engine shaking- new plug wires-seems serious (update)

[munkee]

About the only thing I didn't do 800 miles ago when I had the engine and trans out to do a complete 60k and paint job on my project 90 mtx was change the spark plug wires and fuel filter. The wires got here a couple of weeks ago and so I changed the filter and plug wires tonight. A little while before I changed them, I noticed that the engine shook a little bit at idle even with all new mounts and sfb's but the engine still ran smoothly. After changing the wires, the shaking is a lot more noticeable and even though the tach stays steady, the engine doesn't sound very smooth. You can even feel it shaking from inside the car. While driving it it feels slightly like it is missing or something. It has used two quarts of oil in only 800 miles but I didn't and still don't notice any smoke out the back and there is definitely no leaks. I have also verified three times that the plug wires are all routed correctly and secure. Also, I have already posted this before, but when I go to start it, if it doesn't fire the first time I try it, it acts like it works really hard to turn over on the second try. Usually if I shut the key off for a couple of seconds and then try again it will fire but a couple of times now, about two seconds after I have turned the key to off it has turned over one more time on it's own.
On another note, when I have the car in gear with the clutch in and then rev it up, it will start moving at 5200 rpms as if I had let out on the clutch. I don't do this often, I just noticed it tonight. I am a little worried that I have serious problems. Sometimes fears can blow things way out of proportion though so I would really appreciate your input. Thanks, Chris.

<small>[ March 21, 2003, 10:13 PM: Message edited by: munkee ]</small>

 

[luigisho]

Just to be sure, how did you confirm the wires are on correctly?

 

[sdpatt]

What brand and part number of plugs and wires did you install? It definitely sounds like a misfire and since you didn't mention a CHECK ENGINE light, the cause would likely be from those sources.

The high oil consumption could be from the rings or the valve guide seals if you don't see any hitting the ground.

If the car can move with the clutch pedal depressed, the clutch is not fully decoupled. Try adjusting the clutch linkage and if that doesn't help, you may have a worn or damaged throwout (release) bearing and/or pressure plate fingers.

And revving the engine unloaded is ******* the engine.

 

[munkee]

The wires I think are vitek. They are from IPT. The plugs are split fire. I have a set of motorcraft wires sitting here that I'm supposed to put on a friends car, I might try them on and see if they help any. I confirmed that they were on correctly by pulling each one off of the plug and putting it back on making sure I could hear it click on, then I traced it back to the coil and made sure it was on the correct post. I then pulled off and reapplied it on the coil.

 

[luigisho]

I just want to be sure you don't have the incorrect wiring setup that was incorrectly printed in a publication or two. I would also not use splitfire plugs.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

First, definitely chuck those Splitfire plugs. Then double-check your spark plug wire routing to this diagram:

If after installing the Motorcraft AGSP32PP plugs and verifying the wiring order the engine still runs rough, you may have a failed/clogged fuel injector or vacuum leak that is causing the rough running. You should also check your codes to see if there are any ignition-related codes such as a coil pack or DIS problem.

You should run the KOER cylinder balance test, which you can get the instructions for by clicking one of the links in my signature.

 

[munkee]

Phooey. Things are going from bad to worse. I replaced the plugs and wires with all motorcraft and the problem persists. I ran all of the codes and came up with nothing on the koeo and koer tests. It says that cylinders 4 and 6 are weak or non contributing on the cylinder balance tests. It is also starting to backfire quite regularly at idle, about every two seconds it makes a pumk sound and a little puff of smoke out the back. I can't tell if it's oil burn or not. The motor is really shaking too, it was moving a little more than an inch back and forth during the cylinder balance test. The split fire plugs that I pulled all looked fine and were still gapped at .043. They had a slightly brownish grey color to them but I am pretty sure that is from making a lot of short trips. Are any of these symptoms of rings or valves going bad? I can't find any vacuum leaks and I haven't tested fuel pressure. I ran injector cleaner not too long ago. If I rev it to 2000 rpms it smooths out ok. Could it be a fuel delivery problem? Sorry for such long posts, I am just hoping it is something relatively simple (meaning not internal at least) but dreading the worst.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

munkee:
...I ran all of the codes and came up with nothing on the koeo and koer tests. It says that cylinders 4 and 6 are weak or non contributing on the cylinder balance tests...

Nothing??? Sounds like you have a good place to start looking for your problem...

 

[munkee]

Nothing as in no problem codes. KOEO was an 11 and KOER was 3, 1, 11.

 

[Mr Anonymous]

TO QUOTE A SECOND TIME:

munkee:
...It says that cylinders 4 and 6 are weak or non contributing on the cylinder balance tests...

