Problem for me, puzzle for you. Any Ideas?

[E.Buzz]

I didn't know there was a difference between 94/95 Computers...or wasn't there a mid-year change? Or was that 93-94?
I'm confused! headbang

<small>[ March 16, 2004, 03:53 PM: Message edited by: E.Buzz ]</small>

 

[F-22 Raptor SHO]

94/95 computers were D4u1's differences were pointed out as to the programing earlier in this topic.


I put my D4U1 back in the car with no Ted chip and got an all clear 111's for both tests. Put the chip in and got the 511 code which says possible bad PCM or pin 1 failure. This is expected for folks running a chip (it is in the LPM directions, but I forgot this while sitting on the side of the road.

I did put my other DIS module back in the car and put liberal amounts of heat sink compound on it just because I didnt do this when I did my 60k 2 years ago. I think its the pump overheating, but cannot reproduce it. It is like a CPS failure: intermitant failure slow death rather than a once broke alway broke situation. We will see how good I feel when the 190lph arrives. Tell you what though, going down to the valley in the ATX any time soon is not on my high list of desired things to do, I dont care how much CarneAsada Pollo Asada Tom buys for a barbeque.

 

[autobahnsho]

We drove a SLO wagon from Wyoming to Idaho one time- car sputtered then shut down.

After an hour or two of wiggling cables, checking everything, wondering if we should get a ride to get a wrecker (pre-cellphone era)-

Tried to restart and it started and drove fine the rest of the trip. (around 450miles).

Fuel pump was replaced and didn't fail again. On that car, anyways...
----------------------------------------------
On my SHO the pump just died and wouldn't restart again Jan2003. Ford fuel pumps = headbang .
Especially since they can be so intermittent.

I'd definitely check the pressure the next time it bonks out on you..

 

[E.Buzz]

SHO wagon? Or does SLO really mean something, other than a burn? Last I checked, there were only two SHO wagons, and niether of them belonged to the public. Or was it custom? oh

 

[Hack]

To me, SLO is not meant to be a derogatory term. It just stems from laziness. The lack of desire to type out "standard Taurus", or "non-SHO Taurus", and the like. It was probably original coined to get under the skin of non-SHO Tauri drivers though.

 

[autobahnsho]

Semantics, semantics.
It was a wagon. It wasn't a SHO.
I guess being too lazy to type "Taurus" cost me an entire extra post...

ps- I've owned 3 Taurii- two 90 SLOs and my SHO. I've replaced fuel pumps on all three of them. Two bit the dust without warning, one started making noises so it was replaced.

The wagon above (an 89) and a 94 Sedan are the two Taurii my folks owned and both have gotten pumps........

 

[Off Road SHO]

Mike,

Something that Steve said earlier in this thread; cheching for a "whoosh" of air going into the fuel tank when opening the cap. Have you tried that?

I don't know offhand how the fuel tank is vented, but it would have to be somehow.

Does it use the cannister purge solenoid to suck excess pressure and fumes into the intake? If so, there would have to be an inlet of some sort, maybe the gas cap lets air in but not out and when the cap is busted, wont let air in. This would create a vacuum situation in the tank, wouldn't it? And going from a high pressure location of Sedona to a low pressure area like Flagg would compound the situation. Hmmmmmm.

I'll try and find the vent and purging diagrams and get back with you.

Tom

 

[F-22 Raptor SHO]

Tom:

You may have a good point there worth checking out as that could have attributed to the fuel pump failure.

