many many questions in this one thread

[LOUDSHO92]

1) The one thing I have seen withthe +20s is that they loose torque all accros the RPM range. I havent seen a dyno to say otherwise. I would rather go with SHOShop?SHOBros cams, hopefully they will be out soon.

4) It ishttp://www.fastpartsnetwork.com/ .

6) I did it and it and it is as easy as swapping calipers, just need to grind off a little bit. Also it is a huge liability issue as well. No one is saying what the offset is becasue well no one knows, except for maybe Josh. Ask him as he made the brakets.

7) Muffler shops will have a large selsction of tips so you can see them. When I was rear ended I had to get new mufflers so they put on DynoMax mufflers and they look pretty good. They also put on a short tip with a quick 90 degree turn. They are tucked under and look nice.

The stock pipes are good for all N/A applications. If you get a good weldshop they can do a good job of welding them.

8) SHOBros and SHONut sells them.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

1) IIRC when Mike owned midwestsho, didn't he team up with shonut when selling cams. Now that shobros has taken over, are they (shobros) working on their own set of cams? Sorry, but over the past few days, I've tried to do as much reading up as I can, but I have been so busy over the past several months, that I haven't frequented this forum much and ultimately lost touch on everything that is current.

The car is already partially disassembled and I want to get it back on the road asap. What is the status with other vendors coming out with cams. Is it worth while to hold off on the cams and wait until another vendor comes out with another design, or just order Josh's 20+ cams? I'm not looking to dump $650+ into a set of cams if they aren't going to perform well, but Josh is a reputable person so I doubt the cams are inferior. Can someone comment on this?

6) is Josh the only one that has fab'ed up some brackets for 13" rotors. I'm sure that someone has done it on their own. No? If I have to be the first person to do it on my own, I'll be happy to do a write-up. Someone else has to have done it though..

7) Where is the best (cheapest) place to order just the dynomax mufflers. summit / jegs? From what it looks like with the dynomax kit, the tips are already welded on. Can you buy these exact muffles outright, meaning not in kit form, that already have the tips welded on. These tips look decent, not too big.

 

[jedhead]

The SHOBrosGarage Stage 1 and Stage 2 cams are the ones SHO Shop developed and sold for over 10 years. They have been dynotested on SHOShops dynojet on many cars over the years. Hundreds have been sold over the years.

Bob

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

Not to stir the ***, but didn't shoshop make one of the worst performing set of cams, with tolerances that were terrible?

Or were the cams actually a great design when tolerances were dead on. However, because there was a lack of quality & maintaining tight tolerance, today we only think of the shoshop cams having terrible performance.

If the latter is the case, are shobros taking the good design, but using a more reputable shop who cares about maintaining tight tolerances. Ultimately yielding a great set of cams?

Just trying to dig up the details.

 

[jedhead]

Not to stir the ***, but didn't shoshop make one of the worst performing set of cams, with tolerances that were terrible?

Or were the cams actually a great design when tolerances were dead on. However, because there was a lack of quality & maintaining tight tolerance, today we only think of the shoshop cams having terrible performance.

If the latter is the case, are shobros taking the good design, but using a more reputable shop who cares about maintaining tight tolerances. Ultimately yielding a great set of cams?

Just trying to dig up the details.

The SHO Shop cams were hand ground. The quality control was not as good as they should have been. We are considering taking specs to a vendor who can machine grind them consistantly. As for terrible performance, I cannot say for sure other than I was able to run down a modded GEN3 SHO without my secondaries (shortly after my stage 1 cam install) and pull 7800rpm in 4th and still pulled after shifting into 5th. Then I made some toothpicks. I later hooked up the secondaries and wow. I plan on runnng my stage 1 equipped SHO on the dyno and I will compare with my previous sheet on my internally stock 3.0 with bolt on mods and stock cat back.

Bob

 

[LOUDSHO92]

1) Yes SHONut and Midwest worked on the cams. SHOBros sells SHONut and will sell the old SHOShop cams.

No one else has cams in the works that I am aware of. SHoBros will be rereleasing the SHOShop cams they should be cheaper, around $500 or less.

Joshes cams are of very good quality but like I said they have good HP gains but they loose TQ all accross the bands from the dynos I have seen.

