New Guy. Surging Issue

[F.X.5]

Hi guys. Long time member, first time SHO owner. I’ve always been a 1-2 Gen fan but the old lady fell in love with a 4th gen and needless to say, it’s in the garage. It’s a 2010 with 218k on it. Airaid intake, magnaflow exhaust and it’s lowered, not sure what springs it has. I was told it was all highway miles and has always been maintained well, of course it was... Other than the reading on the odometer, you’d never know it has 200k+.

We’re having a surge problem, it happens at any rpm and mostly any gear, more common in the higher gears. We have noticed that it is significantly better while the cruise is on. It does do it on occasion while the cruise is on but it doesn’t do it near as often.

She needs the car as her daily and I came to the pros for any ideas. I’ve always enjoyed being a member on this forum, very tight knit group and great info. If you have any ideas on what to check out, let me know. Thank you.

I’ll attach a terrible pic of the car. Haven’t had it out to take any decent pics yet.

 

[glockcoma]

Is it throwing any codes?
Did you check all the vacuum hoses on the top of the intake? They like to pop off and cause all kinds of strange issues.
Is it rpm surging or the whole car?
Could possibly be torque converter related.

 

[SHOdded]

Does sound like a vacuum leak of some sort. Brakes work ok?

Generally, when I hear of "surging" with these cars, it is one of two things (aside from leaking hoses):
a) TC as glock mentioned, or
b) compressor surge (turbo)

If it is TC related, rpms will tend to flutter under steady load without any effect on speed/acceleration etc. Usually happens because the lockup function is not working correctly anymore, so more around 40+ mph.

I would clean the MAP sensors and the IAT sensor first with MAF cleaner. Check the turbo hoses. Check spark plugs and coils. Go from there.

 

[F.X.5]

Is it throwing any codes?
Did you check all the vacuum hoses on the top of the intake? They like to pop off and cause all kinds of strange issues.
Is it rpm surging or the whole car?
Could possibly be torque converter related.

No CEL. I could try scanning it to see if anything pops up with my little code reader.

The vacuum lines all look to be in good shape. I could spray some carb cleaner around to see if it changes the idle, it idles very smooth for what it’s worth.

It only surges when the engine is under a load. You can feel it slightly but I think it’s amplified by the exhaust tone changing. If I wore ear plugs. I may not be able to tell it’s even doing it.

If you try to accelerate quickly, it gets worse. Almost to the point of more of a chatter or shudder. Sometimes it’s almost violent, depending on how heavy you’re into the throttle.

We just picked the car up this past Saturday in NC. Drove it 400+ miles home to PA and started finding all its little quirks once we got into the hills of PA. It ran good on the flat interstate. Some slight surging, but when we got into the steeper hills, it really started acting up.

It’ll need a PA inspection and I’ll check things out from underneath while it’s up on the rack. When it chatters or shudders, it almost feels as if a mount or something may be loose. I’m not sure what a failing PTU feels like so it could very well be that, a fluid change is on the to do list.

Does sound like a vacuum leak of some sort. Brakes work ok?

Generally, when I hear of "surging" with these cars, it is one of two things (aside from leaking hoses):
a) TC as glock mentioned, or
b) compressor surge (turbo)

If it is TC related, rpms will tend to flutter under steady load without any effect on speed/acceleration etc. Usually happens because the lockup function is not working correctly anymore, so more around 40+ mph.

I would clean the MAP sensors and the IAT sensor first with MAF cleaner. Check the turbo hoses. Check spark plugs and coils. Go from there.

I don’t hear any vacuum leaks and the brakes seem to be functioning fine. As said above. I’ll spray some carb cleaner above the intake to see if I notice a difference in rpm.

I’m starting to lean towards a TC issue. I’m going to try replacing the spark plugs and changing the PTU fluid but I’m not very confident it will fix anything.

I’ll pick up a can of MAF cleaner after work. I’m not sure where these sensors are located but I’m sure there’s a diagram of some kind I can find on google images.

Thank you guys for the info. We did get the car for a good price so we have a little bit of money to spend on repairs before it would have made sense to just buy a lower mile 100% perfect car. I’m hoping we can get it fixed up for a $1-2k or less and have a good car. Fingers crossed lol.

I tried to attach a video of what it’s doing but it won’t let me for some reason.

 

[glockcoma]

No CEL. I could try scanning it to see if anything pops up with my little code reader.

The vacuum lines all look to be in good shape. I could spray some carb cleaner around to see if it changes the idle, it idles very smooth for what it’s worth.

It only surges when the engine is under a load. You can feel it slightly but I think it’s amplified by the exhaust tone changing. If I wore ear plugs. I may not be able to tell it’s even doing it.

If you try to accelerate quickly, it gets worse. Almost to the point of more of a chatter or shudder. Sometimes it’s almost violent, depending on how heavy you’re into the throttle.

We just picked the car up this past Saturday in NC. Drove it 400+ miles home to PA and started finding all its little quirks once we got into the hills of PA. It ran good on the flat interstate. Some slight surging, but when we got into the steeper hills, it really started acting up.

It’ll need a PA inspection and I’ll check things out from underneath while it’s up on the rack. When it chatters or shudders, it almost feels as if a mount or something may be loose. I’m not sure what a failing PTU feels like so it could very well be that, a fluid change is on the to do list.



I don’t hear any vacuum leaks and the brakes seem to be functioning fine. As said above. I’ll spray some carb cleaner above the intake to see if I notice a difference in rpm.

