Mid Engine SHO Powered Truck - New Pics

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joeynovak

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It's not a death trap. Anyone that wants can come look at it, but frankly, I don't think anyone that has voiced a concern is qualified to inspect it anyways. And they definatly don't have the right information to make a blanket "It's not safe" statement.

It's not a goof winter project. It will be a daily driver once it is finished.

Shoaz, I think you can satisfy both requirements, care of the person who has a crazy idea's fealings, and safety of others at the same time. It is easy.

The fabrication is crude, because I lack the workspace, tools, and time to complete the project in any other fashion. Now, crude doesn't mean unsafe, it means lacking elegance. Anyways, I am not going to argue the point any further. I'm not an idiot, it's safe, very safe, it isn't going to break in half, those that still think it is unsafe, will continue to do so, unless I get it certified by an engineer, which I am not going to do. I am sure someone will slam my rebuttal, that's fine, I can take it.

Later.
 

Mels

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Good for you, Joey. I look forward to watching your project progress.

From a safety perspective, I too share others' concerns, but I'm sure you're not going to intentionally place yourself or others in harms way.

Keep us updated.
 

whitekysho

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No, I will think it's unsafe until you make a tube back-half. Are you using a stick welder for this? 6010? You don't have enough control with stick for sheetmetal.
 

SHOtimer

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Not to throw gas on a fire, but being in the insurance business, caused that to come into my mind. If you have altered a vehicle to the extent that you have and don't tell your insurance, they very well may deny coverage to you - which means you have somebody coming after you for damages to their vehicle, and their body.

On the other hand, if you do tell them amount it, they may refuse coverage.

Something to consider.

Doug
 

HotRodKid

mmmmm ... turbo
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It's not a death trap. Anyone that wants can come look at it, but frankly, I don't think anyone that has voiced a concern is qualified to inspect it anyways.

Later.

so were not qualified to inspect it, but your qualified to DESIGN it ?

:hail::hail::hail:
 

SHOspazz92

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No, I will think it's unsafe until you make a tube back-half. Are you using a stick welder for this? 6010? You don't have enough control with stick for sheetmetal.

What kind of welder do you use? Do factory trucks come with a tube back half? Do you use a stick welder? (?!) Hows your stick controll? What did you have for Thanksgiving? Do you know where the body of Jimmy Hoffa is? Who framed Roger Rabit? If you were a hot dog would you eat yourself?

-Sam
 

Brett

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What kind of welder do you use? Do factory trucks come with a tube back half? Do you use a stick welder? (?!) Hows your stick controll? What did you have for Thanksgiving? Do you know where the body of Jimmy Hoffa is? Who framed Roger Rabit? If you were a hot dog would you eat yourself?

-Sam

:rofl: this thread rocks.
 

HoustinoJillian

name's JUSTIN
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What kind of welder do you use? Do factory trucks come with a tube back half? Do you use a stick welder? (?!) Hows your stick controll? What did you have for Thanksgiving? Do you know where the body of Jimmy Hoffa is? Who framed Roger Rabit? If you were a hot dog would you eat yourself?

-Sam

definitely one of the top 10 replies by sam (in recent memory):thankyou::laugh_ti:
 

rubydist

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It's not a death trap. Anyone that wants can come look at it, but frankly, I don't think anyone that has voiced a concern is qualified to inspect it anyways. And they definatly don't have the right information to make a blanket "It's not safe" statement.

... I'm not an idiot, it's safe, very safe, it isn't going to break in half, those that still think it is unsafe, will continue to do so, unless I get it certified by an engineer, which I am not going to do.

Joey, I would be qualified to inspect it, since I have been a licensed professional engineer for over 20 years. I think the blanket "it's not safe" statement is much closer to being accurate than the blanket "it isn't going to break in half" statement.

The first reason I say that has nothing to do with your ability to design or weld (although that is very important too) but rather it has to do with the structure of the radiator core support portion of the Taurus unibody. The front end of the car was not designed strong enough to handle the loading that you will be putting on it when you drive it attached to the pickup cab like you have it - and eventually something will break there. Now, without some significant analysis one cannot say if it will break in a hundred miles or a hundred thousand miles, but it is fair to say that it will eventually break.

The fact that you have literally welded the two parts together is also of concern, because welding is a very inconsistent process. Because of that, and because of how the welding process works on the metalurgy of the items being joined, it makes the area next to the weld more brittle and lower strength. Welded joints do not like the reversing, cycling type of loading that you will put on them when you drive this unit. Eventually, I would expect fatigue cracks to appear near the weld joints. This could easily lead to a catastrophic failure, which almost certainly would have significant negative consequences. There is a technically sound reason that you just don't see vehicles that rely on a welded joint to carry the load of the vehicle - its very poor design and risky.

In every state where I have lived, a 'home-built' vehicle such as this would need to be certified by a qualified inspector before being able to be licensed and put on the road. For your sake, and for the sake of those around you, I hope you do that even if you are not required to do so in your location.
 

whitekysho

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What kind of welder do you use? Do factory trucks come with a tube back half? Do you use a stick welder? (?!) Hows your stick controll? What did you have for Thanksgiving? Do you know where the body of Jimmy Hoffa is? Who framed Roger Rabit? If you were a hot dog would you eat yourself?

