs replacement, it is something else.

See but I do all my own work on my car, including clutch and internal transmission work, etc., whatever it is, so I would consider my self a mechanic. Well have fun troubleshooting everything else, when the obvious points to a failing clutch assembly.

 

[NoFlipping]

I had similar problems recently and until I had a clutch job done during a rear main/carrier seal fix, I wouldn't have thought it to be the clutch either. Turns out it was the throw out bearing - just shot, pressure plate - missing finger tips, clutch plate itself was fine.

There are lots of things inside that housing that need to be working well with each other. In situations as you've described, it's often easiest to say "it's the clutch" even when the car might not be showing the sings of what you would consider a "bad clutch" - (e.g. - slipping). I found in mine (after the fact) that the clutch required a significant amount of foot pressure to release (bad TOB/PP) and the shifting was very notchy - my guess is that since the clutch was never fully releasing, the syncros were having a harder time than they do in a properly working MTX.

I'd have a reliable transmission guy take a look for you. Diagnosis should be free, so you've got little to lose. Good luck.

 

[SHO_Driver]

I was just gonna ask how stiff is the clutch pedal? Stiff means TOB and pressure plate time.

 

[SW SHO]

I'll give you my current situation:

1st gear is hard to get into.
Clutch pedal is hard to press.
Clutch does not slip at all.
Clutch does chatter a bit.
When clutch depressed, TOB noise is present and can be felt in pedal.
Reverse for me is best with 2nd gear, then reverse. (always been that way).

I'm not a mechanic by trade, but I don't think it takes one to understand this problem.

I've driven MTX vehicles for over 20 years. (never had an automatic). My money is on the TOB or PP not the tranny or rod shifter.

May not be the news you wanted to hear, I know.....sorry.

When your ready to buy a clutch:Clutch Kit

 

[Ishodu]

I just went through all of this a while ago. The clutch pedal was stiff. (you do get used to it though) I was having a hard time getting into 1st gear. Well I changed the Clutch TOB and Flywheel. Guess what the TOB was binding on the quill. Was making disengagement very hard, the PP was also about 2/3 wore through. Well one weekend and one clutch package later my problems were gone.

 

[FordLover]

sounds like a plan, i'll give that a look this weekend, my dad has had this car or a long time, before that it was a coworkers company car. my dad's been driving manual cars since he had his license, and SHOS for over 10 years, so trust me, when he says its not the clutch, it is not the clutch. i'm betting its sonething like the misaligned 1/2 synchro, because this would keep it from sliding into first easy, and since reverse is designed so that you ahve to lign up the synchros by putting it into first, this would also be the problem for having it give me grief about getting into reverse. i'll take a look this weekend, and let you all know whats going on, i could be dead wrong, but for now i'll stick with what my dad(daily driver of the car for about ~6 or so years) says about the clutch.

If dad is good enough to be certain it's not the clutch, then let him diagnose the problem.
In all honesty, it's not a bad clutch, it's the TOB. They aren't the greatest design, and tend to get gummy after 50K miles, the OEM kind can get nasty after as little as 30K miles or even less. But while your in there, might as well replace it, PP and all.