Tire Help/Questions

[SpAz]

Hey guys,

I took my car into the dealership this morning because I had a low tire pressure sensor flick on last night. I take my vehicle into a Lincoln dealership close to our office since they service and take care of all of our work vehicles (Fords) This is about the fourth time it has happened in the last five months or so, I'm assuming it has a lot to do with how the temperatures fluctuate here in CO.

Anyways, the front two tires were slightly under-inflated so they took care of that. As the lincoln service guy returns my keys he says 'you need to replace all four tires seeing as they have worn all the way down to the wear bar.' Which I'm assuming means the last 2/32nd (someone correct me if I'm wrong here)

Upon hearing this my head nearly exploded. I have roughly 12,500 miles on my car and I need four new tires? I drive my SHO as a daily driver and I'm actually pretty easy on it. I don't take turns like a mad man and I rarely romp on it. I also don't drive it in the snow or other inclement conditions as I have a work SUV.

So after he told me this I decided to take the car to the Ford dealership I purchased it from and had them take a look at the treads. The assistant manger agreed with the lincoln dealership and said that I need to replace all four tires on my car.

I asked if he had seen a car go through tires so quick and he said no but he wasn't surprised seeing that this was a 'performance car with performance tires'. I also asked if Ford or Goodyear would think this to be odd or if they'd consider helping me out. He said that neither of them would be able to do anything... I also inquired to the extended wheel/tire warranty that I purchased and if they helped me out any. The reply was no.

So here is where I have a few questions:

What are you guys noticing with wear on your tires?

What mileages have you guys been replacing yours?

With the suspension issues I've had with this car do I have any leverage whatsoever with Ford to get these tires replaced or am I going to have to eat this cost?

What are you guys replacing the Eagle F1s with?

The service guy gave me a few different replacement options. I could replace them with Eagle F1s for $1,562 w/ no warranty or he recommended I go with the Michelin Primacy MXV4s for 1,417. They apparently have a 6year/60,000mile warranty.

To be honest (rant) I'm not impressed with this vehicle. I've had numerous issues that in my opinion have yet to be fully resolved and it seems like I constantly have new problems popping up with this car. If I'm going to have to factor in another $125 a month (new tires every 12 months) I'm not going to do it. I can't justify spending that kind of money on a vehicle I'm not too thrilled about.

What say you?

 

[freqz]

Just about any tires you buy are going to last longer than the F1s. For a DD you're going to want all season tires. The Michelins should be good. Continental makes a pretty decent tire in that size too.


Save the performance tires for the track.

 

[SpAz]

I just got off the phone with Ford Corporate. As soon as i said I needed new tires at 12,500miles the representative sound shocked but said they couldn't do anything and that I needed to call Goodyear.

I called Goodyear and they said that it is on Ford and that they have nothing to do with this. I've called two separate dealerships and they said that they Eagle F1s on the SHO or Flex are averaging 18,000 -20,000 before needing replacement.

I'm calling Ford corporate again. This is out of hand.

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

I would highly recommend Continental Extreme DWS - Great all-season performance tire that lasts if car is aligned properly. Both TireRack & Discount Tire Direct carry them. TireRack's price is $1012. for 4 + Shipping. They also have the Michelin Primacy shown above for $1,060. + shipping. Both tires are rated similarly well by their customers, and have wear ratings about 2 1/2 to 3 times as long as F-1's. (Size 245-45-20)

 

[esfoad]

+1 on the Michelin Primacy's. I have 21000 miles on mine and they have not yet reached the half way point in wear. I have also heard good things about the Contis. I can say that the Michelins are also quiet. However, understand that you will be giving up some handling with this change. Nothing is free my friend.

 

[1993MTXSHO]

Michelins suck. I'm a tire dealer for a living, yes that's all I do, sell tires. We have tons or warrently claims with them, and their customer service is just flat out bad. So I would never reccomend Michelin to anyone, they're way over priced for what you get. Now don't get me wrong they're not bad tires, but just not the best for what you're paying.