SHOShop made cams with good dyno proven gains, just the quality sucked. SHoBros will be working to to get a place to do it with much better quality.

6) He is the only place that I know of to make them.

7) Those places are good, dont know about the tips.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

1) When is the estimated completion date for the shobros cams?

I need to throw out the idea of "if you were me" what would you do in the way of cams. I might as well toss some cams in this engine. I'm gonna be right there and have fully planned on adding cams down the road. But right now is a perfect opportune time to do it. Should I just go with the 20+ from Josh, should I just hold off with both shimming the valves and wait for shobros to release their shoshop version cams (assuming they also include the shim service kit for customers who buy their cams).

One of the biggest reasons why I wanted to add cams besides performance was that it included the shim rental. It was that old analogy of killing two birds with one stone. I was eventually going to add cams, now is the time to do it because I can use the shim kit which is that added benefit.

Seeing how the car is in excellent condition (obviously driven easy) and had the 60k done, I don't have too much worry about letting the cams go for a few months if shobros is going to be releasing their cams (seeing how it seems as though not only are they going to be cheaper, but supposedly in the past, dyno charts show a better overall performance compared to the current shonut cams) No offense to Josh. Obviously if shobros can mimic the shoshop cams only this time around maintain tighter tolerances, then it would be in my best interest to hold off buying cams until the shobros are released.

Ultimately, this back and forth about cams isn't making the decision any easier. I wish someone could chime in with heavy knowledge / experience on which cams to choose. I should also state no offense to everyone who has replied to this thread.

7) I did a quick search on summitracing.com for the dynomax mufflers and I ran across items:

WLK-17684 $91.69



http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=WLK%2D17684&N=400358+4294908331+4294907826+4294839534+4294924761+4294922711+115&autoview=sku

&

WLK-17685 $91.99



http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=WLK%2D17685&N=400358+4294908331+4294907826+4294839534+4294924761+4294922711+115&autoview=sku

 

[LOUDSHO92]

1) I would like to say soon but I dont know. Brian (GoofSHO) would know.

If I were you I would go with the SHOBros cams. With the dyno gains and the quality I hope for they will be very well worth it. I can install cams in a day and with the better quality it would be better. I know you mean about the shims.

The motor will proabably be fine if you wait for a few month, I know some SHO can go with out a 60k and be fine.

The SHONut cams +20 are equivalent to the SHOShop Stage 2. The only problem with the SHONut is the loss in TQ. SHOShop doesnt have this problem.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

1) I assume that I should be fine if I buy an entire gasket kit, replace all of the gaskets right now except for the cam seals (keep these in a safe place until I buy the cams), then a few months down the road when the shobros cams are for sale, rip back into the motor and reuse the intake to head gaskets (the thin steel ones) and the outside perimeter valve cover & inside spark plug o-ring gaskets & finally put on the fresh cam seals (the new ones that I never installed)?

should this work ok? sorry for sounding so wordy..

 

[LOUDSHO92]

Seems good. I would tlak to GoofSHO about dates.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

4) by the way, AC Delco wires seem to be highly favored on this site and I've searched and searched. People claim to have found these wires for as cheap as $32 but many have found them for around $40.

The only post that I could find was one guy said he picked up a set at O'Reilly Auto Parts. The closest O'Reilly's is several states away. Is there an online website that I can order them for under $40? eBay wants $60.

Is fastpartsnetwork.com the cheapest for the motorcraft plugs at $24 + shipping.

 

[TYSHO]

4) by the way, AC Delco wires seem to be highly favored on this site and I've searched and searched. People claim to have found these wires for as cheap as $32 but many have found them for around $40.

The only post that I could find was one guy said he picked up a set at O'Reilly Auto Parts. The closest O'Reilly's is several states away. Is there an online website that I can order them for under $40? eBay wants $60.

Is fastpartsnetwork.com the cheapest for the motorcraft plugs at $24 + shipping.

You can get the plugs for under $20 total at O'Reilly's, I think I paid like $18.

As for the AC Delco wires, get them from RCM. You can get them at say O'Reilly's, but you're going to have to pay like $15 on top of that for shipping and ect from the "special order" because they are not stocked. In the end, RCM is cheaper.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

I found the genuine motorcraft plugs for only $18 at oreillyauto.com but I couldn't find the ac delco wires. Even with shipping, it seems to be the best deal. because I'd have to pay a seperate $7 shipping through fastpartsnetwork.com for just the plugs. Is oreillyauto.com the only place to get this good of a deal?

