GearHead Tunes Experience/lessons learned.

[GotGrip?]

I'm not "hating" anyone. I'm just saying "auto octane" is complete marketing wank and some of you guys are lapping it up and regurgitating it like it's some great feature. It's just the factory EEC pulling timing with the factory knock sensors. My stock tune does the same thing. I simply don't understand the hype.

I don't have a dog in the fight either- hot rodding a transverse V6/FWD platform is not for me. I love my SHO, but I'm not dumping a bunch of money into modding it.

I've been around modding and tuning Fords for a long time though, so when this whole "auto-octane" thing pooped up on they radar here- I thought WTF are they talking about?

GH might be the greatest thing for SHO owners since sliced bread, but they are still shoving marketing wank down people's throats who don't know any better with this whole auto-octane thing.

If I'm wrong about this, please, feel free to bring the tech and I'll change my opinion on it.

Of all the vehicles I've ever had tuned an AO tune has NEVER been an option:

92 Civic Hatch - e85 / 93 tunes, have to change them if I swap fuel
04 SRT4 - 91 and 93 oct tunes, upload with fuel change
10 Ram 1500 91/e85 tunes, upload with fuel change
13 Optima SX 91 and 93 Oct tunes, upload with fuel change
15 STI - 93 and a back up base 91 tune, have to upload with fuel change as well

So in my experiences, an AO tune is extremely unique and I've never heard of anyone ever able to do it let alone master it the way these guys have. If you know of anyone else on the market anywhere that can do it with literally any other car please share, I'd love to know in earnest. I'm curious though what your experiences are that would lead you to believe that an auto adjusting tune is something that isn't unique.

 

[SaveMelMac]

It’s not a gimmick if it works??? GH is the only tuner that allows the ecu logic to adjust for the octane. All others you must upload a new tune. Sure lms makes a tune for 87,89,91,93 but you must load a new file. More of an convenience factor than anything. Kind of stretching to make an argument out of nothing? Trolling??

 

[76FoMoCo]

I know GH keeps tight to this and why he has not given input?????

 

[mattr66]

Oh boy where do I begin.... The stock sho calibration does not swing boost mapping based on inferred octane. My calibration does. The inferred octane is like a long term fuel trim but for timing. This "long term timing trim" exists on the factory calibration. Not only did I speed up this learning, when the inferred octane changes my calibration also scales max allowed boost up and down accordingly. The stock calibration does not do this!!!!!! If you have full boost and no timing as would be the case with low octane fuel the cats get hot real quick. My strategy prevents this and works very well. On 87 octane my calibration runs stock boost. As inferred octane increases, so does boost. So it is different than stock. You can now wrap your brain around that Eric Morris.....

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

[SM105K]

^BOOM.

 

[jman1200]

...

 

[76FoMoCo]

 

[SM105K]

Eric Morris is probably a SSI troll trying to learn how to tune.

 

[Raging Bull]

Eric Morris is probably a SSI troll trying to learn how to tune.

He commented 6 times on the last page , now he was told how it works and now no response yet. Idk maybe !

 

[The pony boy]

Not for nothing. But it took a “troll” like Eric Morris to ask a question we were all curious about and pretty much had no clue how GH accomplished their AO tune. So thanks Eric and thanks Matt for the answer!

 

[SM105K]

Not for nothing. But it took a “troll” like Eric Morris to ask a question we were all curious about and pretty much had no clue how GH accomplished their AO tune. So thanks Eric and thanks Matt for the answer!

Pretty sure in post 54 algorithm and strategy can be interchanged.

 

[luigisho]

He commented 6 times on the last page , now he was told how it works and now no response yet. Idk maybe !

I enjoyed his use of marketing wank.

 

[Spyke]

Spent so much $ on my LMS tune/tuner but this thread is making me want GH....

 

[Lostneye]

Spent so much $ on my LMS tune/tuner but this thread is making me want GH....

The multiple threads on LMS's V11 issues was making me want GH. Logging both tunes in cold weather and the LMS tune having dangerously low fuel pressure confirmed I made the right choice switching.

