The Big Brake Myth

[Blast7]

This is definitely one of the better posts on this board and I find it all very interesting. I guess I want to clarify this and make sure that I am getting the picture. If you take two SHO's with the same width tires(let's say 215), and one has 11.6" rotors and the other has 13" rotors(each having the same suspension, calipers, brake pads, etc.) they will both stop in the same distance because the 13" rotors will be more likely to cause a lockup of the breaks and then the ABS kicks on. On the other hand, if you do a lot of track racing then the bigger rotors definitely play a more crucial role in performance. I think that if we get some guys to compare this then it would be great. I'm sure that one of the clubs can do some real world comparisons with a GTech.

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1991 Black MTX
K&N Filtercharger
PP Motor Mounts
Rod Shifter
Blazer Tech Fogs
Want to Buy:
~1st Gen Black rust free trunklid
~1st Gen Black rust free front door mouldings

 

[Blast7]

BTW, no one has even mentioned the benefits of cross drilled brake lines.

Geeez!-Cross Drilled Brake Lines-
Want improved braking? Why just cross drill those rotors? Introducing KaleCo cross drilled brake lines! Improved airflow through lines provides superior brake cooling. Brake fluid is exposed to cool moving air, almost instantly reducing heat, and providing shorter stopping distances! All lines are made of quality latex. Brake lines come in: Black, Yellow, Red, or Blue. Please specify color when ordering!! Warning!! You must replace ALL brake lines at once as to prevent mismatched pressure feedbacks! You may mix colors.


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1991 Black MTX
K&N Filtercharger
PP Motor Mounts
Rod Shifter
Blazer Tech Fogs
Want to Buy:
~1st Gen Black rust free trunklid
~1st Gen Black rust free front door mouldings

 

[SHOed_up]

No one answered whether slotting and/or drilling would help with wet stopping. Does water on the rotors go to steam and does the steam act as a lubricant for the pads?

 

[90MTXSHO]

Originally posted by Blast7:
they will both stop in the same distance because the 13" rotors will be more likely to cause a lockup of the breaks and then the ABS kicks on.

thats why you don't fix your abs like me

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Clint
90 Elec. Red SHO
AIM/AOL: Shaft481
My Pimpin Webpage

"Everytime I see you coming I get sick,
At least I know your ass is mine to kick." -- Zorak, Space Ghost C2C

 

[1fastsho]

I do think that slotting has a positive effect, more so on aggressivly driven vehicles. I always slot my rotors whe I get them turned and My next set will be a two piece design. I can get the 13" rotors with aluminum hats for $350 a piece initially and replacement rotors are like $150 after that.



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Shawn Pasley
Innovative Performance Technologies
770-725-4631
www.iptech.tv
92 SHO red/grey
3.2L(bored) Lowered compression(9:1)
stageII cams, Ported/Polished heads,Ported/polished Intake manifold(runners, endtanks, and behind the throttle body), big bore butterflies,80mm maf, LPM,equal length Long Tube Headers and custom Y pipe, Dynomax cat-back, Koni/coil-over suspension, poly-bushings everywhere,26mm FRONT sway bar, 28mm REAR sway bar,rear strut tower brace, solid subframe bushings,subframe connectors, tubular aluminum adjustable rear control arms,shortened shifter,235/45/17 Toyo Proxes T1-S's on TSW VX-1's. 15 lbs of boost here I come!

 

[ThrillSHO]

Slotted rotors have some real benefits. Slots across the face of the rotor tend to clean the face of the pad helping to reduce glazing. Glazing occurs during high speed use and lowers the Cf.

Slotting is more expensive than drilling, but has less chance of cracking.

As for wet braking, water acts as a lubricant, so until it evaporates it will lower the Cf. Will it evaporate faster if the rotors are drilled or slotted? Good question. Maybe.

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ThrillSHO Racing
93 ATX SHO
UDPs, LPM, 80mm MAF, K&N w/CAI Snorkle, 8mm Taylor wires, Koni Struts, High Rate Linear Springs, Camber plates, Adjustable rear control arms, Touque box brace, Poly bushings, 24mm front SB, 26mm rear SB, Alum SFB, Full-length SFCs, Front & Rear STBs, SS Y-pipe, Borla Cat-back, TransGo Shift Kit, Relocated battery, Five point harness, Five 2" gauges below the CD player, 225/45s on 16x7s
Very Low Very Fast

Coming soon: Coil-overs, shaved SFBs and smaller front swaybar!
Even Lower, Even Faster

 

[ThrillSHO]

Slotted rotors have some real benefits. Slots across the face of the rotor tend to clean the face of the pad helping to reduce glazing. Glazing occurs during high speed use and lowers the Cf.

Slotting is more expensive than drilling, but has less chance of cracking.

As for wet braking, water acts as a lubricant, so until it evaporates it will lower the Cf. Will it evaporate faster if the rotors are drilled or slotted? Good question. Maybe.

