Tuning options?

[SHO GoDz 89]

Being a former SHO owner, still a Ford owner, I still have some questions.
I do have a build going on for a motor "exchange", and I want to know about the tuning options for the SHO computers.

First off, the SHO motor will be boosted, going into a Tbird, and be RWD.
The SHO will be getting a 2.3 Turbo, and be RWD.

Anyways....

Why does everyone use TwEECer? I've been looking into different piggyback options for Ford EEC's, and there are plenty out there...most of them are much cheaper and easier to use than TwEECer.

So is there anything specific about the TwEECer that makes it the primary option for SHO tuning?

I know there is a MS2 plug-in kit for Fords, which costs the same as TwEECer.
There is also Quarterhorse, which can do everything TwEECer does, but at half the price.

For the 2.3's, it's more common to use Quarterhorse or MS2, since there is plenty of support and documentation for both. When I asked some guys about TwEECer they said "what the **** is that?"

You can even find a burner, and chip for less than $200, and the software is free, so why TwEECer?


EDIT:
QuarterHorse can be found here http://www.moates.net/product_info.php?cPath=97&products_id=199

MS2 bolt-in kit can be found here http://www.wilsonracingms.com/

 

[ycode90]

Because it was the "first" for the SHO and people ran with it . belive it or not a few searches will net a lot of SHO specific stuff for the TwEECer .

 

[bubba]

They also make the binder for the tweecer, I've heard other people use other stuf, however I've never heard them talk about it ever again. I think you can do everything your going to do with the tweecer and be happy, and not put out your hair with rewiring some shit

Being a former SHO owner, still a Ford owner, I still have some questions.
I do have a build going on for a motor "exchange", and I want to know about the tuning options for the SHO computers.

First off, the SHO motor will be boosted, going into a Tbird, and be RWD.
The SHO will be getting a 2.3 Turbo, and be RWD.

Anyways....

Why does everyone use TwEECer? I've been looking into different piggyback options for Ford EEC's, and there are plenty out there...most of them are much cheaper and easier to use than TwEECer.

So is there anything specific about the TwEECer that makes it the primary option for SHO tuning?

I know there is a MS2 plug-in kit for Fords, which costs the same as TwEECer.
There is also Quarterhorse, which can do everything TwEECer does, but at half the price.

For the 2.3's, it's more common to use Quarterhorse or MS2, since there is plenty of support and documentation for both. When I asked some guys about TwEECer they said "what the **** is that?"

You can even find a burner, and chip for less than $200, and the software is free, so why TwEECer?


EDIT:
QuarterHorse can be found here http://www.moates.net/product_info.php?cPath=97&products_id=199

MS2 bolt-in kit can be found here http://www.wilsonracingms.com/

 

[LOUDSHO92]

I think the main reason is they support the SHO computers. Each CPU needs to be cracked. For that same reason the Tweecer doesn't support any SLO CPU's as they have not been cracked.

Do they have the SHO CPU's cracked?

What turbo comes on the 3.2?

 

[HotRodKid]

using megasquirt instead of the tweecer is like spending $200 for a ticket in the cargo hold of a cruise ship when you could spend $400 and have your own cabin

 

[Sho Amo]

The quarterhorse needs binary editor to run. Adam at pops racing just cracked the x2j and d4u1 for binary editor within the last few months.

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

I think the main reason is they support the SHO computers. Each CPU needs to be cracked. For that same reason the Tweecer doesn't support any SLO CPU's as they have not been cracked.

Do they have the SHO CPU's cracked?

What turbo comes on the 3.2?

I wasn't aware that the CPU needed to be cracked. TwEECer is shown as an option for tuning in 2.3's, but people rarely use it because MS2 is much more common. I know plenty of people who use piggyback systems similar to TwEECer, but I think a lot of people stay away from piggyback systems because most people want to upgrade their ignition to EDIS or COP systems (yes, I still have a distributor).

I haven't heard anything about cracking the CPU's for 2.3 fords, and the CPU specs for an LA(1-3) computer are similar to SHO CPU's.

MS2 is used for 2.3's mainly for the fact that they bolt in with a working tune and come with a MAP sensor built in, which is the best option for anything with FI.

2.3's come with either a Garret T3 (XR4Ti/SVO) or a smaller IHI (Tbird). Both are too small for most people.

 

[HotRodKid]

only cracked ecu's can be chipped. if it cant be chipped or tweeced (or anything else that plugs into the port then you have to MS / emanage it

 

[yamahaSHO]

Both the TwEECer and Quarterhorse are more than capable... Just so long as you take the time to understand it. Both will allow you to datalog as well make all the parameter changes you want. Either route you go, the cost isn't too far off in either direction (TwEECer comes with software and binary/ QH comes with neither and you have to pay for both at a separate cost). I personally haven't gone to a stand alone setup because I don't think I'll net anything that will make it worth the extra work.

Buying a burner and a chip is great... But what parameters are you going to correct for? The TwEECer was widely used as it was only (at the time) setup to allow you to data log and they had the binary (thanks to some of our own members) to make it work. IMO, the QH has some advantages over the TwEECer (less overhead, able to datalog everything and 'real-time' tuning), however, I haven't played with it much as when I got it, I had a newer version than Adam had worked with and not everything worked properly.

Can we move this into the proper forum?