-Sam

First off I am a welder in a shipyard and have worked in fabrication and I am getting into the local Ironworker's union, so I know more about welding than you would think. The back half question is ignorant because trucks don't come with the front of a Taurus as half of their frame. The stick welding question was serious even with a 1/8" rod you can't run cold enough to do sheet metal. Also learn to spell. And I had turkey for Thanksgiving.
 

platoribs

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Not that I care how far my stream can go as compared to anothers stream...

But I designed and welded together a motorcycle trailer from the rear end of a Dodge Caravan with a 7" C-channel running down the middle and fixing a trailer hitch mount on the end.

Guess what, State of Illinois couldn't care less how structurally sound it was, never looked at it once!

I trust it to do what I ask of it and don't think anybody is going to get hurt towing it.

Moral to the story is if this feller wants to frankenstien this project together for fun or daily driver one assumes he'll test it out before he takes it to the autoX course. And once he tests it he'll have a much better understanding of what all the highly experienced guru's round here are telling him.:wave:
 

SHOspazz92

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First off I am a welder in a shipyard and have worked in fabrication and I am getting into the local Ironworker's union, so I know more about welding than you would think. The back half question is ignorant because trucks don't come with the front of a Taurus as half of their frame. The stick welding question was serious even with a 1/8" rod you can't run cold enough to do sheet metal. Also learn to spell. And I had turkey for Thanksgiving.

If I craed waht you thuoght abuot my spelilng I wuold use a spell cehck at the vrey laest.

The fact that I spelled the word RABBIT wrong most certainly means that I do in fact need to learn how to spell.

Thank you for pointing that out, I'll see if I can take a college course on the subject. Of course, Filling out an application and what not might be kind of difficult due to my poor spelling abilities.

-Sam
 
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whitekysho

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If I craed waht you thuoght abuot my spelilng I wuold use a spell cehck at the vrey laest.

The fact that I spelled the word RABBIT wrong most certainly means that I do in fact need to learn how to spell.

Thank you for pointing that out, I'll see if I can take a college course on the subject. Of course, Filling out an application and what not might be kind of difficult due to my poor spelling abilities.

-Sam

You also spelled control wrong.
 

shovermont

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yo joey, that ride is one **** of a unique one. i would deffinatly take that for a hammer fest but what kind of conditions do you wanna run this under? like desert, or street or what? also could you post more pics of the welds for the frame link please. that would be nice. do you want this on the road? i hope you figure this all out and can make it pound. reccomend a roll cage hah keep updating. goodluck
 

nomov8sho

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The fact that you have literally welded the two parts together is also of concern, because welding is a very inconsistent process.

Rubydist, I was all fired up to slam you because of this statement, but then I realized I agree with the basics of most of what you said in your post. I do have to say, though, that welding (as a process) is pretty well established as being consistent, safe, and the best method of fabricating custom frame components. Look at pretty much any hot rod shop- "Z'd" and "C'd" frames, camaro front clips grafted to early fords, not to mention full tube frames, NASCAR, and pro-street rear subframes. I don't see these guys bolting sections of bar together. They weld, and in many cases it is worlds better than the original, if designed and executed properly.

That being said:

This for Joeynovak-

It looks like the brackets that tie the P/U frame stubs to the SHO subframe are fastened (welded?) to the front frame horns of the SHO clip. This is a crumple zone, designed to fail in case of an accident, and probably not the best thing to have in the middle of a frame. I would suggest also running some rectangle tubing from the narrow "box" section of the frame, to tie into the P/U frame directly to reinforce across this weak area. Also, you might consider adding some cross-bracing diagonally from each front corner of the "box" sections of SHO frame to the stubs of the P/U frame.

I'm a little concerned with the steering setup- it looks like the "steering fixator" holds in place to the body pretty well, but what holds the steering column to the "fixator"? It seems to me like the best way to deal with steering is to ditch the entire setup and replace the steering rack with a solid bar fixed to the SHO front clip.

Now for the gas tank. I'd possibly think about relocating it under the center rear of the new cab section, if it were not for my best guess that a rear end collision would probably crush the crumple zones on the SHO subframe, pushing a hot exhaust manifold right into the tank. I'd say leave it in front, but turn it 90 degrees and tuck it as close to firewall as you can, and replace that yellow rubber line (air hose?) with hard line for the long run under the vehicle and as close as you can get to the pump.

Last, I would seriously recommend finding a local weld shop to look at your welds for the brackets joining the P/U stubs and the SHO frame. It's hard to tell in the pictures, but it looks to me like you ran pretty cold beads, judging by the pics under "viola!" and "I'm not so sure..." in your album. This means that it may look like there's a solid weld there, but it does not go deep enough into the parent material to be structurally sound

I hope you take all this as constructive criticism. It does not look to me like you are doing a half-assed job. I think you are putting a good deal of planning and ingenuity into building a fun project. Even with my above comments, I think I'd feel safer riding in or driving next to your project than I would in many of the heaps of junk I see driving on public roads down here in Florida.

Oh- and don't count on the state "inspection" to tell you if your vehicle is safe. You may have a few good guys in the inspection centers, but a lot of them won't have any clue what they are looking at if it's not stock. Why do you think they are working in the inspection center instead of a real garage?

Congratulations on having the cojones to tackle such an ambitious project, and jumping right in with both feet.:woohoo:

You inspire me to continue my plans for a SHO-powered... nope, it's gonna be a surprise.:evilgrin:

Josh,
Mechanical Engineer
 

Power Surge

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Hmmm... Virginia.... that should be enough distance from me to not have to worry about being on the same road with this....
 

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