Stock Drivetrain Limits

[Cruxin]

Every car is only as good as it's weakest link. I've been trying to do some research on what fails first on the 2013+ PP SHO's once the bolt on list gets long, but I have not had much success. Common knowledge for Subaru guys is once you get over 300hp at the wheels on an EJ257 STi you are in danger of your piston ring lands failing. Are there common WHP #'s like this for the SHO platform? I've listed out some components below if you guys could fill in the blanks on what power level they fail.

Engine:
Pistons:
Rods:
Bearings:
Headgaskets:

Transmission:
PTU:
Driveshaft:
Axles:
Diffs:

Also has anyone done any 1/2 mile events and survived? Unlike this Mustang's driveshaft

 

[BamSHO]

We actually don't know the true limits yet. We do know the fluid need regularly changed out in the PTU. As for HP related failures, that is the million dollar question. I did a full season of drag racing with my tuned '12. No driveline or motor failures.

 

[rubydist]

as I understand it, the racing guys are running over 600 hp on stock internals, with the right tune, injectors, etc.

 

[SHOdded]

The GT now makes the 600+ hp figure with a PFI/DFI setup on the 3.5L EB in 2016. Crank hp, mind you. Plenty of Gen IV SHOs around already putting out well north of 500+ crank hp as DDs with stock internals (though supplemented with meth).

 

[Jedster1]

Ganassi's Daytona Prototype is making 600HP/450T . That's rules limited. There has to be more left in the motor., or they'd be having it!

Seems to me that the PTU is the weakest link, but I haven't heard of any blowing up yet.

http://www.chipganassiracing.com/Our-Teams/Ford-Chip-Ganassi-Racing-with-Felix-Sabates/Car.aspx

 

[SHOdded]

Seems to me that the PTU is the weakest link, but I haven't heard of any blowing up yet.

Maybe not thru Ford, but that's what we SHOwners (and PIowners) do on a regular basis to prove 'em wrong!

 

[Jedster1]

What? Blow them up? Regularly?
Or run crazy horsepower through them and they hold together?

 

[BamSHO]

There has been some failure due to poor tuning. Thru the grapevine, FORD's so called driveline failure number is just over 700np at the motor. Only couple of us are near that, but yes the PTU and the fluid in it seems to be the weak point.

 

[Cruxin]

Thanks guys! Super helpful. Has anyone found the limit with stock internals on Q16 or C23 fuel? Livernois what say you?

 

[shoblock]

PP's have different pistons and rings than non-PP. The reason is that these are police interceptor motors, designed to idle for a half hour then go to wide open throttle indefinitely. Ceramic is one of the premium materials. Can't divulge any more.
If you have a pp, you will have different limits than a non PP. Also, since earlier this year, all blocks now have fine thread main bearing caps, much stronger, though it will only apply to Flex, F150 and Explorer sport. Still something to consider during a rebuild.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

The GT now makes the 600+ hp figure with a PFI/DFI setup on the 3.5L EB in 2016. Crank hp, mind you. Plenty of Gen IV SHOs around already putting out well north of 500+ crank hp as DDs with stock internals (though supplemented with meth).

The new GT is a completely different animal. Different in every way all the way down to its fuel systemS.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Thanks guys! Super helpful. Has anyone found the limit with stock internals on Q16 or C23 fuel? Livernois what say you?

For EcoBoosts only use MS109.

 

[Vortech347]

PP's have different pistons and rings than non-PP. The reason is that these are police interceptor motors, designed to idle for a half hour then go to wide open throttle indefinitely. Ceramic is one of the premium materials. Can't divulge any more.
If you have a pp, you will have different limits than a non PP. Also, since earlier this year, all blocks now have fine thread main bearing caps, much stronger, though it will only apply to Flex, F150 and Explorer sport. Still something to consider during a rebuild.

Where did you reference this?

 

[Cruxin]

For EcoBoosts only use MS109.

What have you found to be the limit of the Trans/PTU?

PP's have different pistons and rings than non-PP. The reason is that these are police interceptor motors, designed to idle for a half hour then go to wide open throttle indefinitely. Ceramic is one of the premium materials. Can't divulge any more.
If you have a pp, you will have different limits than a non PP. Also, since earlier this year, all blocks now have fine thread main bearing caps, much stronger, though it will only apply to Flex, F150 and Explorer sport. Still something to consider during a rebuild.

Very helpful! One more tick in the "Pro column" for purchasing a PP.

 

[shoblock]

My expertise is confined to the engine. Haven't worked on the transmission side for over 8 years.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

What have you found to be the limit of the Trans/PTU?

Don't worry, we still have not hit the limit.

 

[BamSHO]

But I know couple of us are getting near it.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

bpd yes, everyone else not so much.

 

[shoblock]

Actually, many of the failures come from components you wouldn't expect. Today, we heard about a loose turbo drainback causing the loss of 4 quarts of oil. Coolant hose connections will drip under pressure while underway, then stop when you shut the engine off. Leaks occur around sensors, and cam covers. Most are very small leaks, undetected or ignored, that add up to an unacceptable amount of fluid loss.
Walk around your car, and look at the ground after you back out, at least once a week. Many ecoboost motors could have been saved by a simple owner observation!

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

But those are not limitations. Those are all random failures.