Goodyears are fair, they're kind of pricy, but IMO their technology has not really gotten much better over the years. If you want a good tires for the money, go Toyo hands down. Grab a set of proxes 4's or something. Good all season, good performance and shouldn't wear out like your first set.

Just know that performance tires wear out faster, that's typical. I'm not THAT suprised they wore out that fast being that it's on an awd that weights 4400lbs and it's a performance geared tire (read: designed to perform well, nothing else matters).

Now if you're looking for a tire with a treadwear warrently you'll have to get out of the performance market, but on a SHO, you're going to want a performance tire to truely enjoy the car.


EDIT: Here's a goodyear consumer relations number we use, try giving them a call and see if they'll do anything for you.

(800) 321-2136

 

[SpAz]

Update:

I've talked to a total of five service departments and five different dealerships and not a single representative has seen any SHO or Flex in need of replacements below 18,000 with the average replacement being in the low 20,000mile range.

I put in another call to Ford and explained this to them along with Goodyear's response that this is not their problem because they are not 'purchased' tires and even if they were 'purchased' tires the Eagle F1s come with no warranty on them.

Ford said that they cannot do anything and that I need to go back to the dealership to talk to them. I put in a call to the sales manager to make him aware of what's going on. I was put back in touch with the assistant service manager and I have an appointment to bring my vehicle in tomorrow to have it looked at to determine whether or not there might be an alignment issue or any other issues that may cause the premature wear (yes this IS premature wear if I'm the only one experiencing this, especially if I'm driving it as a DD without racing, without driving it in inclement weather)

The dealership will have a representative from Ford corporate on site tomorrow as they take a look at it. I am willing to bet that they will put it up on the rack, say all is fine and dandy, then I'll be stuck with a vehicle that needs new tires.

If Ford doesn't recognize a vehicle that has gone through extensive suspension work and ends up having premature tire wear as an issue, I will be speaking to Ford corporate once again letting them know that this is the last Ford vehicle I purchase based on their inability to resolve previous issues (see previous posts about clicking noise, awd issues, etc) and will be trading in my car for a non Ford product. I will also be pushing our business to purchase non Ford products once we are in need of replacement fleet vehicles.

Tomorrow will be interesting.

 

[SpAz]

By the way, what has everyone around here been experiencing for replacement mileage?

 

[Unknown_Driver]

you don't always have to buy replacement tires at the dealership LOL


you can order some Nitto NT 420S from discount tire and be inbetween the grip and long lasting life of the michelin's

 

[SpAz]

you don't always have to buy replacement tires at the dealership LOL


you can order some Nitto NT 420S from discount tire and be inbetween the grip and long lasting life of the michelin's

That's not the point.

The point is that these tires have obviously worn out prematurely and that it is not a cost I should absorb; especially after having gone through every other problem with this vehicle.

If every major dealership in this state has said 'wow, that is way too low of mileage to see such wear even on Eagle F1s' something is wrong and I shouldn't have to pay for it.

 

[SHOrod]

Have you taken a look at the tires to determine if they all look the same from a wear perspective, such as even across the tread surface versus primarily wearing on the inner or outer edge of the tires?

I haven't checked the maintenance manual to see what the recommended tire rotation interval is, but if you haven't followed the recommended interval (I'm used to around 5k miles) the dealer may be able to use that as a reason to void any tire warranty that may exist. If the tires are all wearing similarly and the wear is across the entire tread surface, that would indicate they have been properly inflated, the alignment is fine, and it's not due to aggressive driving.

-Rod

 

[mjhpadi]

I just got off the phone with Ford Corporate. As soon as i said I needed new tires at 12,500miles the representative sound shocked but said they couldn't do anything and that I needed to call Goodyear.