 

[Raging Bull]

Spent so much $ on my LMS tune/tuner but this thread is making me want GH....

I too like a lot of us have spent the money on LMS. I haven’t experienced any issues I only drive mine in the warmer weather though. Is it a cold weather issue mostly ? I know I read a few had it it some cold instances , also people have had the tune for a few years without any problems the all of a sudden fuel pressure is not there and there is issues. Is that what I’m heading for waiting for it to fail. Just can’t switch right now tuners that is. Matt could have a jump over sale ! ( wink wink ) his tune is definitely at a good price it’s the plugs and sct that hold me back for now. Can some one else use my LMS items ??? Then I can make moves.

 

[Lostneye]

I too like a lot of us have spent the money on LMS. I haven’t experienced any issues I only drive mine in the warmer weather though. Is it a cold weather issue mostly ? I know I read a few had it it some cold instances , also people have had the tune for a few years without any problems the all of a sudden fuel pressure is not there and there is issues. Is that what I’m heading for waiting for it to fail. Just can’t switch right now tuners that is. Matt could have a jump over sale ! ( wink wink ) his tune is definitely at a good price it’s the plugs and sct that hold me back for now. Can some one else use my LMS items ??? Then I can make moves.

LMS has fuel pressure issues which is more prominent in colder weather. Although I did see a guy on FB throw a rod in the last few weeks. If you are having any kind of hesitation issues be very careful regardless of how cold it is.

I believe LMS does have updated tune files that make somewhat less power but maintain better fuel pressure. I'm not going back but would want to log before I run any update from them.

 

[SM105K]

LMS has fuel pressure issues which is more prominent in colder weather. Although I did see a guy on FB throw a rod in the last few weeks. If you are having any kind of hesitation issues be very careful regardless of how cold it is.

I believe LMS does have updated tune files that make somewhat less power but maintain better fuel pressure. I'm not going back but would want to log before I run any update from them.

I talked to Dan at LMS, and there is a fix. However the updated tune files does make less power to maintain fuel pressure. There are better tunes out there that make more power and are deemed safe regardless of what LMS says.

My AJPTurbo E30 tune makes more power then 98 percent of the LMS's cars (meth ones included), has zero fuel pressure problems, and averaged 20.1 mpg over my 1200 mile road trip this past week. Average highway speed was 83 mph.

 

[mattr66]

The fuel pressure issue in the cold baffles me. It you tune for a max VE instead of a boost number, then the boost will dial itself back once temps drop automatically to achieve the same VE.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

 

[stripSHO]

Bwahahahaha someone calls y'all parrots and you all respond with CAW! CAW! CAW! sorry I know this is an old thread but I stumbled upon it and I just couldn't let this nonsense go uncorrected. Yes Brawndo has electrolytes. No, it's not what plants crave.

1st, let's get it straight - no tuner has any "special algorithms" they code into your PCMs for super duper extra features. The PCMs leave the factory with a permanent set of fixed instructions which reference sets of tabular data to determine how to adjust outputs based on given inputs. These calibration tables are the only things any tuner is touching on your car's computer. GH is not adding ANY extra functions, as plainly stated right on their website.

Read your owner's manual. It says you should run 91 octane in your car, but that it's okay to run 87. That's because of the octane adjust feature spec'd and implemented by FORD. Every custom tuner in the market has this functionality available to them. The reason none of the others market this factory stock feature and instead tell you to use specific tunes for different fuels is because 1) it's a factory stock feature; 2) it's beyond idiotic to try and pump 87 into a motor that's trying to run at peak boost, compression, and timing, then hoping your engine will neuter itself before there's a hole in your piston; and 3) Once the PCM learns you're trying to ****** your car, it then has to unlearn your abuse over time. This can be avoided by just running an appropriate tune for the gas you're using in the first place. Sources:

Octane Adjust Ratio
Applicable Model/Year:
All supported EcoBoost vehicles 2013-16
Background:
The EcoBoost vehicles are equipped with several load, airflow, and torque limiting and targeting strategies. These allow the vehicle to have
consistent performance in varying environmental conditions and with different fuel quality. However unlike many conventional tuning options
there are no "boost targets" as boost can vary depending on driving conditions. They are able to achieve this consistency and offer the ability to
work on 87+ octane (though they recommend using 91+) through use of a dynamic multiplier called "OAR" which adjusts all of these strategies.
How it Works:
The OAR starts life at a value of 0.0 and is allowed to learn in both directions. When fuel and sensor feedback are optimal the OAR will adjust
towards -1.0. When the feedback is less than optimal the OAR will trend towards +1.0. It's likely that you're now wondering why it is that the
multiplier is negative when it's happy and positive when it isn't, the reasoning is that the value is not a multiplier and not an offset, thus the ECU
code can be simplified and use just a single table comprised entirely of negative values to cover the entire spectrum of operating conditions. With
an entire table of negative values it will be multiplied against, the negative multiplier from the optimal correction get's cancelled out into a positive
timing correction, whereas the positive OAR value which is asking for things to get dialed back becomes negative and lowers the agression of
timing.
OAR however does not just impact the timing. In the event that fuel quality is less than optimal other strategies step in to remove stress and
prevent damage to the engine automatically. LSPI (low speed preignition) uses the OAR multiplier in order to blend several different load limit
references in order to reduce the possibility of pre-ignition (detonation or knock). Part-throttle combustion stability strategy uses the OAR to allow
for casual driving at moderate load and allow for leaner fuel ratios to increase MPG but at the expense of heat. Since this heat is generated much
more rapidly on lower octane fuels which are already prone to detonation, the OAR steps in and makes adjustments in order to stave off the
potential for disaster, while allowing your high horsepower machine the benefit of some decent MPG.
We here at COBB make an effort to utilize as many of the OEM tuning strategies as possible in order to offer the most advanced, powerful, and
safest driving experience for you. The majority of our calibrations utilize the OAR multiplier in the same fashion as the factory tunes do, however
on our higher power tunes we want to be able to maximize performance for the specified octane, as a result in the event of even minor knock
being sensed by the ECU we aggressively shift the OAR towards positive which lowers the agression of all values affected by the OAR. Since we
designed the OAR to be utilized in our tunes in order to maximize the potential of the available fuel type, it's very important to run the proper
calibration for the fuel octane you are running. When you initially install the Accessport the OAR will be reset. Since OAR is a KAM (keep alive
memory) stored value it may take a few days of driving in order to fully settle, however once learned the value will persist through start-up
including when you change the map on your vehicle by using your Accessport. The value may change from time to time based on knock sensor
feedback and is completely normal and expected.
...
Things to look out for:
if you find that your OAR value does not stay near to -1.0 when using top tier fuels of the appropriate octane, please change the calibration on
your map to a lower fuel octane until a better quality gasoline can be found

https://cobbtuning.atlassian.net/wi...2357561/Ford+Vehicles+Octane+Adjust+Ratio+OAR

The beauty behind this knock control system that both adds and subtracts timing is that it also LEARNS the quality of your fuel over time. The learning variable is called OAR (Octane Adjust Ratio). This variable is like a fuel trim but used for ignition and load/boost targets. It can range from -1 to 1. Below is the table that allows the ECU to learn and adjust OAR. You can see from this table that in order for this system to work, ignition timing and the Knock Response table must be set such that the ECU can ADD and SUBTRACT enough timing to make the Ign. Corr. Cyl X parameters positive as well as negative during a pull. With an adaptable tune you are likely to see Ign. Correction numbers that are both positive and negative at times.

