Tweecer RT 1on1??? TweeCer for DUmmIes!

[jeanrw2000]

Hey guy i searched around the forum and i didn't find what i was looking for on the existing threads about Tweecer. I could always overlooked so i apologies if this thread already exist...

I finally decide that is time to play with my Tweecer which i got now for a few weeks maybe months but because the lack of knowledge i can't seems to comprehend anything so i was wondering if there is anybody that may be able to give me some staring help on the set up. That way i could learn how to do it from scratch, rather that have somebody make me a program so, i just load it on the car and still don't know how to actually do one myself. Did i make any sense?
I know that there is FAQ/Guide in the making by somebody in the forum but i don't know when is actually coming out, and you guys probably know how hard is to look at your toys without being able to play with then.

SO.
Here are the mods most people always seems to need to know.

80mm MAF
SS 47lbs injectors
Shonut FPR
Supercharged 9psi
255 fuel pump
Stage II cams from SS.

What i think i know:

Under the Utilities Tab on CalEdit i have to have the dot on
Two 4 Banks Programs
Strategy: X2J
Bank Count: 1
I also know how to do the MAF transfer to get the 80 mm MAF, BUt there are 3 different ones, which one should i use?

80MMKB?
80MMLMAF?
CNL80MM?

Also how do set up my injector size?

I think this would be all i need to a least get the car to start right?

Thanks help is always appreciate it.

Jean.

 

[Axianator]

I know that there is FAQ/Guide in the making by somebody in the forum but i don't know when is actually coming out

Josh and I are still on track to meet our original release date of Spring '06 for the TwEECer FAQ and V6 SHO Tuning Guide.

Under the Utilities Tab on CalEdit i have to have the dot on
Two 4 Banks Programs

Very close.

Everything is correct except for the bank configuration (or the "dot"), which should be set to "Four 2 Bank Programs".

I also know how to do the MAF transfer to get the 80 mm MAF, BUt there are 3 different ones, which one should i use?

Use this MAF file for your 80mm Mark VIII MAF:

http://www.shonutperformance.com/MarkVIII80.MAF

Also how do set up my injector size?

While the primary parameters that control injector sizing are the Injector High Slope and Injector Low Slope parameters found under the Scalars tab, there are several other parameters and functions that play a role in the amount of fuel that your engine sees for a given load or RPM. On top of that, the the SS 47# injectors have a tendency to make injector tuning even more difficult due to the way that they were modified by Vadim.

See my last reply below about Josh's program before attempting to modify the injector slope scalars themselves.

I think this would be all i need to a least get the car to start right?

Rather than modifying the factory X2J program from scratch, you may want to start with a copy of Josh's blower program instead:

http://www.shonutperformance.com/Josh_blower.CCF

Not only will his file give you a good baseline to start with, but it will also allow you to compare his blower-specific changes to the original factory parameters and see what changes are required in order to get an MTX blower setup running properly.

Also, don't forget that Jason Zuress (yamahaSHO) is an invaluable resource when it comes to MTX-specific blower tuning Q's.

 

[1slickRED89]

i'm looking forward to that FAQ!!!

 

[jeanrw2000]

Josh and I are still on track to meet our original release date of Spring '06 for the TwEECer FAQ and V6 SHO Tuning Guide.

Very close.

Everything is correct except for the bank configuration (or the "dot"), which should be set to "Four 2 Bank Programs".

Use this MAF file for your 80mm Mark VIII MAF:

http://www.shonutperformance.com/MarkVIII80.MAF

While the primary parameters that control injector sizing are the Injector High Slope and Injector Low Slope parameters found under the Scalars tab, there are several other parameters and functions that play a role in the amount of fuel that your engine sees for a given load or RPM. On top of that, the the SS 47# injectors have a tendency to make injector tuning even more difficult due to the way that they were modified by Vadim.

See my last reply below about Josh's program before attempting to modify the injector slope scalars themselves.

Rather than modifying the factory X2J program from scratch, you may want to start with a copy of Josh's blower program instead:

http://www.shonutperformance.com/Josh_blower.CCF

Not only will his file give you a good baseline to start with, but it will also allow you to compare his blower-specific changes to the original factory parameters and see what changes are required in order to get an MTX blower setup running properly.

Also, don't forget that Jason Zuress (yamahaSHO) is an invaluable resource when it comes to MTX-specific blower tuning Q's.