I called Goodyear and they said that it is on Ford and that they have nothing to do with this. I've called two separate dealerships and they said that they Eagle F1s on the SHO or Flex are averaging 18,000 -20,000 before needing replacement.

I'm calling Ford corporate again. This is out of hand.

I'm not surprised that you are getting the runaround from everyone. This is the same story I got from Michelin when I had their Cross Terrain SUV tires wear out after 19,000 miles. Michelin refused to do anything...I will NEVER purchase a Michelin tire again. I bought Bridgestone REVO's and they went over 50K before needing replaced (extended cab F-150)...I think I would look at Brdgestone before making a finally decision. Also look at Tire Rack, you can get a baseline cost before buying from any dealer...I have found that most tire dealers will come down on price if you take the Tire Rack price along when you talk to them. However, 12,500 miles on a Hi-Po tire does not surprise me...those soft tread compounds that grip, really don't last long.

 

[mjhpadi]

Have you taken a look at the tires to determine if they all look the same from a wear perspective, such as even across the tread surface versus primarily wearing on the inner or outer edge of the tires?

I haven't checked the maintenance manual to see what the recommended tire rotation interval is, but if you haven't followed the recommended interval (I'm used to around 5k miles) the dealer may be able to use that as a reason to void any tire warranty that may exist. If the tires are all wearing similarly and the wear is across the entire tread surface, that would indicate they have been properly inflated, the alignment is fine, and it's not due to aggressive driving.

-Rod

Great points, I have found (in my our unscientific way) that tire rotation and inflation are very important to extending tire life...this is even more critical with the high performance tires, it can make thousands of miles difference in the life of the tire by just checking inflation weekly and rotating at regular intervals.

 

[SpAz]

Have you taken a look at the tires to determine if they all look the same from a wear perspective, such as even across the tread surface versus primarily wearing on the inner or outer edge of the tires?

I haven't checked the maintenance manual to see what the recommended tire rotation interval is, but if you haven't followed the recommended interval (I'm used to around 5k miles) the dealer may be able to use that as a reason to void any tire warranty that may exist. If the tires are all wearing similarly and the wear is across the entire tread surface, that would indicate they have been properly inflated, the alignment is fine, and it's not due to aggressive driving.

-Rod

I've rotated the tires twice and next week I was scheduled for maintenance-oil/rotation. If i recall correctly Ford rotated tires and realigned the vehicle after they did the suspension work which would mean I've rotated them three times.

I stopped by a Goodyear shop and the rep said that except for one tire they are wearing evenly. He also said that regardless of vehicle there is no reason for a DD to have worn through those treads at 12,500 miles. He said that the lowest he has seen treads go that fast is at about 18,000-20,000miles.

He said that with as many times as I've rotated the tires you can't get a real feel as to if there is incorrect wear because they'll eventually wear even if they're being rotated often.

I spoke to another service manager and he said that the lowest he has had to replace them was at 18,000miles and it was for an owner that races it at our local track and has done other performance modifications to it.... He mentioned that even if the alignment is correct there may be another issue that is causing it to drive at a steeper angle? (I don't know what he's talking about here)

Man this is frustrating.

 

[SpAz]

Update:

I pulled out all of my service sheets to look at them. These are the three visits after Ford had my car for a week messing around with the front end.

I went in for my first oil change at 5,141 miles and had them look at the front end for the popping noise that was still present while putting the car into drive or reverse (supposed to have been fixed)

Work report:

5000mile service
Oil&filter change. Tire rotation and multi-point inspection
There is a popping noise when putting vehicle into gear, could not verify noise. Check oasis for messages - none found for concern.

Tire Report is as follows:

Left Front
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Front
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Left Rear
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Rear
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK

At 7,210 I brought it in after it threw a tire sensor light.

Work report:

Low tire light is on. Repair tire if needed, test tire pressure system. No DTCS. Check tire pressure and top off. Retain sensors and reconfigure module. Light off.

