3.2 completely toar down with ?'s and pics. (no 56k)

[Brett]

Got the motor home fine, 2 1/2 hour drive (all 30-55mph). When i asked to see the car the motor came out of they said it had been crushed, which i figured. I did ask 3 different employees questions seperately. Each gave me the same mileage without flinching, but who knows. No accessories, no wiring harness but otherwise complete.

The plug wells were full of oil, thats why the top of the pistons have little puddles. Other then that all the gaskets seemed pretty soft and flexible, and i didn't find coolant anywhere it shouldn't have been.

I know you've all seen the inside of a 3.2, nothing special. I'm posting pics because this is by far the biggest project ive ever taken on, my dad has taken apart motors but back in the carb days. Take a look, if you see anything wrong, anything that looks really gunked up or ANY problem spots in the cylinders, in the heads please point it out, i really don't know what to look for... Thanks guys.

I'd really like to just keep the rolling assembly inside of the block, is there anyway to clean the cylinders without taking the pistons out?

P.S. i know i forgot pics of the crank/rod bearings. I'll get them in the morning. I think one or two of the bearings had a bit of play back and fourth, like i can wiggle them a little.. that couldn't be good right?

My buddy bob, my dad, and my brother. took about an hour to get to it down to the block.

 

[HotRodKid]

the best way to deal with the pistons is to pull them, junk the rings, scrub them spotless, bar hone the cylinders to break the glaze, then put it all back together with new rings

its the only way to do it, and will ensure the pistons are spotless and theres no shit laying in there that will screw up the bores

only poblem is the slight bit of oil it will burn till the new rings seat ... just dont use synthetic oil at first and youll be fine

 

[1993MTXSHO]

if you can wiggle a rod back and fourth thats REALLY REALLY bad. Double check that and make sure thats not a problem that engine will explode if you can feel that. Also check for a ridge on the top of the cylinders feel for a notch fort of thing im sure you dad would now. That will tell you if the engine needs to be hones or bored. Mine was so bad it had to be bored. Make sure when you reinstall the bearings you gauge the clearances between the journals and bearings. Depends on how crazy you wanna go really. If you like me and want everything perfect go build a brand new 3.3L Check your shims for wear as well that engine looks pretty dirty inside (indicates bad oil change intervals usually) I dunno what else to say im sure ill think of more and more people will post some good stuff. If you have any question feel free to pm me im just getting through this mess im dealing with as far as building up a sho engine, anyway good luck

 

[Brett]

the best way to deal with the pistons is to pull them, junk the rings, scrub them spotless, bar hone the cylinders to break the glaze, then put it all back together with new rings

its the only way to do it, and will ensure the pistons are spotless and theres no shit laying in there that will screw up the bores

only poblem is the slight bit of oil it will burn till the new rings seat ... just dont use synthetic oil at first and youll be fine

Eh, i kinda figured. Your right, its not worth it to tear it down to the block and not put in new rings. The thought of pulling the rolling assembly to me is a bit intimidating to say the least. But i've gone this far...

How much do rings go for?

if you can wiggle a rod back and fourth thats REALLY REALLY bad. Double check that and make sure thats not a problem that engine will explode if you can feel that. Also check for a ridge on the top of the cylinders feel for a notch fort of thing im sure you dad would now. That will tell you if the engine needs to be hones or bored. Mine was so bad it had to be bored. Make sure when you reinstall the bearings you gauge the clearances between the journals and bearings. Depends on how crazy you wanna go really. If you like me and want everything perfect go build a brand new 3.3L Check your shims for wear as well that engine looks pretty dirty inside (indicates bad oil change intervals usually) I dunno what else to say im sure ill think of more and more people will post some good stuff. If you have any question feel free to pm me im just getting through this mess im dealing with as far as building up a sho engine, anyway good luck

I didn't feel the play personally, cousin told me last night. I did reach in there today and tried to wiggle a couple bearings to see if there was play but it was after the crank was turned and different bearings were showing, i didnt feel play in the one or two i grabbed. I will pull them and post pics in the morning. I shouldnt have to worry about valve lash or anything head wise as i'll be using my 3.0 heads that were checked out and lash adjusted less then 20k ago, but i'll still check ofcourse. I really didn't wanna do a full rebuild, just new rod bearings, gaskets and sensors... if you guys really think i should pull the assembly i will, I'll be following searched threads, write ups, and your guys suggestions the entire way, i wouldn't be able to do it myself.