Thanks Boss i'll give it a try like that

Jean.

 

[jeanrw2000]

Ok so i loaded it Josh supercharge file and the lincon mark MAF you send me and VOILA! car runs very good i think, although the RPM stays now in like the 1400 in iddle is that ok like that?

Also do i still have to set the rev limiter on that file?

and how do i know if i still have to do anything to that file?
i know Josh's car is supercharge as well but i dont think the tuning should be the same as he got more xtra godies on his, that i dont have in my?!

thanks

Jean.

 

[jeanrw2000]

Do i have to drive around with the Tweecer phone cable and switch?
O can i removed the switch and cable and just leave the actually chip by itself?

Jean.

 

[SHO NUT]

Ok so i loaded it Josh supercharge file and the lincon mark MAF you send me and VOILA! car runs very good i think, although the RPM stays now in like the 1400 in iddle is that ok like that?

Also do i still have to set the rev limiter on that file?

and how do i know if i still have to do anything to that file?
i know Josh's car is supercharge as well but i dont think the tuning should be the same as he got more xtra godies on his, that i dont have in my?!

thanks

Jean.

The basics of the car are pretty much the same - blower, cams, injectors, FPR, so it won't be too far off. I set my idle at 1200, that probably explains your high idle My +40's (bigger than Stage II's) don't like to idle, especially with so much drag on the motor at idle from my centrifugal air cleaner .....

Now - and this is CRITICAL - the Mark VIII 80 MAF will peg on a boosted motor, and the EEC has NO idea that all that extra air is going into the engine. When it does that, my programming has NO extra fuel to compensate for that (I use a MAF that won't peg, see below). The old SHO Shop blower programming would simply throw extra fuel on the motor when the MAF was pegged and the EEC was running blind with respect to knowing how much air was going into the engine, so it was really a WAG.

I take the safer approach and actually measure the air going into the engine, by using a MAF that won't peg, so the EEC knows how much fuel to add to get the mixture right.

Until you get a MAF in there that won't peg, you are best to do the same.

Here are the old SHO Shop settings for my car to add extra fuel when the Lincoln Mark VIII 80 mm MAF is pegged, and these require adjustment for boost level, engine efficiency, the colour of your hair, etc. etc.

Functions -> WOT Fuel Multiplier vs. RPM

X, Y (RPM, AFR multiplier)
0, 1
0, 1
0, 1
950, 0.98438
2550, 0.92188
4150, 0.84375
5750, 0.72656
16384, 0.57813

To put that in plain english, at 950 RPM, at WOT, the EEC will multiply the stabilized fuel table AFR setting of 12.6:1 by 0.984 to get 12.4:1 as the commanded fuel. Obviously the MAF won't be pegged by 950 RPM, so this ends up richening up the fuel mixture, which may be desired. I prefer modifying the stabilized fuel table AFR directly, so the numbers are plain and easy to read (12.6 = 12.6 ...) and leave the WOT multipler at 1 for all entries, so then you can take load into the equation, but YMMV ...

The whole list is:

950 RPM, stock is 12.6:1, and this is changed to 12.4:1
2550 RPM, stock is 12.6:1, and this is changed to 11.5:1
4150 RPM, stock is ~12.5:1, and this is changed to 10.5:1
5750 RPM, stock is ~12.2:1, and this is changed to 8.8:1
16384 RPM, stock is ~11.4:1, and this is changed to 6.5:1

The stock programming is actually 11.4 for anything past 6800 at full load, so the the above means a gradual change from 8.8:1 to 6.5:1 between 5750 RPM and 16384 RPM, or about 0.2 AFR less per 1000 RPM increase. IOW, 8000 RPM would be about 8.4:1. Clearly this is compensating for a pegged MAF ... when 12:1-11.5:1 (the stock programming for anything over ~6200 RPM) is actually more closer to being appropriate for a properly tuned blower motor at high boost/RPM WHEN YOU KNOW HOW MUCH AIR IS GOING INTO THE ENGINE If you look at my stabilized fuel table, you'll see I take this approach, going down to 12:1 at 5600 RPM and 11.5:1 at 6000 RPM and 11:1 for anything over 6800 RPM. I'm not saying my car is properly tuned, but I like to think I'm on the right track

When tuning a blower car, you really need a WB to make sure you are not going lean for ANY reason (injector settings, pegged MAF, low fuel pressure ...). Thus blindly plugging in a program for another car may be dangerious to your car's health

Anyway, not wanting to start a tuning thread, just wanted to warn you that my program may make a blower car go lean at high boost/RPM if you have a Mark VIII 80 mm MAF, I need to add a disclaimer to my TwEECer page.