Tire report:

Left Front

Tire Tread Depth 7/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage a & Valve Stem -OK
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Front


Tire Tread Depth 7/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage a & Valve Stem -OK
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK


Left Rear
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Rear
Tire Tread Depth - 8/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage & Valve Stem - OK
Tire Pressure -set to factory recommended PSI - OK


I brought it back in at 8,698miles because the tire sensor once again flicked on. Performed 10,000mile maintenance including Oil&filter change. Tire rotation and multi-point inspection. Pop sound from right when putting into gear. Could not verify noise. Found T.S.B 10-22-4 Perform test. Passed one test and failed other. Contact hotline for further assistance

Tire Report:

Left Front

Tire Tread Depth 6/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage - OK
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Front

Tire Tread Depth 6/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage - OK
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Left Rear

Tire Tread Depth 5/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage - Outside Edge
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Right Rear

Tire Tread Depth 6/32"
Tire Wear Pattern/Damage - OK
Tire Pressure - set to factory recommended PSI - OK

Notes:

Found all tires at 32psi. Bumped to 36psi. Both front tires are wearing unevenly and right front worse (now moved to rear)




And so I brought it in today at 12,800 miles for yet another Tire Sensor light. They checked all tires and it was one in the front that triggered it. Adjusted the PSI and light went off.

I have 2/32" on all four tires.


How does the car go 5,000miles with retaining 8/32" of tread and 7,000miles later it is down to 2/32"??? Keep in mind they took apart and reassembled the front end/suspension at 4,000miles if i recall correctly.

Something isn't adding up here. Any thoughts?

 

[wchain]

Spaz,

The Eagle F1 Supercar tires are included in the 12S performance package. They are VERY soft and handle great, however, on a big heavy 4 Door car, I wouldn't expect them to last but 15K miles or so. These are the OEM tires that come on the Mustang GT500 and other cars. They handle amazing on a big car like ours. But if you look, the treadwear rating is 220. Very soft.

Regarding replacements, 245/45R20 keeps us limited. This is a low profile aggressive tire, so most tires in this size aren't going to give you a long treadlife. The Michelin Primacy MXV4 should offer MUCH better treadlife vs the Eagle F1 Supercar. Other choices are the Firestone Wide Oval Indy 500, Continental has something, General Exclaim UHP, and Hankook as the V12 Evo. I would go for the MXV4. They probably wont handle as tenaciously as the F1s, but if you don't corner REAL aggressively, you wont feel the difference. My 2010 with the 12S had its tires at the wear bar when it was repurchased at 9900 miles.

I find that Goodyears quality is really inconsistent these days.

I purchased some Michelins a while back when they were on sale (set of 4 for 600 bucks), and I have them sitting in the garage until my Eagle F1s wear out.

I know you're frustrated, but with the Eagle F1s, thats to be expected. Note that the Flex Ecoboost does not use Eagle F1 supercar tires. I think less than half of us here are running them. Most everyone here has hard loaded cars that did not get the Perf Pack.

 

[SpAz]

Spaz,

The Eagle F1 Supercar tires are included in the 12S performance package. They are VERY soft and handle great, however, on a big heavy 4 Door car, I wouldn't expect them to last but 15K miles or so. These are the OEM tires that come on the Mustang GT500 and other cars. They handle amazing on a big car like ours. But if you look, the treadwear rating is 220. Very soft.

Regarding replacements, 245/45R20 keeps us limited. This is a low profile aggressive tire, so most tires in this size aren't going to give you a long treadlife. The Michelin Primacy MXV4 should offer MUCH better treadlife vs the Eagle F1 Supercar. Other choices are the Firestone Wide Oval Indy 500, Continental has something, General Exclaim UHP, and Hankook as the V12 Evo. I would go for the MXV4. They probably wont handle as tenaciously as the F1s, but if you don't corner REAL aggressively, you wont feel the difference. My 2010 with the 12S had its tires at the wear bar when it was repurchased at 9900 miles.

