will only start using starting fluid but will die shortly after

[jtw357]

1991 and ½ year mtx, sho plus, will fire up with starting fluid (ether), but die soon after (fuel delivery problem). I don’t hear the fuel pump engage (turn on), what I hear is a ‘click” when ignition is put into start (without trying to start), I think I remember hearing more of a robotic noise when it was engaged in the past (a humming kind of sound) and the volts are reading little to none on the relay (forgive me if I’m using the incorrect term I’m handy, but not a master mechanic.) tested the shredder valve and fuel comes out. Maybe there’s something in the relay, idk but it’s not the ccrm hence I’ve bought two with the proper code “m” (even though they were used). Im betting it’s something related to the fuel pump (I installed a second one, after thinking the first one was faulty. Bad gas? Fuel pump (walboro) put in wrong/something not plugged? Idk.


It used to be my DD but when it bogged down I got into another vehicle I had that was running. So a lot of the reason it’s been sitting is having the extra $$ and I have two other vehicles that I’ve had to keep maintenance up with, including bills so naturally my poor sho has come last.


This Sho was originally from California (according to the documentation)

New: Tps sensor, crankshaft sensor, triple ground wiring, fuel pump, fuel pressure regulator, control arm on the left side. Mass flow sensor, spark plugs, fuel pump (walboro). replaced crankshaft sensor. water pump. alternator.

I have an extra pcm with egr delete from the Sho shop in Ca (not around anymore I believe), not the (Sho source). Two extra ccrm or ircm modules witb code “m”. The two front tires have plenty of tread I got them replaced not long before the car bogged down, however I ran over a nail or something sharp so you will need to get them plugged up (20$ a tire at national tire and battery).


Story goes it bogged down around 9/15 and


Besides figuring out the fuel problem.

In the future needs- new starter, radiator, ball joint (50) and maybe a tie-rod (20$) on the left side (you could do it at the same time). Left rear tire needs to go at some point. The others are okay.

 

[rubydist]

When you say that you push on the schrader valve and fuel comes out - does it dribble out or is there a big spray? Because you should be getting a spray that goes nearly to the bottom of the open hood - like jump back out of the stream kind of spray.

What codes are there now?

 

[jtw357]

When you say that you push on the schrader valve and fuel comes out - does it dribble out or is there a big spray? Because you should be getting a spray that goes nearly to the bottom of the open hood - like jump back out of the stream kind of spray.

What codes are there now?

It wont pull codes, i bought a innova ford code reader but no results. Also i was using the paper clip method key on engine on test in 16’ when it would still start and run like crap. But it would flash something like not enough rpms to test. I took my fuel pump back thinking it was faulty and put a new one in in 16’ after that crank no start, not even with starting fluid. Since then i replaced the crankshaft senor 17’, triple ground wired. The owner before me moved the battery to the trunk and i was having issues before it gave. so i got it wired triple ground back to the front. I guess i can try key on engine off test with paperclip, since it wont start now anyway. Yes it was a good size spray got all over my hand. I know the gas is bad. My tach jumps up so i dont think cam, im kinda stuck it seems.

Towards then end backfiring, intermittent cutting off, at the end very bad performance/almost undrivable then no start... sent it to a shop but they were no help and i got charged a couple hundred plus tows. so i found someone trustworthy to help me (replaced crankshaft) then we re-wired... now we are at only starting with ether for a few seconds.

I saw a pin out... i somewhat get the jist... but i could have sworn the fuelpump makes a buzzing sound and i was only hearing a click outside earlier. I know the gas in there is bad by now but idk...

 

[SHOdded]

Code readers dont do so well with OBD1 vehicles. You will have to go old school with this one and count flashes of the CEL. Also, if there are no codes, either truly nothing is set or the PCM/ECU is damaged.

 

[rubydist]

So the test that you want to do is the "key on engine off" test, that will give you stored codes. The rpms or lack thereof will not matter for that test.