FYI: scooter was right (sdpatt) that is, I suspect the fuel pump. I was armed with my tire pressure gauge and my voltmeter when the problem surfaced. Seems a trip to Waptaki ruins was enough to push her over the edge, she wet the bed 4 blocks from the house on the return trip. Here is the answer:

I did hear the fuel pump....same noise it has been making since last October. It hums for the 1.5 seconds it is supposed to do, but, I heard it in the peace and quiet of my neighborhood this time instead of on the side of the highway. It was weak, especially on the 2nd stage (the SHO has a two stage pump cycle, one low and one high....the low seemed to work ok, but the high was very labored and sounded anemic....I could actually hear a thunk like sound as it changed speeds. I had my passenger kick the up on as I used my 2.00 tire pressure gauge to measure the pressure at the rail. Yea, they work just fine and cost 1/20th of the Autozone Fuel pressure gauges.

10 psi......hmmm, she finally kicked over enough to run normally, albeit intermitantly and I could not get her above 30 psi at WOT, even when I disconnected the FP regulator hose and plugged it up. Still only an irratic 30 psi....the motor would start to choke and begin to die and with that, the FP went to 10. I could tell the passenger the split second before the engine was going to start to choke by checking the continual pressure reading.

Secondly, I used the volt meter to measure voltage thru the fuel pump override switch in the trunk....12.0 volts every time. Ok, I will drop the tank now Mr. Patterson and Mr. Dooley, I just needed to know that it was the problem and not a ghost.

Easy way to reproduce the symptoms was to trigger the FP cutoff switch during a WOT goose, the car choked and died.....well, it died a bit faster than my gradually Fuel pump peter down death.

190 lph to arrive Saturday.

Thanks dudes.

 

[S_Mazza]

It definitely sounds like your fuel pump is going bad. However, one thing that people who live near mountains ahould consider is that some cars have problems with dramatic altitude changes. Apparently, the MAP on some cars takes a reading only when the key is turned to "On" before you start the engine. So if you make a dramatic altitude change between starts, the car may just die on you. If that does happen, just waiting a minute and restarting the car should clear the problem. Or, it might be a good idea to pull off the road halfway up the slope and stop the car before it dies on its won.

I don't know if the SHO works that way, but I'be heard that many 1980s GM cars do.

P.S. - Does a tire pressure gauge really give a good fuel pressure reading? And what style of tire gauge do you mean?

 

[sdpatt]

S_Mazza:
I don't know if the SHO works that way, but I'be heard that many 1980s GM cars do.

The SHO? No. The engine control system is much more advanced than mid-80s GM cars. The only sensor that I can think of that provides a signal used at startup is the cylinder identification sensor. It informs the EEC where the number one cylinder is when the engine starts to crank.

[edit] I am aware that the CID signal is monitored by the EEC during operation, but once synchronized, the EEC does not change the spark firing sequence - or does it?

<small>[ March 19, 2004, 05:42 PM: Message edited by: sdpatt ]</small>

 

[projectSHO89]

The CID sensor is also used during normal operation. Thats why bucking/stalling is one of the symptoms of an intermittent CID.

In response to another comment, the Gen 1 and II SHOs tanks vent air into the tank through the cap. If the vent fails, the tank generates a vacuum as the fuel is consumed and will cause a "vacuum lock" condition.

Sounds like this one has been isolated to the FP. Hope it goes well!

Steve

 

[F-22 Raptor SHO]

Yes, my tire pressure gauge believe it or not was able to measure my fuel pressure. I have the one that looks like a lolly pop: round gauge atop of the reading shaft. There is a push button pressure release on it. It is all steel construction. My fuel rail schrader valve sits pretty low, but not so low that it cant be caught by the tire gauge. Your situation may vary.

a couple of caveats: be sure to clear out any residual fuel from the gauge after you use it in this fashion. I check the tire pressure a few times and vent the device.

 

[S_Mazza]

Just FYI, I looked up the operation of the MAP / BARO sensor. According to my EEC test book, it samples only at key-on-engine-off (just before startup) and at wide-open-throttle.

For an MAP sensor, that makes sense, because those are the only times manifold pressure is equal or close to atmospheric pressure.

So, if you floor the throttle (who needs an excuse?!) on a trip up or down the mountain, the computer should adjust for the change in barometric pressure.