I find that Goodyears quality is really inconsistent these days.

I purchased some Michelins a while back when they were on sale (set of 4 for 600 bucks), and I have them sitting in the garage until my Eagle F1s wear out.

I know you're frustrated, but with the Eagle F1s, thats to be expected. Note that the Flex Ecoboost does not use Eagle F1 supercar tires. I think less than half of us here are running them. Most everyone here has hard loaded cars that did not get the Perf Pack.

Maybe I'm looking at this simplistically but at 5,000miles my tires wore a total of 2/32" (F1s come with 10/32" tread).

If you take the 5,000miles with 2/32" of tread wear that would be 1/32" of tread wear per 2,500 miles. If that tread wear remained consistent this is the mileage I could expect.

10/32" - New Tires 0miles
8/32" - 5,000miles
7/32" - 7,500miles
6/32" - 10,000
5/32" - 12,500
4/32" - 15,000
3/32" - 17,500
2/32" - 20,000

^^ That is roughly the mileage the Goodyear rep as well as 5 other Ford service guys said they've seen/expected with the Eagle F1s.

Mine looks like this:

10/32" - New Tires 0 miles
8/32" - 5,000miles
7/32" - 7,100miles
5-6/32" - 8,600miles
2/32" - 12,800 miles.

I went through 6/32" of tread in 7,800 miles. Or 1/32" of tread per 1,300miles. For some reason between 5,000miles and 12,800 miles my tire wear was accelerated and there are service documents that suggest uneven tire wear.

To me something seems a little odd that there is such an acceleration in wear AFTER they messed with my front end for a week.

If I were to average 1,300miles per 1/32" of tread my chart would have looked like this from day 1.

10/32" - New Tires 0miles
9/32" - 1,300miles
8/32" - 2,600miles
7/32" - 3,900miles
6/32" - 5,200miles
5/32" - 6,500miles
4/32" - 7,800miles
3/32" - 9,100miles
2/32" - 10,400miles


^^^ That does not support what the several dealerships are saying they've experienced with other SHOs equipped with the Eagle F1, nor does it support what the goodyear rep said he has seen in mileage with the tire either.

Something isn't adding up here.

 

[mjhpadi]

Man this is frustrating.

I can't blame you for being frustrated. I think you have enough documentation, that it certainly won't hurt to contact Goodyear and see if they are willing to do anything to keep you as a customer...maybe some deal on a new set of tires or some kind of discount. Hope you can get this resolved to your satisfaction.

 

[Crazy8]

Goodyear sucks. I put Yokohamas on my old Mustang. Loved them. I also have them on my FX45, they are great in just about all weather conditions.

 

[EcoBrick Bob]

My Flex came with 255-45-20 Goodyear RS-A's. These tires on my friend's 08 BMW 535ix wagon went 45K. He replaced them with Continental Extreme DWS like I mentioned many posts ago on this thread. The Conti's handle much better according to him. I have Conti Extreme DW's which are a stickier summer version of the DWS. I have about 14K on them and have run them at the strip on many runs. Tires show very little wear. They also make the Flex feel like a sporty sedan. The Goodyear RS-A's in contrast, wander all over the place. Only time I will use them now is for winter trips to the northland. Hate them!. Yet... I had a set of 20"Goodyear Eagle GT II's on my Denali XL, and got 55K out of them.

If you contact TireRack, I deal with Mason Rush. Great customer rep who will never steer you wrong.

Per one of the other posters... Firestone Firehawk A/S are very good tires and are around $190. ea. (Part of the Bridgestone group).

Here is information that Ford Customer Service posted on Flex Net. Guy's name is Cory.

Ford Customer Service Division

p: 800.392.FORD
t: @FordCustService @Ford
f: facebook.com/Ford

They are very helpful to Flex owners with problems including uneven or excessive tire wear.