Its possible that the injectors are all gummed up from just sitting for a couple years, but it sounds like you had issues before it was sitting, so you will need to get to the bottom of that.

 

[jtw357]

Code readers dont do so well with OBD1 vehicles. You will have to go old school with this one and count flashes of the CEL. Also, if there are no codes, either truly nothing is set or the PCM/ECU is damaged.

I hear you. It was flashing codes... when i looked up the code from the flashes... the code was rpms too low to test and, i forget which number that was it was last yr 16’. I thought that may be the case, i have spare pcm from the sho shop. I think ill try to pull codes with the engine off since it wont start anyway and then switch pcms and pray lol.

 

[jtw357]

So the test that you want to do is the "key on engine off" test, that will give you stored codes. The rpms or lack thereof will not matter for that test.

Its possible that the injectors are all gummed up from just sitting for a couple years, but it sounds like you had issues before it was sitting, so you will need to get to the bottom of that.

 

[jtw357]

So the test that you want to do is the "key on engine off" test, that will give you stored codes. The rpms or lack thereof will not matter for that test.

Its possible that the injectors are all gummed up from just sitting for a couple years, but it sounds like you had issues before it was sitting, so you will need to get to the bottom of that.

Okay... im going to go out there later and see. Now i remember where to insert the paper clip into the EIV or whatever its called but i know with the key on engine on i had to tap the gas pedal twice to start the test... not sure with key on engine off, will it start after i put the ignition in start position? Ill try to look it up again.
You know i though that may be the case.. we thought about the injectors but wanted to double check the ccrm but i dont think it was that. THANKS FOR YALLS HELP... really searching for a solution, poor sho lol

 

[luigisho]

With the key on and engine off it will just start reading codes

 

[jtw357]

So the test that you want to do is the "key on engine off" test, that will give you stored codes. The rpms or lack thereof will not matter for that test.

Its possible that the injectors are all gummed up from just sitting for a couple years, but it sounds like you had issues before it was sitting, so you will need to get to the bottom of that.

How do i execute the key on engine off test? I attempted earlier but could not execute the test. I set up my jumper wire/paperclip just like i did with key on engine on but unsuccessjful in starting the diagnostic test “goose test”.

This is the result i got after putting the jumper wire in self test and then turned key into on position.

Theres something kind of humming not sure what it was,,, but no codes flashed back at all and/or not indicating it was going into self test.. ex. first three flashes (for cylinder), then one flash to indicate start of test, then codes flashed back...

 

[jtw357]

With the key on and engine off it will just start reading codes

I just replied concerning what you just said.
I set up my jumper wire/paperclip just like i did with key on engine on but unsuccessjful in starting the diagnostic test “goose test”.

 

[luigisho]

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/77a1h1wsvvdmtox/AAD8t5N8fmZxSWFJohcV0bf0a/SHO Check engine Codes - SHO Phoenix.doc?dl=0

https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/538-r-system-did-not-receive-goose-test.59905/#post-566174

So the video clip was very short. I assume that you allowed it to go further than the vid clip. You should hear noises from the test running fuel pump and fans during its cycle. If you read the first link above there are steps where you start the car, turn the steering wheel, hit the gas etc. If you skip any of these steps it will throw a corresponding code I usually have the stuff printed out or on hand if I need both the running and non running tests. If I am only looking for what's stored then I skip those parts. You could use the full test I am assuming

 

[jtw357]

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/77a1h1wsvvdmtox/AAD8t5N8fmZxSWFJohcV0bf0a/SHO Check engine Codes - SHO Phoenix.doc?dl=0

https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/538-r-system-did-not-receive-goose-test.59905/#post-566174

So the video clip was very short. I assume that you allowed it to go further than the vid clip. You should hear noises from the test running fuel pump and fans during its cycle. If you read the first link above there are steps where you start the car, turn the steering wheel, hit the gas etc. If you skip any of these steps it will throw a corresponding code I usually have the stuff printed out or on hand if I need both the running and non running tests. If I am only looking for what's stored then I skip those parts. You could use the full test I am assuming

Okay well i waited about a good 60 secs or so maybe wait longer?

