turbo shot craps (im pretty sure)

[navcruiter]

I have been having a persistent issue in top gear, just poking along, my car seems to have a hesitation/shudder/jerking when ascending a hill about 60 mph. I took it to the dealer, but of course I got the "could not duplicate". I have been pretty busy, so I just didnt worry about it. Over the weekend, I went to get the oil changed at sears, when the service manager asks me if my car was still under warranty. I said, "kinda, It has the powertrain warranty anyway". He takes me out, and shows me the rear turbo. It has a fairly obvious oil leak. Right away, i'm thinking oil return line. Tonight i'm on my way home, and I start thinking, if there is oil leaking from the outside of the turbo, who is to say there couldnt be oil leaking inside the turbo. When I got home, I pulled the intake hoses off the intake plenum, and the one from the rear turbo going to the intercooler, and sure enough, there it is plain as day. A whole bunch of oil inside the pipes. Pulled out the MAP off the top of the intake, it to is loaded up with oil. I wonder what kind of BS the dealer is going to make up this time, about " thats a normal characteristic for a car with turbos". My question is, Has anyone else had this problem, or an accumulation of engine oil in the intake hoses. Thanks in advance.

 

[somedude_001]

if you popped the hoses off and they are dripping oil there may be a problem. But turbos do seep some oil into your intake pipes. That is just the nature of the beast. My experience comes from working with a tone of 2.7 and 1.8 audi/WV turbo engines. oil is normal in the pipes but like I said it should not be dripping out when you pull your lower hoses. If there was a lot of oil in your exhaust it would be smoking under boost... on second though you probably still have all of your cats in place so it might not smoke.

I just don't want you to go in there with the expectation that your intake pipes should be spotless.

 

[navcruiter]

Turbo failure

oh no, I know they shouldnt be spotless, Turbo's, at least the compressor side are under a lot of vacuum when the engine is at idle, and not in a boost state, but the junctions of the pipes have a moderate to large accumulation of oil. as well as the map being completely saturated with oil. Not to mention there is oil EXTERNAL on the turbo housing. I'm sure that they will do their best to come up with some lame ass excuse as to how it is "normal operation" then once the waranty period has expired, it will all of a sudden require a turbo replacement at my expense. I hope that it does not sound like i'm jumping all over you, I'm not. I'm frustrated with the level of service , and the run-around i'm getting. If anyone has any recommendations about a dealership in the Kansas City Metro Area, Please let me know. I've about had it.

 

[roland]

Might try Joe Machens in columbia. I haven't heard anything bad about them and they do BMW, toyota, and a few others. Otherwise google some ford dealerships near KC and see what kind of reviews you find.

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

I have had my Throttle Body off twice and there is very little blow by in that area. My intake was very clean both times. A paper towel had very little soot and NO OIL on it. The only dark area was a small triangular soot line at the bottom of the TB. Our EB Engines have a oil catch can built into the rear valve cover that catches oil blow by and then overflows back to the engine, for the very purpose of keeping intake clean. So if you have oil in the rubber hose that attaches to the TB that is NOT NORMAL.

If you need pix, I have some earlier ones of this area. I also have a new scope that I can stick thru MAPv sensor hole in the intake and take pix of that area... Just haven't found the time to use it yet.

Since I occasionally spray water/methanol, my intake does get a bath, but the earliest pix were before spray was installed.

 

[nynd]

I have had my Throttle Body off twice and there is very little blow by in that area. My intake was very clean both times. A paper towel had very little soot and NO OIL on it. The only dark area was a small triangular soot line at the bottom of the TB. Our EB Engines have a oil catch can built into the rear valve cover that catches oil blow by and then overflows back to the engine, for the very purpose of keeping intake clean. So if you have oil in the rubber hose that attaches to the TB that is NOT NORMAL.

If you need pix, I have some earlier ones of this area. I also have a new scope that I can stick thru MAPv sensor hole in the intake and take pix of that area... Just haven't found the time to use it yet.

Since I occasionally spray water/methanol, my intake does get a bath, but the earliest pix were before spray was installed.

Can you post a pic of that catch can -I'm curious to see where its located.
TIA.

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

It's on the rear valve cover closer to the passenger end. There are a few rubber hoses that attach to it. You can see it on this pix... the oval black pod that sits on top of the rear valve cover with a drop section that hooks into the cover.