I’m starting to lean towards a TC issue. I’m going to try replacing the spark plugs and changing the PTU fluid but I’m not very confident it will fix anything.

I’ll pick up a can of MAF cleaner after work. I’m not sure where these sensors are located but I’m sure there’s a diagram of some kind I can find on google images.

Thank you guys for the info. We did get the car for a good price so we have a little bit of money to spend on repairs before it would have made sense to just buy a lower mile 100% perfect car. I’m hoping we can get it fixed up for a $1-2k or less and have a good car. Fingers crossed lol.

I tried to attach a video of what it’s doing but it won’t let me for some reason.

Here are the map sensors
and vacuum lines to check

 

[SHOdded]

Bet it wasn't this clean when brand new, LOL.

 

[limited02]

I'd check the spark plugs. When they are worn, they can cause a surge or stumble when under load. SP534 is the spark plug of choice and gapped at .030. Given it has so many miles, it's cheap insurance too.

Since the car modified, do you know if it's tuned or not? I would try to keep 91 in it just to be safe.

 

[SHOdded]

May be an outside shot, but check the orange gasket on the blowoff valves. That can tear over time, especially 220K worth of time

 

[Jeff2017]

Hi guys. Long time member, first time SHO owner. I’ve always been a 1-2 Gen fan but the old lady fell in love with a 4th gen and needless to say, it’s in the garage. It’s a 2010 with 218k on it. Airaid intake, magnaflow exhaust and it’s lowered, not sure what springs it has. I was told it was all highway miles and has always been maintained well, of course it was... Other than the reading on the odometer, you’d never know it has 200k+.

We’re having a surge problem, it happens at any rpm and mostly any gear, more common in the higher gears. We have noticed that it is significantly better while the cruise is on. It does do it on occasion while the cruise is on but it doesn’t do it near as often.

She needs the car as her daily and I came to the pros for any ideas. I’ve always enjoyed being a member on this forum, very tight knit group and great info. If you have any ideas on what to check out, let me know. Thank you.

I’ll attach a terrible pic of the car. Haven’t had it out to take any decent pics yet.

Clean the MAF. Check turbo pipes for leaks.

 

[F.X.5]

The previous owner said it wasn’t tuned but it has a LMS sticker on the engine cover. He said it came with the airaid intake.

I cleaned the MAP and IAT sensors tonight with MAF cleaner. No change. Short of replacing them, I’d rule them out. I checked over the vacuum hoses as mentioned above and they all seemed to be in good shape and secure. Off topic but one thing I noticed was the ground cable to the battery where it does the 90 to go along the bottom of the air box is almost all bare. The insulation is just crumbling, not sure if the trans got super hot and cooked it or if that’s a common thing on these cars. I taped it up, being a ground wire, I’m not terribly concerned at this point. The positive wire looked to be in good condition.

I’m not too sure on the turbo piping, from what I saw from crawling under it, they looked to be in good shape with no holes or cuts. I’ll be able to look it over better underneath when it gets inspected.

The previous owner tried fixing this before he sold it. It has newer motor craft plugs in it, not the same part number as mentioned above though. I’ll order new to replace them just so I know where I stand. He also replaced the coil packs but they’re an off brand. Not FoMoCo. I’m not sold enough on the coils to spend the money on factory branded coils right now. I’d rather put the money towards a TC if that ends up being the issue.

I’d like to perform a PTU change but to be honest, I’m a truck guy and don’t know too much about them. I’m sure there’s a how to on this site on changing the fluid.

On a bright note, it’s lowered on H&R springs. I’ve seen a lot of people using them on here so that’s one thing I can be happy about at this point lol. Ride is a touch on the rough side I must say.

 

[Johnbigdog]

I'm not too savy on gas engine diag, and to me it's harder when you don't have a scan tool to look at stuff nowadays.

My 16 had a surge/shutter on acceleration in 3rd gear up hills. It was bad enough that it showed on the tachometer. My but-o-meter said torque converter. Turns out one of the wastegate rods came loose from the lever on the turbine housing. Basically I was looking boost/not controlling boost resulting in the RPM fluctuation. You can give them a look. And make sure they are clipped into place.

I also noticed the exhaust note changed. It was throughtier on acceleration and my car lost its moan on acceleration.

Yes there are how to on put oil drain and fill.

 

[geophb]

There could be "pending" or "stored" codes hiding in there, without a CEL. Did you ever pull codes or scan it?

 

[F.X.5]

I tried scanning it last night with my scanner. It wouldn’t connect. I’m going to try a friends scan tool to see what we can find.

 

[Bronco2fan]

When mine was surging, I took it to the tranny shop thinking TC was going out too. It all pointed that way when they hooked her up and drove around. We discussed it and I decided to try the No Shudder additive, surge went away, runs fine now. Been almost a year I think, plus make sure the tranny is full too.

 

[F.X.5]

When mine was surging, I took it to the tranny shop thinking TC was going out too. It all pointed that way when they hooked her up and drove around. We discussed it and I decided to try the No Shudder additive, surge went away, runs fine now. Been almost a year I think, plus make sure the tranny is full too.

No shudder additive? I didn’t know they made such a thing. I’ll have to look into it. I do have a reputable transmission shop local to me I could take it to after I’ve exhausted my free or next to it “fixes” lol. With the transmission dipstick located where it is, it’s almost impossible to check it with the air filter on the car. Makes that a pain if you ask me, at least it has a dipstick unlike a lot of other late model vehicles.