probe_racer
Active Member
edit on my reference to the connector im looking at it is a squarish connector next to the spout connector closest to ccrm
SHO ford probe project
- Thread starter probe_racer
- Start date
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probe_racer
Active Member
it helps when i removed one of the connectors from harness, the red/white wire was by itself so i traced to pin 6 of the DIS bottom left when looking at DIS from passenger side.
so now im thinking of extending this wire to the sho clutch switch harness so it kicks just like it would on sho.
probe_racer
Active Member
update finished removing all connectors i don't need and wires are all spliced to probe harness there was a need to extend some wires so i have the brake pedal for a signal as well as wiring the ecu to the interlock clutch switch, and there was a need to wire the also the O2 sensors to the probe harness so they get power to them.
what i noticed when tracing all the wires is that on connector C103 there is a wire that does not connect to anything is a black wire and a used a test light to trace it and it does not ground to anything or goes to anywhere, so im guessing is another dead lead just like the wires used for the EGR (this is from a non EGR car)
Engine will go in this week and will be run to see if there are any leaks or other issues. then it will be pulled to address any issues and 60k maintainance and some other goodies will be done to it.
I been thinking of running without CCRM but have yet to figure out what does what there other than the essentials such as fans, power relay and A/C relay.
pics coming up soon
what i noticed when tracing all the wires is that on connector C103 there is a wire that does not connect to anything is a black wire and a used a test light to trace it and it does not ground to anything or goes to anywhere, so im guessing is another dead lead just like the wires used for the EGR (this is from a non EGR car)
Engine will go in this week and will be run to see if there are any leaks or other issues. then it will be pulled to address any issues and 60k maintainance and some other goodies will be done to it.
I been thinking of running without CCRM but have yet to figure out what does what there other than the essentials such as fans, power relay and A/C relay.
pics coming up soon
ccrm is just a bunch of relays to allow the large amounts of current to run to various things - cooling fans, fuel pump, etc. - without killing the switches and wiring to turn those items on/off. you need to have the relays, you can use the ccrm or a bunch of individual relays.
probe_racer
Active Member
have run into an issue when it comes to removing the ccrm for individual relays
here is the issue.
I believe the AC system requires a 5 pin relay, from what i have gathered the sho computer sends a negative signal that powers up the relay to actually switch the AC compressor off.
such as follows
and when the relay is off power to compressor resumes, right???
any help is appreciated.
also i know, i know, search is my friend but the post on the IRCM/CCRM details has from what i gather wrong info on it since the 92 3.0 sho diagram i have for the CCRM is different than the one on the post that is why im soo comfused on this and trying to figure this out.
here is the issue.
I believe the AC system requires a 5 pin relay, from what i have gathered the sho computer sends a negative signal that powers up the relay to actually switch the AC compressor off.
such as follows
and when the relay is off power to compressor resumes, right???
any help is appreciated.
also i know, i know, search is my friend but the post on the IRCM/CCRM details has from what i gather wrong info on it since the 92 3.0 sho diagram i have for the CCRM is different than the one on the post that is why im soo comfused on this and trying to figure this out.
Off Road SHO
Moderator
That doesn't sound right to me. You are correct in that the relays are all hot at all times as long as the fuses that feed power to the CCRM are in. The PCM tells the individual relays to do their job of sending out large amounts of positive 12 volts to the fans, fuel pump and I thought the AC compressor, by sending a ground to the individual relays.
I can't imagine why Ford would want the AC compressor to always be "ON".
Most relays are wired "normally open" when the coil inside them is not activated.
Now I do know that when you go WOT, the PCM will dis-engage the AC compressor by taking away the 12 volts at the clutch (which of course was sent from the relay in the CCRM).
Tom
I can't imagine why Ford would want the AC compressor to always be "ON".
Most relays are wired "normally open" when the coil inside them is not activated.
Now I do know that when you go WOT, the PCM will dis-engage the AC compressor by taking away the 12 volts at the clutch (which of course was sent from the relay in the CCRM).
Tom
probe_racer
Active Member
from my understanding voltage goes through the ccrm to the compressor and the compressor disengages and engages when the pressure switch opens and closes. just like the one in the ford probe.
but in order to **** the AC compressor when racing then my understanding is that the computer activates a ground that then kills AC compressor but not the whole AC circuit.
so in the pic i posted, the pic on the left shows how the relay is when AC system is on, not racing, so just looking at the picture the power flows from AC circuit through connection connector 30 to connector 87a uninterrupted to the compressor, but when it gets the ground from the computer then the relay activates and kills the feed to compressor only, because the circuit is open and power now is going to connector 87 which in this case is not connected to anything.
