No Start - Coil?.... Lost...

[luigisho]

crank sensor is something you could do yourself or even pay someone to do for short money- considering what little you have in the car. sensors, even PITA ones to get to, are nothing compared to mechanical work like piston rings or valves.

 

[notbange]

Yeah crank sensor/waterpump is pretty easy, just have to take a bunch of things off to get there but none of it is really difficult.

 

[hawkeye18]

Actually, with the new information given to me, it kinda sounds more like a combination of a bad cam sensor (starts eventually) and a bad/dirty Idle Air Control (IAC) (high idle), with perhaps a dash of bad timing (lopey!).

The IAC is fairly easy to replace (the bottom bolt can kind of be a PITA, but it's not too bad), and you can try cleaning out the guts with carb/brake cleaner and see if that'll fix it. The MAF, IIRC, you already saw was dirty. Get some MAF cleaner (not carb cleaner!) and clean the two wires out real good like.

 

[SHOhopefull]

No kidding though, the codes will allow us and you to pinpoint the cause a lot better... it's really not a big deal to pull 'em.

 

[Talyn]

crank sensor is something you could do yourself or even pay someone to do for short money- considering what little you have in the car. sensors, even PITA ones to get to, are nothing compared to mechanical work like piston rings or valves.

Agreed!

Actually, with the new information given to me, it kinda sounds more like a combination of a bad cam sensor (starts eventually) and a bad/dirty Idle Air Control (IAC) (high idle), with perhaps a dash of bad timing (lopey!).

The IAC is fairly easy to replace (the bottom bolt can kind of be a PITA, but it's not too bad), and you can try cleaning out the guts with carb/brake cleaner and see if that'll fix it. The MAF, IIRC, you already saw was dirty. Get some MAF cleaner (not carb cleaner!) and clean the two wires out real good like.

IAC never fixed the idle. It idled better after IAC, but it never fixed it.
It only had high idle issues after a stall and a long crank start.
It would stall out on its own because it rarely could manage its idle properly. Something else other than the IAC was causing that. Never figured out what. The IAC was expensive enough with a discount. Eep!

And yeah, I pulled the TB to get to the bottom bolt, that was the easiest way I could see to do it.

I dont use carb cleaner on anything except dirty parts.
Used electronics cleaner that wouldn't damage the sensors.

As for starts eventually, it doesn't do that anymore at all, so I have not fussed with it since I looked it over.
It would start fine after it sat for a while or you shut it off, it only had the hard start issue after a stall.

No kidding though, the codes will allow us and you to pinpoint the cause a lot better... it's really not a big deal to pull 'em.

Keep bugging me about it, these other guys are providing me with Tons of info that is actually helpful.
Codes don't tell you everything, sometimes they don't even tell you the problem. I had a CEL on, so I know there are codes in there.
The other information these people are providing is very valuable to me and helping me consider if I want to address the problem or not.

 

[Talyn]

http://www.shoforum.com/search.php?searchid=2276594

alright, You all are going to have to help me out.
Being on Dial Up can be a nightmare when trying to search for things. How did we ever do this before?

I cannot seem to find any posts on procedures for pulling codes, nor do I remember them from my truck. I never got the right codes counting the lights anyways.

I'm spoiled with my aeroforce scan gauge. =(

 

[kevinspann]

http://www.shophoenixproject.com/eec/eec.htm

Link is there, but will take a while to load on dial up

Image here...

There should be connectors with this shape, near the firewall, on the passenger side, right by the strut tower. They might even have a cap on them that says EEC Test or something like that.

What you do is, jumper the connectors with something like a paper clip, in the pins indicated by the red dots. Then, turn the Key to "on" and the CEL will flash the codes. You count the flashes to get the code number. Since they are three digit codes, there will be a short pause between each number that is flashed, and a longer pause between the individual codes.

So: Two flashes + One flash + 6 flashes = code 216, for example.

It will go through two sets of codes KOEO (Key on, engine off) and Continous codes.

 

[Talyn]

Yeah, those are the same as on the Ford Trucks. Same connectors too.

Thanks for helping Kevin.

Last time I did it, I tried it with everything. Such a failure. I'm not sure why it was such a problem.

Oh, I just thought of a fantastic idea. I'll just record the damn thing with the camera.

 

[Talyn]

Well, not looking good at all.

It's not giving me any codes, CEL comes on but doesn't do anything.

It cannot do the fan test either cause I am pretty sure my fan is broke. Just sits there. Fuel pump comes on, that's it.

I'ma go out and tinker with it for a few more minutes and try again, but it doesn't look like its going to work. No idea why. Unless it wants to fuss about the parking brake being on. I guess I'll check that.
It doesn't work. I dont even remember if the pedal works.

 

[Talyn]

Not sure why it wont display codes.

Sat there for a while and it did nothing.


Was talking with my Father, apparently there was a starter put in it a while back and it has been doing this goofie stuff I'm describing since then.
The not starting after stalling and yada yada.

Could the mechanic have jolted the ECM/PCM when he hooked everything back up and it just hadn't failed quite yet?

I am speculating that the bad idle issues i've had with it all along have been Cam Positioning sensor, because every now and then it would have starting issues and you'd have to crank, so it was guessing.
But after the starter, he said if it stalled, it did it every time.
Makes sense if he zapped the computer as to why I'm having issues pulling codes.

 

[rubydist]

does the check engine light ever come on? maybe the bulb is shot.

 

[luigisho]

If the PCM was damaged you could have any manner of failures. That's not to say this is the the issue but, if you have a bad computer, tracing any other failed part would be tricky.

 

[hawkeye18]

PCM failures are sadly becoming more common nowadays. They have previously been thought to be pretty bulletproof, and failures were quite rare, but time marches on, and more and more components are simply dying of old age.

This website (which is straight from internet 1.0, so dial-up friendly) gives pretty good instructions on how to read codes. You'll be getting 3-digit codes (assuming you're getting codes!).

There are two (three really, but the third is pretty obscure) types of tests - KOEO and KOER. The first is Key On, Engine Off; the second is Key On, Engine Running. As the acronyms suggest, the key needs to be in the ON position for both these tests. I would start with KOEO first. Follow the instructions on the website and you should be able to get codes.

Also, check the wiring at that connector - when I tried checking the codes for the first time after my wife purchased her '95, I couldn't get anything to work! Turns out the STO wire had been cut about an inch from the connector, so neither the CEL (which the STO wire goes on to power) nor my multimeter were getting any readings! Pretty shady if you ask me.

 

[Talyn]

I'm the second owner of it.

Light works fine.
It's been on since the starter was replaced and the car started acting weird then.

Wires not cut, checked all that.

Just not giving anything at all.

 

[intimdatr]

Dead Pcm??

 

[Talyn]

Dead Pcm??

Thats what I'm thinking.

I wish I had a GL Sho Member nearby to do a swap.

 

[intimdatr]

haha! Fact!