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ThrillSHO Racing
93 ATX SHO
UDPs, LPM, 80mm MAF, K&N w/CAI Snorkle, 8mm Taylor wires, Koni Struts, High Rate Linear Springs, Camber plates, Adjustable rear control arms, Touque box brace, Poly bushings, 24mm front SB, 26mm rear SB, Alum SFB, Full-length SFCs, Front & Rear STBs, SS Y-pipe, Borla Cat-back, TransGo Shift Kit, Relocated battery, Five point harness, Five 2" gauges below the CD player, 225/45s on 16x7s
Very Low Very Fast

Coming soon: Coil-overs, shaved SFBs and smaller front swaybar!
Even Lower, Even Faster

 

[pjtoledo]

Having spent many many miles in stop-n-go Detriot traffic, bigger is definitely better. They may be the same on the initial stop, but what about the next couple of hundred stops??? Huge difference in just normal traffic. And how about the roads in West Virginia?? If you have only 10" fronts, don't go there.
92 MTX 234,000 miles 96 fronts
95 MTX 78,000 miles 96 fronts
87 Slo 144,000 miles 95 fronts.
Perry Toledo,Ohio

 

[Jibberish18]

Sorry Thrill after reading all these posts I don't know what you have against brakes. I mean Porsche cross drills it's rotors for SOME odd reason. Various exotic cars cross-drill their rotors for SOME odd reason. After market sells cross drilled and slotted for SOME odd reason. Corvettes and Camaro's come with BIGGER front rotors for SOME odd reason. I mean come on now buddy. I don't know anything when it comes to an engineeres point of view nor am I an expert with cars let alone brakes but this is pretty logical ****. I mean when it's 15 degrees outside and my car has been sitting and I start driving the car stops wonderfully. Cool Brakes? I wonder? I don't know man. You're probably gonna come back with some post to try and make me look like a fool I guess. But we'll see. Although I'll agree you need wider tires and stickier surfaces for better stopping later.

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1990 Sable 3.0
"My goal is to have the ultimate Sable in road handling performance"

 

[Toolman]

Many race cars will have x-drilled rotors. There is a big difference between race cars and us. One, they are concerned with getting the best performance for THAT race. They are not so concerned with durability. If they go through a set of rotors in one race, non big deal. Their pockets are much deeper. To get the best out of a x-drilled rotor, the rotor needs to be of greater mass and thickness than a normal rotor. If you x-drill a standard SHO rotor, it will crack prematurely. I recommend slotting. It gives the benifits of x-drilling, but the rotor will last much longer, and they look cool.

 

[ThrillSHO]

I'm Sorry. I had no intention of making anyone out as a fool. I've enjoyed the lively debate and think many people have contributed valid points. There is certainly enough information thoughout these 50 posts to allow one to think critically about this issue and come to their own conclusions. How one upgrades their brakes is ultimately dictated by their goals.

How about this for a controversial idea. Maybe the ultimate brakes are very large aluminum drums with steel sleeves. They would result in far less unsprung weight than calipers and rotors, but they'd be real low on the WOW meter.

 

[90MTXSHO]

Originally posted by ThrillSHO:
How about this for a controversial idea. Maybe the ultimate brakes are very large aluminum drums with steel sleeves. They would result in far less unsprung weight than calipers and rotors, but they'd be real low on the WOW meter.

The ultimate brakes: I'd say a steel wall...only problem is - they're single-use

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Clint
90 Elec. Red SHO
AIM/AOL: Shaft481
My Pimpin Webpage

"Everytime I see you coming I get sick,
At least I know your ass is mine to kick." -- Zorak, Space Ghost C2C

 

[DeaconBlue]

Hey Neno, I had the new 6-piston fixed caliper Wilwood kit with 13" x 1.25" thick rotors for the Mustang Cobra in my hands at the PRI show in Indy earlier this month.

Very nice!

With a suspension setup for the track, the rotors redrilled for the 5 x 4.25" lug pattern, those calipers and the right pads bolted onto a set of '94-95 spindles, feed ATE or Castrol racing fluid by braided SS lines, with 245/45-17 track tires mounted on light weight 17 x 8.0" rims... That would produce some sweet high G-force stops!

Very nice indeed!

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95 MTX
with a few mods

 

[DeaconBlue]

If anyone would like to see these new Wilwood brakes check out the February issue of 5.0 Mustang pg #22 or try
http://www.wilwood.com/news.cfm?id=52



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95 MTX
with a few mods

 

[[email protected]]

Well, soon (I HOPE!) I shall be able to give my opinion on the Baer 13" brake upgrade!

I just picked up my 95 spindles and brackets today!

They came off an a '95 Taurus, GL I believe. They've got the ABS ring/sensor, and they're the right part. I decided to spend an extra $20 and have the yard pull them, as I didn't feel like going out in the rain to do it.

$110 for left + right. Not too shabby.

 

[olympic]

I like big brakes...LOL!

These are going on a 2700lb car.