Am I making any sense??
but in order to **** the AC compressor when racing then my understanding is that the computer activates a ground that then kills AC compressor but not the whole AC circuit.
so in the pic i posted, the pic on the left shows how the relay is when AC system is on, not racing, so just looking at the picture the power flows from AC circuit through connection connector 30 to connector 87a uninterrupted to the compressor, but when it gets the ground from the computer then the relay activates and kills the feed to compressor only, because the circuit is open and power now is going to connector 87 which in this case is not connected to anything.
Am I making any sense??
Off Road SHO
Moderator
Yes. So that relay is wired as a normally closed; normally meaning when no triggering ground is being sent to it, it is closed and completing the circuit, in this case powering up the clutch of the compressor.
Tom
Tom
probe_racer
Active Member
replacement of CCRM is almost done with individual relays, let me all remind you that the SHO engine and harness are from a 1992 3.0 SHO MTX and the probe has only a 1 speed fuel pump circuit on it, that is why im not using pin 11 on my ccrm which is for powering up second relay on sho for making fuel pump run faster.
let me know what you guys think and if i screwed up or not
the ECC power relay part i did as follows:
used CCRM pin 15 (ground) and a circuit on the ford probe probe that sends 12 (positive) volts to power up relay when key is at RUN and START, this in turns lets power from CCRM Pin 8 to flow to CCRM pin 24, this powers up the PCM and sensors attached to that wire.
for the FUEL PUMP relay i did as follows:
used CCRM pin 24 (hot when above ECCC power relay is on) and used CCRM pin 18 (ground activated by PCM) to power up relay, this in turn lets power flow from cable attached to positive battery terminal to pin 5 on ccrm to power up fuel pump.
just this alone from my understanding will let SHO engine run.
the rest should be done by monday and hopefully if what i just posted is right it will power up with no issues.
let me know what you guys think and if i screwed up or not
the ECC power relay part i did as follows:
used CCRM pin 15 (ground) and a circuit on the ford probe probe that sends 12 (positive) volts to power up relay when key is at RUN and START, this in turns lets power from CCRM Pin 8 to flow to CCRM pin 24, this powers up the PCM and sensors attached to that wire.
for the FUEL PUMP relay i did as follows:
used CCRM pin 24 (hot when above ECCC power relay is on) and used CCRM pin 18 (ground activated by PCM) to power up relay, this in turn lets power flow from cable attached to positive battery terminal to pin 5 on ccrm to power up fuel pump.
just this alone from my understanding will let SHO engine run.
the rest should be done by monday and hopefully if what i just posted is right it will power up with no issues.
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probe_racer
Active Member
update CCRM almost fully deleted.
fan has also been hooked up with an individual relay, this relay gets powered with power from CCRM pin 24 just like the one on fuel pump and gets ground from CCRM pin 14. the other two cables are attached to the probe electric fan circuit which is almost identical to SHO in how it works.
FOR air conditioning i did as follows:
need to remove the air conditioning wiring since I am running the stock wiring on the probe with the only modification that I am keeping the WAC so that the AC compressor disengages when at WOT this is SPECIFIC to my engine swap. this is done with a special 5 pin relay.
DIS pin 6 has been wired to the starter wire just like on SHO so that it only gets power when key is in "START".
fan has also been hooked up with an individual relay, this relay gets powered with power from CCRM pin 24 just like the one on fuel pump and gets ground from CCRM pin 14. the other two cables are attached to the probe electric fan circuit which is almost identical to SHO in how it works.
FOR air conditioning i did as follows:
need to remove the air conditioning wiring since I am running the stock wiring on the probe with the only modification that I am keeping the WAC so that the AC compressor disengages when at WOT this is SPECIFIC to my engine swap. this is done with a special 5 pin relay.
DIS pin 6 has been wired to the starter wire just like on SHO so that it only gets power when key is in "START".
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probe_racer
Active Member
OK so after all of this wiring with individual relays. this is what happened.
hooked up battery to car wiring and prayed a bit... everything powered up, fuel pump kicked in and all relays worked perfectly. only mishap i had was my fuel lines were disconnected so i spilled some gas on floor.
After cleaning the spilled gas and looped fuel lines with a piece of hose so there would be no more gas spills, did a self test on computer by jumpering the self test cables and it only complained of the fuel circuitry ( since I'm only using the single speed probe fuel pump).
Final thing I did even though i have no fuel attached to it was turn key to START and the engine cranked over and over with no issues so I'm happy about it, I'm more confident on this electrically now, I'm going to finish removing the extra wires for the AC that I don't need to maintain everything as simple as possible.
