update-not solved Or IS IT?! You Decide. See post 60

[93rev2sev]

I got a sho in my garage that's not starting. (91)

The fuel pump is not priming but the starter seems strong.
Cut hole in floor to replace pump, tested pump with 12v source and it spun and made pressure at the rails. So it's not the pump.

While the pump was spinning (with the 12v source) I tried starting it again and not so much as a sputter. So it's got no spark AND no fuel...

So...

I swapped the CCRM...nothing.
Swapped the computer...nothing.

Tried to pull codes and I can't seem to get it into "self test" mode.

Suggestions?

 

[SHOmethewayhome]

uh... fuel cut off switch?

 

[St Louis SHO]

CCRM is not powered up. Is the CEL on when you turn the key on?

 

[St Louis SHO]

Also, if its Gates' car, is the DIS ground on there?

 

[93rev2sev]

DIS grounded. I've checked the fuel cut off by banging on it and resetting it ... like 10 times.

It is NOT gates' car...his engine is on my garage floor so I know why that wont start.


How do you check for power at ccrm? I'll be searching in the meantime...

Like said, when I power the pump with an external source, it primes but still no fire.

 

[93rev2sev]

Additional info...the car died on the freeway...it wasn't sitting and decided not to start...it DIED and won't start....if that helps...

Oh ya CEL is illuminated when I turn the key.

 

[93rev2sev]

more additional info.

When I turnthe key, the tach jumps slightly.WhenI crank the engine, the tach moves to about 400 as expected.

 

[93rev2sev]

bump for the evening crowd.

 

[sperold]

Look at your timing belt.
They tend to roll over faster with a broken belt or one way out of time.

 

[GreenPlus]

Are you getting power at the injectors?

 

[93rev2sev]

OK, I just got done confirming that there IS spark.

recap: car died on freeway. Fuel pump is not starting with the key but works with a 12v battery hooked directly to the pump through the hole in the floor. Attempting to pull codes and the car will not start the diag. The fan does not kick, nothing indicating that it's in test mode.

I've replaced CCRM, PCM, and confirmed ground paths. Still no voltage to the pump.

Since there IS spark, can I assume the PCM is not the problem?

I'm about to remove the drivers seat to check fuel pump wiring at the harness interconnect. I'd like to make sure the CCRM is getting power, how do I test that agian? Still searching...

 

[whiteman_01]

I had a similar problem with my brothers old 91. There is a smaller power wire that comes off of the battery, and has a fuse about 6 inches down, and this had come apart. This gave me the no start, no fuel, no diag, and everything your experiencing.

 

[93rev2sev]

Problem solved. Thanks to whiteman01. A year ago he posted a solution in this thread: http://www.shoforum.com/showthread.php?t=98647&highlight=ccrm+power

I found it about 10 minutes before he posted (almost word for word) in this one. After successfully starting the engine, I read his response here. You da MAN!


That little wire was broken inside the sheath. little bastage was hiding. The only way I found it was because of whiteman's contribution. I kept after that wire until I found a skinny spot about 2 inches down the line. A little wiggling and it broke in 2 in my hands.


This little wire is only on 91's huh? That explains things. I have only had one 91 before....excuses, excuses huh?

 

[whiteman_01]

Glad i could help. Also, i would guess its on all the first gens as apposed to just 91. Anyone care to check their 89/90 for it?

 

[TwistedMunky]

I thnk my 90 outside has it. I forgot to say thanks whiteman 01 you really helped me out. The wire was next to the radiator so I couldnt see it.

 

[shoShifter]

Thanks!

Glad i could help. Also, i would guess its on all the first gens as apposed to just 91. Anyone care to check their 89/90 for it?

It actually is a '90, rev2sev just likes my '91 better. Thanks for taking the time to repost your info, it helped rev2sev get me back on the road.

Thanks to everyone for posting.

 

[93rev2sev]

Well what we thought was a simple broken wire has turned into a nightmare. After repairing that wire, I was able to start the car. I ran it for only a few seconds and it started to sputter. I turned it off and immediately noticed the distinct smell of burning electronics.

The CCRM was smoking. It's fried. I grabbed a spare "M" off my shelf thinking the problem was the CCRM from the get go. It's now equally fried.

So this car is a CCRM killer. We checked for a shorted power wire at the fuel pump and fan plugs, but neither one would sound a tone with the ohm meter to ground. I know I still need to check the A/C clutch switch.

I've taken the fried CCRM apart and well here it is...




I'm stumped for now. Any insight would be appreciated.

 

[boat]

While I can't contribute to the solution, I hope you get it figured out.

 

[SHOtime2511]

How does the harness look going into the CCRM?
I'd be inclided to think it has something to do with the repair you just did since its never done this before.
how did the broken wire look? broken or fired and melted?

 

[93rev2sev]

Brian,

Thanks for the reply.

The CCRM wires look ok. This problem started after the owner replaced a dead cooling fan and removed/charged/replaced battery. He drove it for about an hour and it died. Sounded like a bad fuel pump but I was unable to pull codes. I tested the fuel pump with 12volts (worked), swapped the b9b1 and "m" CCRM for an x2j and CCRM (matching from same parts car). When that didn't work, I looked for and found a cooked fusable link. Repairing that link got the car started, but smoked the CCRM.