 

[1993MTXSHO]

id replace the rings, to be honest the short block too me about 4 hours or so to assemble working alone doing it for the 1st time. Rings arnt that expensive 120 bucks from rcm i think. Id change them while you have it apart.

 

[HotRodKid]

Your right, its not worth it to tear it down to the block and not put in new rings.

I didn't feel the play personally, cousin told me last night. .

cleaning all the ring gooves spotless to ensure theres no junk to cause blowby andmaking sure that all th oil return holes in the oil ring groove is the real benifit of pulling the rings

my sisters car was burning oil for no apparent reason, turns out 75% of the oil holes were plugged. before and after:

as for the rodplay u have noticed.im assuming its back and forth in line with the crankshaft ? (IE, your pushing and pulling it towards the pulleys and transmision and its moving forya)

all rods have a bit of gap in this direction, its normal, if they didnt have that play they would microweld to the crankshaft after everything got hot

its also incredibly rare that the sides of the rods big end would some how wear out and extra clearance n this area as theres onlya tinybit of sideload in a rod, 99.99% of a rods load is DOWN on acrankshaft , not left / right (or forward backward for you non transverse mounted engine folks)

 

[Brett]

as for the rodplay u have noticed.im assuming its back and forth in line with the crankshaft ? (IE, your pushing and pulling it towards the pulleys and transmision and its moving forya)

all rods have a bit of gap in this direction, its normal, if they didnt have that play they would microweld to the crankshaft after everything got hot

its also incredibly rare that the sides of the rods big end would some how wear out and extra clearance n this area as theres onlya tinybit of sideload in a rod, 99.99% of a rods load is DOWN on acrankshaft , not left / right (or forward backward for you non transverse mounted engine folks)

Yes, it was back and fourth, pullies to tranny, you just eliviated alot of worries, thank you. pics in a couple mins of the crank/bearings.

 

[HotRodKid]

the other thing to realize about the rod bearing play is that anything that GETS oil has to get RID of oil

so you pump oil up to the crank bearings, cranks have a "thrust' clearance to them, this leaves room for them to **** out used oil

some of the oil that gets supplied to the crank bearings actually goes to the rod bearings via the passages in the crank.... and the used oil off the rod bearings has to pis out, so rod bearings need some thrust clearance also

and some of the oil that makes it to the rods actually gets sent to the wrist pins ... and there isnt a piston out there that i know of that DOESN'T have wrist pin clearance thats sloppy as all he!!...

it looks weird at first, but once you get used to seeing play like that in parts youll just know to check that its within spec, and if it is within spec, effe it

look at the space shuttle for example ... nasa spent billions of dollars to build it, billions to fly it, and shit falls off on EVERY LAUNCH

billions off dollars for shat to go flying of in every direction ... lol

 

[yamahaSHO]

The rod will slide side to side, that's not a problem. If you have a spun rod bearing, you will be able to pushe the rod up and down slightly, but you should already know if you had a spun bearing 'cause you would find shavings everywhere.

 

[mwt]

If you want it to be dependable

Pull it down to bare block and have it hot tanked.

Pull the pistons and rods and have the pistons knurled and have the rods checked for roundness and check the crank and get an engine set and put it all back together

 

[1993MTXSHO]

im going to say this, to do it the right way its going to cost you a decent chunk of change. If you wanna save a lot of money and hope for the best throw it in with some new bearings and gaskets and just do the oil changed at 3k miles.

 

[n8rsk8r]

If you want it to be dependable

Pull it down to bare block and have it hot tanked.

Pull the pistons and rods and have the pistons knurled and have the rods checked for roundness and check the crank and get an engine set and put it all back together

what does all this machinist work cost? How much could one expect to pay?