Adam is my go-to guy for helping people tune, BTW, so ask him your q's

I'm also glad that SHOBros have committed to working with us on tuning solutions for the good of the whole SHO community, and I can finally comment on old SHO Shop programming without worrying

 

[jeanrw2000]

The basics of the car are pretty much the same - blower, cams, injectors, FPR, so it won't be too far off. I set my idle at 1200, that probably explains your high idle My +40's (bigger than Stage II's) don't like to idle, especially with so much drag on the motor at idle from my centrifugal air cleaner .....

Now - and this is CRITICAL - the Mark VIII 80 MAF will peg on a boosted motor, and the EEC has NO idea that all that extra air is going into the engine. When it does that, my programming has NO extra fuel to compensate for that (I use a MAF that won't peg, see below). The old SHO Shop blower programming would simply throw extra fuel on the motor when the MAF was pegged and the EEC was running blind with respect to knowing how much air was going into the engine, so it was really a WAG.

I take the safer approach and actually measure the air going into the engine, by using a MAF that won't peg, so the EEC knows how much fuel to add to get the mixture right.

Until you get a MAF in there that won't peg, you are best to do the same.

Here are the old SHO Shop settings for my car to add extra fuel when the Lincoln Mark VIII 80 mm MAF is pegged, and these require adjustment for boost level, engine efficiency, the colour of your hair, etc. etc.

Functions -> WOT Fuel Multiplier vs. RPM

X, Y (RPM, AFR multiplier)
0, 1
0, 1
0, 1
950, 0.98438
2550, 0.92188
4150, 0.84375
5750, 0.72656
16384, 0.57813

To put that in plain english, at 950 RPM, at WOT, the EEC will multiply the stabilized fuel table AFR setting of 12.6:1 by 0.984 to get 12.4:1 as the commanded fuel. Obviously the MAF won't be pegged by 950 RPM, so this ends up richening up the fuel mixture, which may be desired. I prefer modifying the stabilized fuel table AFR directly, so the numbers are plain and easy to read (12.6 = 12.6 ...) and leave the WOT multipler at 1 for all entries, so then you can take load into the equation, but YMMV ...

The whole list is:

950 RPM, stock is 12.6:1, and this is changed to 12.4:1
2550 RPM, stock is 12.6:1, and this is changed to 11.5:1
4150 RPM, stock is ~12.5:1, and this is changed to 10.5:1
5750 RPM, stock is ~12.2:1, and this is changed to 8.8:1
16384 RPM, stock is ~11.4:1, and this is changed to 6.5:1

The stock programming is actually 11.4 for anything past 6800 at full load, so the the above means a gradual change from 8.8:1 to 6.5:1 between 5750 RPM and 16384 RPM, or about 0.2 AFR less per 1000 RPM increase. IOW, 8000 RPM would be about 8.4:1. Clearly this is compensating for a pegged MAF ... when 12:1-11.5:1 (the stock programming for anything over ~6200 RPM) is actually more closer to being appropriate for a properly tuned blower motor at high boost/RPM WHEN YOU KNOW HOW MUCH AIR IS GOING INTO THE ENGINE If you look at my stabilized fuel table, you'll see I take this approach, going down to 12:1 at 5600 RPM and 11.5:1 at 6000 RPM and 11:1 for anything over 6800 RPM. I'm not saying my car is properly tuned, but I like to think I'm on the right track

When tuning a blower car, you really need a WB to make sure you are not going lean for ANY reason (injector settings, pegged MAF, low fuel pressure ...). Thus blindly plugging in a program for another car may be dangerious to your car's health

Anyway, not wanting to start a tuning thread, just wanted to warn you that my program may make a blower car go lean at high boost/RPM if you have a Mark VIII 80 mm MAF, I need to add a disclaimer to my TwEECer page.

Adam is my go-to guy for helping people tune, BTW, so ask him your q's

I'm also glad that SHOBros have committed to working with us on tuning solutions for the good of the whole SHO community, and I can finally comment on old SHO Shop programming without worrying

thanks for your replay i appreciated

no take much of your time but, i have a 90mm Lighting MAF with me, would your file that i am running now work with it?

thanks
Jean.

