MTX in reverse, rattle your teeth out.

[R_SHO]

Hey Guys,

Well a month and a half into owning this 92 MTX the clutch decided to smash
one spring completely out of the clutch disk.

I ordered a clutch kit and had a local tranmission shop do the install.

Into this clutch job for about $1200 bucks now. Passenger rear engine mount was bad upon them dropping the k member. I had them replace that as well.

New clutch feels great, engages right at the end of the pedal travel( i don't like that) but feels great. Goes through the forward gears no problem.

However reverse is a different story, You can put the clutch in and put it into reverse but once you let the clutch pedal off the floor about 2" it immediatly bucks the whole engine and tranny into a violent thrashing that will knock your teeth out.
If you feather the clutch gently you can get it rolling but if you try to let up on the clutch anymore it goes into massive bucking that will defenatly snap the flex pipes soon enough.

Anything more then flat ground I cannot back up,

Im able to let it roll on an incline backwards up to 8mph gently let the clutch out in reverse, get a little bucking action then i can let the clutch out all the way..
Reverse whines pretty loudly too(common sho thing?)

All engine mounts, and subframe mounts are new or replaced within the last 20k.

Transmission shop seems to be clueless about the problem,

At this time i have about 300miles on the new clutch

Whats my problem?

 

[1993MTXSHO]

well for one, if im not mistaken the clutch should be releasing near the floor with a new clutch. Also reverse gear whining is normal at higher reverse speed aka 8mph. Id say adjust your clutch and see if that helps. Put the car in 1st gear (car off) and lift the clutch peddle up with the top of your foot then slowly push it down to the floor and you'll hear a click, that means it just adjusted itself. Maybe do that a few times (i dunno if it adjusts full in one sweep, but after the clicking stops then its adjusted). If i didn't explain this well just look in your owners manuel and it tell you how to adjsut the clutch

 

[Racer X]

I'd take a long hard look at your motor mounts. The rear especially.

 

[87hurricane]

I've got the same issue, what clutch kit did you put in? I went over my engine mounts pretty carefully, and reinforced my front mount, but the rear seemed fine. Mine is not quite as violent as yours, but its still annoying, and more than it should be IMO.

 

[Howdy_Doody]

Sounds like a clutch disc issue, whose clutch kit is it? Or something binding in the driveline or brakes causing a big drag. Reverse gear is pretty high on these cars so it's almost impossible to reverse up a hill without some chatter.

 

[St Louis SHO]

I was wondering myself if they left the dowel pins out of the flywheel.

 

[R_SHO]

Upon further inspection,
I can get someone to go inside and press the clutch in and depress the clutch a number of times in a row which causes the engine and transmission to move toghether about 1/8-1/4". Seems pretty strange,

Another thing, Say i take off away from the light as normal. Clutch all the way out, i rest my foot just above the clutch pedal and give the car 5/8's or more throttle. The pedal will move away from my foot about 1/4". Enough to notice in the car, as soon as you let of the gas the clutch pedal moves back to the place just under your foot.

I have noticably more vibration at idle as well.

The rear passenger side engine mount I replaced myself. The front passenger side, and the tranny mount "look to be" in good shape from underneath the car and when putting load on them with a pry bar.

To me it sounding more like a mount, however two shops now have taken a good hour checking the car, subframe mounts, engine mounts, etc and can only guess that the clutch job was done inproperly.

I suppose the clutch being new and not broken in yet could just escalate the smaller problems at hand?

The clutch I bought was a ZOOM clutch kit. It was the middle of the line one offered at Autozone.

I have adjusted the clutch re: pulling up the pedal and slowly pushing down to the floor. Still engages near the top unfortunatly.

I know its a long shot, but if they had just put regular gear oil in there instead of the recommened atf or the mobile 1 eq would it contribute to this problem due to more friction then necerssary on the internals?

Thanks guys!

 

[St Louis SHO]

:frantic: GET THAT ZOOM OUT OF THERE! It's probably already broken. My guess now that you said that is a broken strap already.... And yes, gear oil will make it worse, but not cause it.