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

Both the TwEECer and Quarterhorse are more than capable... Just so long as you take the time to understand it. Both will allow you to datalog as well make all the parameter changes you want. Either route you go, the cost isn't too far off in either direction (TwEECer comes with software and binary/ QH comes with neither and you have to pay for both at a separate cost). I personally haven't gone to a stand alone setup because I don't think I'll net anything that will make it worth the extra work.

Buying a burner and a chip is great... But what parameters are you going to correct for? The TwEECer was widely used as it was only (at the time) setup to allow you to data log and they had the binary (thanks to some of our own members) to make it work. IMO, the QH has some advantages over the TwEECer (less overhead, able to datalog everything and 'real-time' tuning), however, I haven't played with it much as when I got it, I had a newer version than Adam had worked with and not everything worked properly.

Can we move this into the proper forum?

I thought an MS2 setup would be complicated also, until I found the bolt-in kit. No need for a custom wire harness, or soldering. They are sold with working tunes as well, which is a huge plus.

Since I'm going to be boosting with both engines, I'll go with MS2, because I use MAP. TwEECer won't let me get rid of the stock VAM (vain-air-meter), unless I convert to MAF, but that still doesn't help a whole bunch.

 

[yamahaSHO]

They're sold with working tunes... for the SHO and for your specific setup??

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

They're sold with working tunes... for the SHO and for your specific setup??

The site advertises for any Ford, and i'm assuming the tunes are for stock engines.

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

This is what is standard



Megasquirt 2 extra code

Base tune

44 psi map sensor

Direct coil control 1 coil

PWM idle control

Tuning cable

1 year warranty

Customer support

 

[St Louis SHO]

I'm running a quarterhorse I'm my Turbo car.

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

I'm running a quarterhorse I'm my Turbo car.

And how is it? I'd like to get any input on it.

Well tweecer works on a lot of ecu's there are guys that use or used them on our motors but a lot switched to quarter growers because so much more can be done with it.

I'm discussing the same topic on a Merkur forum.

 

[yamahaSHO]

The QuarterHorse is similar to the TwEECer. It will use BE (The TwEECer will run BE or the TwEECer software) to manipulate and datalog the computer. It is a piggyback system that will allow real-time input to the PCM. The TwEECer will not allower true "real-time" tuning.

For the most part, both will run the same with some minor advantages going with the QH. With an understanding of how engines really work, and how the PCM works, they're both just as easy (virtually the same | RE: BE vs TwEECer software) to tune the car. You'll likely find more support for BE as people are moving to it and Adam will support you directly on it. The "SHO" knowledge piece of the puzzle will come from this forum (99% of it anyway).


Here is an early review of the differences: http://www.eectuning.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14004

The $250 price tag of the QH is very inviting, however, you'll need to another $80 for BE and I don't remember what Adam charges for the SHO binary, but I'm sure it's at least $100.

I paid $450 for my TwEECer RT setup and $450 for the QH setup as well, I already had several laptops.

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

I just spoke to Scott from Wilsonracing about the MS2 bolt-in kit. Nice guy, and he had a lot to say about the kit.

It does the same thing as QH with the true real-time tuning, as well as you can purchase software for $40 that auto tunes your engine as you drive. Takes the headache out of tuning.

As for the "base tune", he said it is an educated guess based on certain variables like injector size, CID, A/F ratios etc.

He said it will work with any Ford EEC harness, and the stock SHO ignition system.

His product is primarily made for 2.3T's though, but the support is great. The auto-tune feature sold me, I'm going to pick up an MS2 kit as soon as I can.

 

[yamahaSHO]

Let us know how it goes. From previous discussions and research, I think it'll be a little more involved then what Scott told you.

 

[Sho Amo]

I just spoke to Scott from Wilsonracing about the MS2 bolt-in kit. Nice guy, and he had a lot to say about the kit.

It does the same thing as QH with the true real-time tuning, as well as you can purchase software for $40 that auto tunes your engine as you drive. Takes the headache out of tuning.

You say that it does the same thing as the QH? You can get the BS auto-tune for the QH as well. Its called EEC Analyzer. This product Scott is trying to sell you will not only either need Binary Editor to work (which you will have to pay Adam 200 bucks for the Binary anyways), Or it just wont work. I dont think you really understand what we are trying to tell you.
When Jason says this...

Let us know how it goes. From previous discussions and research, I think it'll be a little more involved then what Scott told you.

It means he has already tried to tell you valuable information and has gone right over youre head.

 

[SHO GoDz 89]

You say that it does the same thing as the QH? You can get the BS auto-tune for the QH as well. Its called EEC Analyzer. This product Scott is trying to sell you will not only either need Binary Editor to work (which you will have to pay Adam 200 bucks for the Binary anyways), Or it just wont work. I dont think you really understand what we are trying to tell you.
When Jason says this...

It means he has already tried to tell you valuable information and has gone right over youre head.

Sorry, I'm getting completely different info from the 2.3 forums.

I come here and someone infers that TwEECer is better than MS2

I go back to the Merkur forum, and get explanations from them about how I don't need to buy a binary since you can get a base tune from MS2 anyways and work with that. There are plenty of write ups on almost every 2.3 forum on how to build a base tune with this same software, and none of it sounds as complicated as you are trying to make it.