 

[SHO NUT]

thanks for your replay i appreciated

no take much of your time but, i have a 90mm Lighting MAF with me, would your file that i am running now work with it?

thanks
Jean.

It at least won't go dangeriously lean like when the Lincoln Mark VIII 80 mm MAF is pegged with my program, but you'll still need to tweak the tune some. My tune is for a Lightning 80, i.e. I use the 80MMLMAF.MAF curve.

With a Lightning 90, the curve you'd use with my program (or any program) is 90MMLMAF.MAF (which stands for 90 mm Lightning MAF)

 

[jeanrw2000]

It at least won't go dangeriously lean like when the Lincoln Mark VIII 80 mm MAF is pegged with my program, but you'll still need to tweak the tune some. My tune is for a Lightning 80, i.e. I use the 80MMLMAF.MAF curve.

With a Lightning 90, the curve you'd use with my program (or any program) is 90MMLMAF.MAF (which stands for 90 mm Lightning MAF)

thanks i think i am going to work on changing the MAFs and wiring this afternoon then!

Jean.

 

[SHO NUT]

thanks i think i am going to work on changing the MAFs and wiring this afternoon then!

Jean.

Wiring? You know we have a plug and play adaptor for the Lightning MAF's on our Performance page, right?

 

[jeanrw2000]

Wiring? You know we have a plug and play adaptor for the Lightning MAF's on our Performance page, right?

I Know, i know believe or not i could be a little handy sometimes .
But not to worry There is no doubt shonutperformance has not seing the last of me yet

There will be more of me, on shonutperformance's web site in the months to come....

BTW i send you an email last week or so, about the FPR gauge, did you got it?

jean

 

[TYSHO]

Wiring? You know we have a plug and play adaptor for the Lightning MAF's on our Performance page, right?

I've been keeping an eye on that for the parts I need. I was just wondering if this wiring is long enough to reach the SS MAF location without extending them too much like I see in some S/C'r engine bay pictures. Basically, when plugged up, will the wiring still have slack?

BTW, I love that option compared to a hack job.

 

[jeanrw2000]

I've been keeping an eye on that for the parts I need. I was just wondering if this wiring is long enough to reach the SS MAF location without extending them too much like I see in some S/C'r engine bay pictures. Basically, when plugged up, will the wiring still have slack?

BTW, I love that option compared to a hack job.

You should plenty of slack with josh's plug and play adactor i don't have one of his, but it look like in the picture like an extention that you would hook to your existing MAF harness and onto your new ligthning MAF sensor, so you should gain a few inches of cable i think.

 

[SHO NUT]

I've been keeping an eye on that for the parts I need. I was just wondering if this wiring is long enough to reach the SS MAF location without extending them too much like I see in some S/C'r engine bay pictures. Basically, when plugged up, will the wiring still have slack?

BTW, I love that option compared to a hack job.

You will have lots of slack.

We also have longer kits for MAF relocations, in pretty much any flavour ...

 

[SHO NUT]

I Know, i know believe or not i could be a little handy sometimes .
But not to worry There is no doubt shonutperformance has not seing the last of me yet

There will be more of me, on shonutperformance's web site in the months to come....

BTW i send you an email last week or so, about the FPR gauge, did you got it?

jean

I did, just getting caught up

 

[somedude_001]

how many pounds of boost will the lincon 80mm take? i can't afford the lightning one right now, and my car will be done soon. will it take 6-8psi?

 

[TYSHO]

how many pounds of boost will the lincon 80mm take? i can't afford the lightning one right now, and my car will be done soon. will it take 6-8psi?

Sell your Lincoln, you'll have enough to buy 1 or 2 Lightning MAF's! A new 90mm can be had for $80-90 shipped if you look in the right place! And used low mile 80mm's can be had for half that.

 

[jeanrw2000]

Sell your Lincoln, you'll have enough to buy 1 or 2 Lightning MAF's! A new 90mm can be had for $80-90 shipped if you look in the right place! And used low mile 80mm's can be had for half that.

Agreeded.

I love EBaY!! :cry:
My best friend.

 

[jeanrw2000]

Anyways i installed my 90mm MAF just to find out that i need it a 4"X3.5" Coupler to attach the MAF to the Intake pipe!

So i ordered one From EBAY!!! and now i am just waiting for it

Looking forward to my next Dyno!

Jean.