 

[CerberuS]

uap-napa?

 

[luigisho]

I found the genuine motorcraft plugs for only $18 at oreillyauto.com but I couldn't find the ac delco wires. Even with shipping, it seems to be the best deal. because I'd have to pay a seperate $7 shipping through fastpartsnetwork.com for just the plugs. Is oreillyauto.com the only place to get this good of a deal?

You can get them from RCM as was mentioned. Russ is around Pittsburgh so if you have to you can always go there and pick stuff up.

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

Sorry guys/gals. I kinda got caught up with work over the past few days and haven't checked in on this thread.

Overall, I have a pretty good idea how I'm going to go about with the maintenance and modifications. I just need to figure out exactly what needs ordered.

Once I come up with a list, I'll post it to see if it passes final approval of the board LOL

Thanks for everyone’s input.

-Scott-

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

Alright.. Here is the list that I’ve come up with so far.

Please let me know if there is anything that I should add.

I would like to order everything by Friday, so hopefully I can have the car done and on the road again in 2 weeks or less.

Feel free to speak up if anything isn’t kosher.

1. Complete upper gasket kit
2. Complete lower gasket kit
3. Extrude honed intake w/ BBB’s – already have
4. Oil blow-by catch can – just ordered
5. Shoshop cai – already have
6. 80mm maf – already have
7. Tweecer RT
8. Stainless hi-flow y-pipe w/ cats – already have
9. Reinforced motor mounts – already have
10. Aluminum subframe bushings – already have
11. AGSP-32-FM Motorcraft Plugs
12. Motorcraft Plug Wires – already have
13. Rod Bearings
14. Timing belt – already have
15. 2 accessory belts
16. Ultrasonic cleaned & flow tested fuel injectors – just ordered
17. 2 front knuckles from a 94-95 Taurus –have 1, need to pick up another this weekend
18. 2 rear knuckles from a 90-92 Taurus SHO – already have
19. 4 GM GTP adj. control arms – already have
20. 4 reducing sleeves – already have
21. Knuckle braces – already have
22. H brace – already have
23. Subframe connectors – already have
24. Front & rear STB’s – already have
25. 4 upper strut mounts
26. TPR entire suspension bushing kit
27. Kazera KZ-V 17x7 wheels – just ordered
28. 225/45WR-17 Dunlop SP Sport FM901 – just ordered
29. Gorilla spline drive lug nuts
30. 2 PBR Cobra aluminum calipers w/ brackets – just ordered
31. 2 13” Baer Eradispeed rotors w/ proper lug hole pattern
32. 2 90-92 rear calipers w/ 11.6 spacers – already have
33. 2 11.6 Baer Eradispeed rotors w/ centering rings.
34. Stainless brake lines – already have
35. Copper crush washers
36. New headlights – just ordered

Is there anything else on these lines that I’m forgetting?

Don’t be afraid to speak up LOL

 

[TYSHO]

Might as well get a supercharger/turbo kit while you're at it...

 

[KeystonePowderCoating]

Yeah, it does seem like quite a list.

However what makes it nice is that I've been collecting these parts over the years.

Mostly on ebay but I've also bought a bunch of parts from people on the forums.

Plus, I've picked up several performance sho's, kept the performance stuff that I needed at that time, or what I figure that I'd need for the future, then sell off all the other parts and try to recover as much of the purchase price for the car as I could.

As you can see from the list, I already have many of the expensive items. I've been wanting to put all of these parts to good use for the past few years. But my current daily driver isn't in good enough condition to warrant installing the performance parts.

Then I just recently found the sho in the forum classifieds. I picked it up because it was in really good condition and an excellent platform.

Now I finally have a great condition car to start with, I want to do all of the maintenance stuff, and a few mods but nothing too drastic.

 

[TYSHO]

Then I just recently found the sho in the forum classifieds. I picked it up because it was in really good condition and an excellent platform.

Now I finally have a great condition car to start with, I want to do all of the maintenance stuff, and a few mods but nothing too drastic.

Good luck on your SHO, can't wait to see the final product!