 

[R_SHO]

A broken strap? hah not what I want to hear..

Just searched the forum, seems to be only one guy that had that happen.
Lets hope his is an isolated case..

I would have probably done this clutch job myself if i had a warm garage space to work on it and a couple free days.

 

[Racer X]

On moving clutch pedals: Check your mounts again. Open the hood, set the e-brake/ chock the wheels, and have someone watch the engine (from the side of the car) while you engage the clutch in 1st and Reverse.

On AutoZone clutches: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDWgTeVrVUU

That one had all of 1200 miles on it at the time of filming.

 

[SASHO91]

Just searched the forum, seems to be only one guy that had that happen.
Lets hope his is an isolated case..

.

:wave: Yep... Actually, I still have that PP outback .

As far as AutoZome clutches go... well, you make up you mind on that one. Mine looked great after 60k. Disc had PLENTY (atleast another 60k on it) of meat left, and the PP although worn was in very good shape. Never had a problem with it, and I drove the crap out of that car, powershifts, launches (did get a bit of slippage at the track-track was tight though), and even a few no-lift shifts were part of that clutches diet. My car is modded as well.
There are members (myself included) that run nitrous(75shot) through the stock AZ clutch... it holds it fine.
Again, that's IMHO. Now it's great insurance to have beefy straps and what not, but I have yet to break an AZ clutch strap.

 

[St Louis SHO]

Dude... You better be quiet, or you'll be putting a clutch in after you get your new motor in... Sorry for the hijack!

:wave: Yep... Actually, I still have that PP outback .

As far as AutoZome clutches go... well, you make up you mind on that one. Mine looked great after 60k. Disc had PLENTY (atleast another 60k on it) of meat left, and the PP although worn was in very good shape. Never had a problem with it, and I drove the crap out of that car, powershifts, launches (did get a bit of slippage at the track-track was tight though), and even a few no-lift shifts were part of that clutches diet. My car is modded as well.
There are members (myself included) that run nitrous(75shot) through the stock AZ clutch... it holds it fine.
Again, that's IMHO. Now it's great insurance to have beefy straps and what not, but I have yet to break an AZ clutch strap.

 

[SinisterSHO]

:wave: Yep... Actually, I still have that PP outback .

As far as AutoZome clutches go... well, you make up you mind on that one. Mine looked great after 60k. Disc had PLENTY (atleast another 60k on it) of meat left, and the PP although worn was in very good shape. Never had a problem with it, and I drove the crap out of that car, powershifts, launches (did get a bit of slippage at the track-track was tight though), and even a few no-lift shifts were part of that clutches diet. My car is modded as well.
There are members (myself included) that run nitrous(75shot) through the stock AZ clutch... it holds it fine.
Again, that's IMHO. Now it's great insurance to have beefy straps and what not, but I have yet to break an AZ clutch strap.

Hope Hamal doesn't mind me postin his video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDWgTeVrVUU

 

[SASHO91]

Post #10 Steve.

That was his experience, and probably the only time I have heard of a new one slipping like that. Now granted, I have heard of people breaking straps.

 

[Mike93]

I had the exact same issue when I put in a bad pressure plate (used). Turned out the fingers were fatigued. New clutch solved these issues. Are you possitive the shop put in a new pressure plate?

My clutch pedal does a similar thing to yours where it moves under load...never understood why.

 

[R_SHO]

Thanks guys!


The Zoom clutch in there now feels great, car shifts smoothly.
I was able to back up today on flat ground with a bit more then feathering the clutch with no shaky shaky,
Hopefully it just needs some more time to full break in.


I have the clutch and PP that came out of the car in a box here... clutch disc was ground right down. The clutch pedal had been pretty stiff before the spring jumped ship, now it is pretty effortless to put the clutch in and go.

Im gonna check everything over again tommorow.

 

[Howdy_Doody]

Please post some pics of the Zoom disc. I'm curious if it's a reman.

 

[R_SHO]

The Zoom clutch is in the car, the one that i have in the box is most likely the original, or the first replacement.
Ill take some pics of that on sunday.