 

[jtw357]

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/77a1h1wsvvdmtox/AAD8t5N8fmZxSWFJohcV0bf0a/SHO Check engine Codes - SHO Phoenix.doc?dl=0

https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/538-r-system-did-not-receive-goose-test.59905/#post-566174

So the video clip was very short. I assume that you allowed it to go further than the vid clip. You should hear noises from the test running fuel pump and fans during its cycle. If you read the first link above there are steps where you start the car, turn the steering wheel, hit the gas etc. If you skip any of these steps it will throw a corresponding code I usually have the stuff printed out or on hand if I need both the running and non running tests. If I am only looking for what's stored then I skip those parts. You could use the full test I am assuming

Well tried it again waited much longer, still nothing

 

[luigisho]

Jumper the pins, turn the key to on, and it should kick in very shortly. Even if any stored codes were erased it should at least flash all clear. Not sure if the jumper wire is not making good contact. I would monkey with it just to make sure.

you have power. I wonder if there is a fuse in the obdI circuit to or from the computer. You have no cycling of the fuel pump or cooling fans? Was the humming sound you heard last time one of those two things or was it something else? If the jumper contact isn't an issue then I would do a wiggle test on the connectors and hope that helps (possible but unlikely loose conncetion at the diagnostic wiring). I see alot of wiring from the dash stereo area and the engine bay and that would bother me from a troubleshooting standpoint. Could be nothing or ..not nothing? If there proves to not be an issue with the diagnostic ports connecting then my best guesstimate is to look at the computer itself, or some short in wiring somewhere. You live close to someone with a manual car that can loan you a pcm to try? That's easier than throwing money at parts.

and cool co-pilot

 

[luigisho]

Did you happen to have a chip in the PCM with some kind of tune? Often the contacts at EPROM chips can get funky and at this age car computers, chipped or not, and everything else can fail and not be considered irregular anymore

 

[rubydist]

http://www.troublecodes.net/ford/

^ That will tell you how to connect everything, just to be sure you have it right. As soon as you turn on the key with the jumper in place, the cooling fans will kick on, first low, then high (if two speed) or else just on for about 1.5 seconds. Then the check engine light will flash very rapidly for a bit. Then it will start flashing out the codes, starting with lower number codes first. It will first flash out all the "current" codes. Then there will be a one-flash separator and then it will flash out the stored codes, again from lowest to highest. Each set of codes is repeated a second time.

 

[jtw357]

Did you happen to have a chip in the PCM with some kind of tune? Often the contacts at EPROM chips can get funky and at this age car computers, chipped or not, and everything else can fail and not be considered irregular anymore

I have an extra pcm in the trunk.. i guess ill give it a go tomm. This one in the trunk has does removble chip? Ill take a pic when i go back downstairs. Okay i hear you.... and yes i did hear a click sound from the fuel pump area and whirring sound like maybe the fan.. but no codes or flashing after that

 

[jtw357]

http://www.troublecodes.net/ford/

^ That will tell you how to connect everything, just to be sure you have it right. As soon as you turn on the key with the jumper in place, the cooling fans will kick on, first low, then high (if two speed) or else just on for about 1.5 seconds. Then the check engine light will flash very rapidly for a bit. Then it will start flashing out the codes, starting with lower number codes first. It will first flash out all the "current" codes. Then there will be a one-flash separator and then it will flash out the stored codes, again from lowest to highest. Each set of codes is repeated a second time.

Okay ill try again tomm also use this extra pcm in the trunk

 

[luigisho]

Did the car come with an extra one when you bought it?

Chip looks like this http://www.shosource.com/catalog/popup_image.php?pID=252&image=0
and plugs into the back of the unit. You would notice a bulky black chip sticking out the back. The port often has a sticker covering it. I would not use a chip installed into a PCM if I was trouble shooting.