Here are a few pix of my clean intake manifold & TB.









This came off the bottom of the throttle body, and was most of what had built up over about 16,000 mi. My Pontiac G8 was much worse than this at 1/2 the miles. I then installed an aftermarket catch can on it. Accumulates blow by oil at about an ounce every 2,000 miles of driving. Hopes all of this helps.

 

[nynd]

Thanks for the quick update with pics. Your Flex looks like its really modded to haul! Nice stuff!

 

[navcruiter]

Well, looks like the AFT turbo is bad, and the dealership agrees. Part is on order, and they should have it in about 3 days. The only thing that worries me, is that they have never replaced one on an ECOboost before, so hopefully I get someone working on it that can figure it out. Dealership said should take about 7-8 hours. guess we will see how this goes. Thanks for the feedback. I'll keep you posted

 

[TonyTheTIger57]

My 2010 SHO did the same thing, they replaced the turbo and cleaned the mess up. Mine was the front turbo.

 

[navcruiter]

maybe it's just a missouri thing. I havent heard of a rash of turbo failures on this engine yet.

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

It's the water....

 

[navcruiter]

HOLY CRAP. Was Cleaning the Map Sensors and IAT sensors tonight of oil. Noticed that the Front Turbo is leaking oil now. I have never had a tune in it or anything. They are probably think I did something to it.

 

[cheech]

I replaced mine earlier this year. Looks a lot worse but not a bad job. Here are some pics of the process
http://www.shoforum.com/showthread.php?t=120105

 

[blaine109]

So after reading this and pursuing a solution to a power issue on my car I went and pulled the MAP sensor on my car and took a few photos. The first picture (a little blurry and doesn't show as much oil as there really was) shows the amount of oil that came off the "cage" around the little sensor itself while the second picture shows how much is gunked up on the MAP sensor.

My question is this: Is this normal looking? If not, what hoses do I need to inspect for oil next to see if I may have a turbo failure and where are they located at?

I've been in and out of the dealership trying to resolve a power issue and bad MAP sensor readings could explain a lot about it opening up the BOV and letting all my boost out!!!

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

Nice hands!!!!

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

As I stated elsewhere... this is not normal... You need to pull the Intake Tube from Intercooler to TB and if there is oil in it... it isn't from blow-by. Hope there isn't any, but my guess is that you will find oil. My MAPv and intake do not have any signs of oil... checked several times over 35,000 mi.

 

[blaine109]

Okay, so I woke up this morning eager to get a good look inside my intake pipe.

Not the best pictures but here's of my Intake Pipe. There was a nice film of oil covering the entire inside of the pipe that I could see but it did seem to have puddled a bit in the bottom of the pipe (gotta love gravity). I didn't include the picture because it was poor quality but there was oil on the sensor just inside of this pipe.

Oil wiped from Intake Pipe. You can really get an idea of how much oil may be collected in my intake, this was only a small swab of the intake pipe (I didn't want to clean it all away so that the dealership would say something stupid like "that's normal".

BOV. You can see the oil puddled on the bottom of the BOV pipe in the second picture and get a better feel of what the intake pipe looked like.

Oil swab from BOV pipe.

Now the fun stuff. What all components do I need to consider having thoroughly cleaned and/or replaced if it is indeed coming from one of the turbos (which at this point I'm assuming so)?
Turbo - replace
Intake pipe - thoroughly cleaned or replaced
BOV - replace?
All sensors from turbo to manifold - replace
Intake manifold - thoroughly cleaned
Throttle body - thoroughly cleaned
Intercooler - can it be cleaned or should i have it replaced?
Spark Plugs - You think these may be gunked a bit with oil?
Anything else I'm missing here guys?

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

Good list... Not sure what needs replacing vs cleaning. Sensors are about $100. each, and not sure if they could be cleaned without damage. Plugs are cheap. Intercooler might need to be removed to clean, as all turbo to TB piping. Intake might be able to be cleaned on car, depending on how bad it is.

 

[navcruiter]

better get it to the dealership. That is EXACTLY how mine was. Tell your dealership to call Metro Ford in independence. if they dont believe u have bad turbos. Best of luck man, I've been fighting this issue with a loss of power for a couple months now.