Maybe you should start with determining why cyls 4 & 6 are reporting problems!?!?!?

 

[sdpatt]

munkee:
Nothing as in no problem codes. KOEO was an 11 and KOER was 3, 1, 11.

The KOEO test has two sections: hard faults and memory. You stated that you received only "11." There would be an "11" displayed twice for the hard faults, a separator pulse, then another "11" displayed twice for the memory codes to really have "no problem codes." The KOER test would give you an "11" and repeat it if no codes were generated. The "3, 1, 11" are not valid responses to the KOER test. Either you got an "11" or error codes, but not both. Learn what to look for here.

 

[munkee]

OK, I ran the codes again last night and I didn't get any problem codes, just cylinders 4 and 6 are weak. I am not sure what could be wrong with those two specifically, the plugs looked fine. Unless it's an injector problem. I am a little lost at where to begin looking. I checked for vacuum leaks with a can of carb cleaner and didn't find any. The next two things to check would be fuel and timing then right? Everything to check for fuel would be the pump and the injectors and for the timing would be crank and cam sensors, coil pack and DIS? Did I miss anything, and which would be the more likely place to start. I don't have a whole lot of time each day to work on it is what sucks. Otherwise I would just tear into it. Thanks for all the help.

 

[Off Road SHO]

Like Scott and someone else said, find out what's up with those two cylinders. Use a long handled screw driver to check for the same ticking noise coming from all your injectors.

Next, go to Auto Zone and get a compression tester to run all the cylinders when the engine is warm, not hot. Remove all sparkplugs, disconnect the DIS module, and wire the throttle wide open before you do the test. In turn, install the tester in each cylinder and crank the engine over for 3 seconds. Write down the results. Do all the cylinder exactly the same.

The resulting pressures should be within 10% of each other. If you have a low one, squirt a little clean motor oil into the spark plug hole and re-test. If the oil brings up the compression the rings are the cause of the low compression. If the oil doesn't help, the valves are bad in that cylinder. HTH

Tom

 

[Underdog]

If it's turning over and firing as you are turning the key off and it's popping occasionally, I would remove the upper timing belt cover and check the location of the cam sprockets in relation to the crank. It sounds as if you may be slightly out of time.

The clutch problem is something completely seperate, but definetly something to look into. If that's a new clutch, you will burn it up quite quick just by driving normally, as it is slipping.

 

[FordLover]

Injector time!
-Martin

 

[munkee]

This is really starting to get frustrating. I ran the compression test and all cylinders were between 201 and 212. I replaced the injectors, fuel pressure regulator, crank sensor, coil pack, DIS module and MAF sensor with either new or known working parts. So far things only seem to be getting worse. There is too much unburned fuel in process somewhere. The plugs looked fine when I first started this post. The last few times I have pulled them they are covered pretty heavily with carbon deposits and have wet fuel on them. It backfires constantly now at idle, not just every second or two like a couple of days ago. I still don't have a check engine light nor am I pulling any trouble codes. What should look at next? Could clogged cats cause this problem? The exhaust comes out with pretty good force. What about fuel pump or the computer. I haven't tried changing the cam sensor yet because the only thing running smoothly right now is the tach. BTW, I found out where my oil was dissapearing to. I messed up somehow when I redid the oilpan gasket and it was leaking at the front of the motor. Anyway, I would really appreciate any more thoughts on what to do to get this thing running right again. Thanks.

 

[munkee]

Okay, I was working in the shop tonight and the shop supervisor came over to see what I was doing. I explained the problem and all I have done so far to try and fix it and he says, you didn't use the compression tester in the drawer did you? Oh, it's broken. We just don't use it that much so it hasn't been fixed yet. I guess it always reads between 200 and 220. So I picked up another tester and rechecked the compression and these are the numbers. 1-181, 2-192, 3-189, 4-183, 5-170, 6-165. I used a little oil on the front bank as Tom suggested and it didn't change the compression at all so I guess the valves would be the culprit.

 

[luigisho]

Assuming this was done correctly, the discrepancy between #2 and #6 is a little large. I wonder if it would be enough to make the engine shake like that though? I would look for a faulty sensor without a code. I wonder if you misread the codes and cleared them by mistake.

 

[munkee]

I wondered why I wasn't getting a code from the o2 sensors because of how rich it is "running" so I swapped out brand new ones with another set and no change. Even after resetting the computer and driving it I don't get any fault codes except on the cylinder balance test. Then number six is always bad and number 4 is sometimes bad, sometimes good. The engine shakes enough to feel inside the car. I guess before I go swapping out heads I should make sure that the computer isn't bad. If it was bad wouldn't it be causing more problems though. Are there more connections to the computer than the one through the firewall? How do you test the computer?