Will keep you guys updated with pics soon so anyone can see how much of the stock harness is not needed when doing SHO swaps.
hooked up battery to car wiring and prayed a bit... everything powered up, fuel pump kicked in and all relays worked perfectly. only mishap i had was my fuel lines were disconnected so i spilled some gas on floor.
After cleaning the spilled gas and looped fuel lines with a piece of hose so there would be no more gas spills, did a self test on computer by jumpering the self test cables and it only complained of the fuel circuitry ( since I'm only using the single speed probe fuel pump).
Final thing I did even though i have no fuel attached to it was turn key to START and the engine cranked over and over with no issues so I'm happy about it, I'm more confident on this electrically now, I'm going to finish removing the extra wires for the AC that I don't need to maintain everything as simple as possible.
Will keep you guys updated with pics soon so anyone can see how much of the stock harness is not needed when doing SHO swaps.
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Off Road SHO
Moderator
The CCRM only has 24 pins and the PCM only 60.
Pin 37 and 57 are bridged together and are the supply of 12 volts positive to sensors and injectors. Do not use 37 or 57 to power anything that takes a large amount of current like the fan or fuel pump.
I don't think the fan gets its power from the PCM or the CCRM, it gets it directly from the fuse block. So if you have a fuse in that position, the fan is getting 12 volt positive. What the fan is not getting is the return side, the ground to the negative side of the battery. This "grounding trigger" is supplied by the PCM. They do this so that they are not routing large amounts of current with their corresponding large guage wires through the PCM.
Tom
probe_racer
Active Member
EDIT
FIXED prior post
FIXED prior post
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probe_racer
Active Member
update i guess for the AC the computer requires a ground when AC is on, that is pin # 10 on pcm, which is pin 21 on ccrm as well this is a PK/LB which gets ground from the pressure switch on AC system when AC is on.
im assuming this ground is for kicking up the idle on the sho and for activating the WAC signal when at full throttle, does anyone have any more info on the function of this ground signal??
im assuming this ground is for kicking up the idle on the sho and for activating the WAC signal when at full throttle, does anyone have any more info on the function of this ground signal??
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Manuel,
My diagram shows that the ground from the A/C compressor goes to the CCRM as pin 16 and is a BLK wire. The other side of the A/C compressor is a BLk/YEL wire at pin 23.
The PK/LB goes to the CCRM as you indicate, but also goes to a Refrigerant Containment Switch (?) - whatever that is.
Hope this helps.
My diagram shows that the ground from the A/C compressor goes to the CCRM as pin 16 and is a BLK wire. The other side of the A/C compressor is a BLk/YEL wire at pin 23.
The PK/LB goes to the CCRM as you indicate, but also goes to a Refrigerant Containment Switch (?) - whatever that is.
Hope this helps.
Refrigeration containment on the tank on the suction line. Has switch so when freon low or out compressor does not run and suck in garbage. My understanding way Ford does wiring it shuts the compressor during wide open throttle to take that load off engine. Well at least that is way it is in my 2.3 turbo. Maurice
intimdatr
Got Cams?
That and so it doesnt explode when you hit 6500+ RPM. Its not good when ur a/c kicks in at 8000 RPM.
probe_racer
Active Member
moving foward on this project, the engine is fully in and all wired in but now i been made aware another issue, the oil pan sticks out past the subframe, it sticks out about 1" - 1.5" so now I'm faced with having to modify the oil pan so its shallow enough its not exposed to the elements which will also require trimming of the oil pickup, assuming there is space to do so.
has anyone done something similar before and what material is the pan made out of ??? aluminum?? any insight on this guys??
has anyone done something similar before and what material is the pan made out of ??? aluminum?? any insight on this guys??
Off Road SHO
Moderator
Yes, it's made of aluminum.
With it in the car, mark the level that you want the oilpan to be. Then take it, the pan's windage tray, the oil pickup and the crank girdle, to a machine shop. Tell them what you are trying to do and they will figure out what to do. Since the oil pickup is braced off of the crank girdle, they will be able to tell how much they will need to shorten the pickup tube to match what they take out of the pan.
Tom
With it in the car, mark the level that you want the oilpan to be. Then take it, the pan's windage tray, the oil pickup and the crank girdle, to a machine shop. Tell them what you are trying to do and they will figure out what to do. Since the oil pickup is braced off of the crank girdle, they will be able to tell how much they will need to shorten the pickup tube to match what they take out of the pan.
Tom
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