 

[Brett]

Pulled the rolling assembly tonight, everything went good. The rod bearings looked a little scorched but nothing crazy. the cylinder walls feel good and the piston rings look pretty good as well, but i'm still going to buy new ones. The valley ontop of the block is pretty gunked up.

I do understand that this isnt going to be cheap, money im not so worried about. Its a nice LONG winter up here in MN, plenty of time to save. I'm more afraid of putting it back together, but with all the write ups, offered help and search i think i can get it done. I do plan to have the block boiled and the cylinders honed. Now its time to start buying and saving.

You'll be hearing from me. :wave:

new pics:

 

[Off Road SHO]

If you get new thrust washers in your rebuild kit of main bearings, I will buy your old ones from you. They are the half moon looking things in the third from the last picture.

That is one filthy motor. That looks to have well over a 100k miles on it with not too many oil changes. Pull all of the old freeze plugs; one looks like it was leaking already. Don't forget the two in the oil separator and the ones at the back of the block.

Pull everything else off the block and take it to a do it yourself carwash late at night so no one sees you cleaning it. Blast all the major crud off of it and make sure you blast hot soapy water through each and every oil passageway. This is important because they don't do "hot tanking" of engine blocks anymore, they use a rotary parts washer that randomly squirts high pressure water at the block as it rotates. Only you can guarranty that every passageway is clean. It will still need to be jet-washed though, especially after the honing.

After the cylinder wall honing (not boring, just honing) is done, clean that sucker againg with hot soapy water. Blow out all of the passageways with compressed air untill completely dry and then coat everything with WD-40 and they keep it covered with a plastic sheet while you're not working on it (clear plastic shower curtains work great and are cheap at Wally World).

Use brass freeze plugs if you can get them, much more resistant to corrosion. Apply a thin coat of "The Right Stuff" or equal quality silicone sealer to the freeze plugs before seating them flush with the block.

Good luck.

Tom

 

[SHOtimer]

That is one sick looking motor - good thing you are taking it apart, I wouldn't think about putting it like that.

When I rebuilt my 3.2 I did just what you did. Pulled it apart, had my block hot tanked (that was 2 years ago - I'm surprised that Tom said they don't do that anymore, - why not?), new freeze plugs put in, new rings, all new bearings (and thrust bearings!), and a polished crank - I had him clean the pistons, but I reused the old ones. I had him check my heads and replace my valve stem seals.

Including parts and machine work I was around $1500.00. FYI.

42k and two years later - she still purs on up to 7k regularly and doesn't burn nor leak one drop of oil. And I can open up the oil fill cap and could eat off of the heads...which were never tanked.

Have fun!

Doug

 

[Off Road SHO]

Pulled it apart, had my block hot tanked (that was 2 years ago - I'm surprised that Tom said they don't do that anymore, - why not?),
Doug

It's because of the chemicals that they had to use when they just vat the block as opposed to the newer style high pressure washer style. The caustic soda that they used in the old style tanks needed a permit from God and as you know, He doesn't give those out to just any old shop.

Back when I was into VW's I made my own version of a hot tank using garage floor cleaner dissolved in water that was then set to boil on a Coleman camp stove. Boy did it work great. Took absolutely everything off of steel. Couldn't use it on aluminum though, too harsh.

Tom

 

[SHOtimer]

Well, I tell you what, it looked spotless when it came out - too bad they can't do that anymore.

Doug

 

[clindahl]

As stated, KEEP the thrust bearings. I found that out the HARD WAY, they don't come in new main bearing kits. I found a set, but that wasn't fun. Now if you can get a new set by all means sell your old set but FYI, don't just toss them (speaking from supidity here) - it WILL cost you.


That looks like my abused motor when I finally pulled it apart. 113k on the motor by prior motor and documented 3k to 3500 mile oil changes mostly at jiffy ****, etc.

Good luck and keep taking pictures

 

[AREA 91]

You must re-use the thrust bearings. You cannot find new one's.
I hope you numbered the connecting rods and caps. Everything must go back to there origional spot.

 

[yamahaSHO]

Ideally, you should have the connecting rods resized...