Finally, this OAR number is not just another pretty face. It affects the timing AND load/boost tables the car will be targeting. An OAR that is closer to 1 will remove both timing and boost reducing future knocking. An OAR closer to -1 will add timing and boost due to good quality fuel and increase performance. It is normal for OAR to fluctuate slightly depending on your fuel quality and driving conditions (5th gear pulls are more likely to knock compared to 3rd gear pulls and OAR will adjust to reflect this). Below is the timing table that is multiplied by OAR in the OEM calibration and added to the overall ignition timing the ECU runs. In this case an OAR of -1 will add 4* timing and an OAR of 1 will remove 4* of timing near redline. OAR dependent boost/load limits are setup via a blend of several tables not shown here.

http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/how-the-knock-detection-system-works-in-the-ecoboost/

Oh boy where do I begin.... The stock sho calibration does not swing boost mapping based on inferred octane. My calibration does. The inferred octane is like a long term fuel trim but for timing. This "long term timing trim" exists on the factory calibration. Not only did I speed up this learning, when the inferred octane changes my calibration also scales max allowed boost up and down accordingly. The stock calibration does not do this!!!!!! If you have full boost and no timing as would be the case with low octane fuel the cats get hot real quick. My strategy prevents this and works very well. On 87 octane my calibration runs stock boost. As inferred octane increases, so does boost. So it is different than stock. You can now wrap your brain around that Eric Morris.....

@mattr66 saying it's different than stock is probably the most DUH statement I've heard since the time I heard a guy say "this wind is windy!". Cool, you tweaked it, like you did countless other values, and like a lot of other tuners probably do too. I'm sure you made it a LOT more aggressive than stock- you'd certainly need to when you're taking on the liability of actually telling your customers to run low octane in a performance tune! But if I can offer a bit of advice, as a customer- lying and/or misleading people about your work is bad for business. Market your product based on the results achieved and the refinement of the transmission everybody raves about. Don't gimmick people with features you didn't create or substantially alter, especially a safety crutch that's not smart to lean on in the first place.

 

[mattr66]

Bwahahahaha someone calls y'all parrots and you all respond with CAW! CAW! CAW! sorry I know this is an old thread but I stumbled upon it and I just couldn't let this nonsense go uncorrected. Yes Brawndo has electrolytes. No, it's not what plants crave.

1st, let's get it straight - no tuner has any "special algorithms" they code into your PCMs for super duper extra features. The PCMs leave the factory with a permanent set of fixed instructions which reference sets of tabular data to determine how to adjust outputs based on given inputs. These calibration tables are the only things any tuner is touching on your car's computer. GH is not adding ANY extra functions, as plainly stated right on their website.

Read your owner's manual. It says you should run 91 octane in your car, but that it's okay to run 87. That's because of the octane adjust feature spec'd and implemented by FORD. Every custom tuner in the market has this functionality available to them. The reason none of the others market this factory stock feature and instead tell you to use specific tunes for different fuels is because 1) it's a factory stock feature; 2) it's beyond idiotic to try and pump 87 into a motor that's trying to run at peak boost, compression, and timing, then hoping your engine will neuter itself before there's a hole in your piston; and 3) Once the PCM learns you're trying to ****** your car, it then has to unlearn your abuse over time. This can be avoided by just running an appropriate tune for the gas you're using in the first place. Sources:

https://cobbtuning.atlassian.net/wi...2357561/Ford+Vehicles+Octane+Adjust+Ratio+OAR

http://stratifiedauto.com/blog/how-the-knock-detection-system-works-in-the-ecoboost/




@mattr66 saying it's different than stock is probably the most DUH statement I've heard since the time I heard a guy say "this wind is windy!". Cool, you tweaked it, like you did countless other values, and like a lot of other tuners probably do too. I'm sure you made it a LOT more aggressive than stock- you'd certainly need to when you're taking on the liability of actually telling your customers to run low octane in a performance tune! But if I can offer a bit of advice, as a customer- lying and/or misleading people about your work is bad for business. Market your product based on the results achieved and the refinement of the transmission everybody raves about. Don't gimmick people with features you didn't create or substantially alter, especially a safety crutch that's not smart to lean on in the first place.

You are mistaken.... I can show you were the stock sho tuning does not change boost relative to inferred octane (but that would give away the farm). You show me otherwise then you can come in here and act like you know something.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk