Better setup - now in Top 5

Disclaimer: Links on this page pointing to Amazon, eBay and other sites may include affiliate code. If you click them and make a purchase, we may earn a small commission.

shomesomesho

G-force addict
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Messages
1,206
Reaction score
43
Location
more rubber, more HP.....
Made a few changes to the SHO that I think helped dramatically, leading to a top 5 finish (of 115) last Sunday's event. Results here (scroll to bottom for overall ranked raw times).

Setup changes:
- upgrading to 17x8 rims with 245-40's - this I think made the biggest difference. There is considerably more margin before reaching the traction limit. Previously was running 225-50/16's on 16x7's, which are like training wheels in comparison. Even though the 17x8 rims+tires is heavier (41 lbs. vs. 36 lbs.), the gain in traction & stability far outweighs the weight gain (no pun intended :)). If someone makes 17x9 rims in the proper bolt pattern and offset, those would be even better. The hunt begins.

- smaller rear swaybar, 20mm to 18mm (rear alignment 1/8" toe-out, 2.1 deg neg camber). Car still oversteers a tad too much, especially during hard trailbraking, where I find I have to countersteer to stabilize the car. That's time lost. I can't seem to find any smaller swaybar, so I will probably set the rear toe to zero, or toe-out to 1/16". I might even try running without a rear swaybar. While oversteer is nice & fun, and it feels faster, in reality it's not. Neutral is better.

- air/fuel ratio 12.8 (previously 13.1); I did back-to-back runs comparing each setting and was about 0.8 sec faster with the 12.8 A/F ratio. That's the best evidence I have right now short of dyno data.

The SHO was the fastest FWD (and faster than all the AWD's for that matter) out there, but got beat out by a Z06 (raw horsepower & tq, no surprise there) and a stock '84 Porsche 944 (non-turbo 4-cyl 2.5L, 170hp/140 tq, 2900 lbs.). The husband & wife driving the 944 are both world-class autocrossers, having each won multiple National championships. That is both humbling and encouraging to me, especially seeing what can be accomplished with that level of driving skill given the HP limitations of that car.

I think the SHO has a little more left in her, probably about 1 to 1.5 seconds more, if I cleaned up my driving and tweaked the rear to be a little less loose. Other than that, probably the biggest limitations at this point is lack of enough torque to pull out of the turns, especially in that critical 3-5k rpm range. It just may be time to strap on the supercharger. :dribble:

P.S. If you look at the 4th to 8th place finishes, amazingly the time separating them is merely tenths to sub-tenths of a second, literally less than an eye-blink. Think about it - that's time that could be made up just by shifting a little faster, letting the clutch out a little sooner, getting on the gas a little quicker, or even just by a more effective starting line launch.
 
Last edited:

zak

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Joined
May 15, 2002
Messages
1,771
Reaction score
497
Location
east of Hartford
Did you mean front sway bar, or rear sway bar (18 mm seems very small on the rear)? Are the 245/40's DOT race or street? Curious - zak
 

Shoaz

Studly dood
Joined
Mar 25, 2003
Messages
4,637
Reaction score
593
Location
Scottsdale, AZ
Made a few changes to the SHO that I think helped dramatically, leading to a top 5 finish (of 115) last Sunday's event. Results here (scroll to bottom for overall ranked raw times).

Most excellent! Kudos! Woot!!

Setup changes:
- upgrading to 17x8 rims with 245-40's - this I think made the biggest difference. There is considerably more margin before reaching the traction limit. Previously was running 225-50/16's on 16x7's, which are like training wheels in comparison. Even though the 17x8 rims+tires is heavier (41 lbs. vs. 36 lbs.), the gain in traction & stability far outweighs the weight gain (no pun intended :)). If someone makes 17x9 rims in the proper bolt pattern and offset, those would be even better. The hunt begins.

It's too bad that 16x8 rims are so hard to find. FWIW, though, I've seen no performance difference between running my 16x8 ROH rims and the 16x7.5 Borbets. IIRC, two of the track records I set last year were on the Borbets, but I really can't tell any difference in lap time between the two rim widths. I run 245/45s on both, so I think the majority of the advantage you got was from the wider tread width. More rubber on the road, ya know... ;)

I don't know of anyone who's managed to make a 9" rim work on a SHO.

- smaller rear swaybar, 20mm to 18mm (rear alignment 1/8" toe-out, 2.1 deg neg camber). Car still oversteers a tad too much, especially during hard trailbraking, where I find I have to countersteer to stabilize the car. That's time lost. I can't seem to find any smaller swaybar, so I will probably set the rear toe to zero, or toe-out to 1/16". I might even try running without a rear swaybar. While oversteer is nice & fun, and it feels faster, in reality it's not. Neutral is better.

Well, you're way into the differences between a good road course setup and an autocross setup, so I can't help ya there. There's no way I could run that setup on a road course without being dangerous, but it does sound exactly like what a lot of people do for autocross. Clearly whatever you're doing is working for ya, so keep the results coming. :thumb:

The SHO was the fastest FWD (and faster than all the AWD's for that matter) out there, but got beat out by a Z06 (raw horsepower & tq, no surprise there) and a stock '84 Porsche 944 (non-turbo 4-cyl 2.5L, 170hp/140 tq, 2900 lbs.). The husband & wife driving the 944 are both world-class autocrossers, having each won multiple National championships. That is both humbling and encouraging to me, especially seeing what can be accomplished with that level of driving skill given the HP limitations of that car.

A well setup 944 should always have an advantage on you on an autocross course. They're light, they're 50/50 balance right out of the box, and they're freaking Porsches for god's sake!

We have a spec series for 'em, so they're like flies, they're everywhere. I pass 'em only when there's a long straight where they just don't have enough juice to get up to speed (that's the hp advantage, although their weight advantage makes it close) or when the driver is less than stellar. Other than that I'm screwed when it comes to a 944...if the car is well setup and the driver's good, there's no way I can keep up. I'd think it'd be even worse on an autocross course.

And I'm talking about a lightened, race-prepped car here. The unlightened, streetable 944s are cake to out-run, and I can usually out run a 944T, even race-prepped if the driver isn't great.

I think the SHO has a little more left in her, probably about 1 to 1.5 seconds more, if I cleaned up my driving and tweaked the rear to be a little less loose. Other than that, probably the biggest limitations at this point is lack of enough torque to pull out of the turns, especially in that critical 3-5k rpm range. It just may be time to strap on the supercharger. :dribble:

There's always more ways to get speed, and there'll always be somebody faster than you. That's the beginning of the slippery slope into cubic $$, so be careful.

P.S. If you look at the 4th to 8th place finishes, amazingly the time separating them is merely tenths to sub-tenths of a second, literally less than an eye-blink. Think about it - that's time that could be made up just by shifting a little faster, letting the clutch out a little sooner, getting on the gas a little quicker, or even just by a more effective starting line launch.

Welcome to the world of serious competition. It's a ton of fun, especially when you're doing well (and I know you know that). IMHO, though, the way to keep it fun is to not take it too seriously.
 
Last edited:

shomesomesho

G-force addict
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Messages
1,206
Reaction score
43
Location
more rubber, more HP.....
Did you mean front sway bar, or rear sway bar (18 mm seems very small on the rear)? Are the 245/40's DOT race or street? Curious - zak

Yes, rear swaybar. I am not running a front swaybar. I think part of the problem is most of the weight (2/3) is over the front wheels, and the rear is so light that under hard trailbraking with even more forward weight shift, rear gets very unstable and tends to break loose.

The 245/40's are Dot R Hankook Z-214's.
 

BlackonBlack89

SHO Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2006
Messages
1,508
Reaction score
364
Location
burlington county,NJ
Nice Job. Must be funny that a taurus is beating all of those other cars
Where are the pics....thats my favorite part:dribble:


I don't know of anyone who's managed to make a 9" rim work on a SHO.

panamapat had 9 wide wheels on that blown 89 race sho he was thinkin about selling.
 
Last edited:

shomesomesho

G-force addict
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Messages
1,206
Reaction score
43
Location
more rubber, more HP.....
Most excellent! Kudos! Woot!!

Thanks, man! :thumb:

A well setup 944 should always have an advantage on you on an autocross course. They're light, they're 50/50 balance right out of the box, and they're freaking Porsches for god's sake!

True, but I'm having tons of fun chasing them down!


There's always more ways to get speed, and there'll always be somebody faster than you. That's the beginning of the slippery slope into cubic $$, so be careful.

Yes, but for once I'd like to see the beloved SHO be the fastest kid on the block. Just once . . .

Welcome to the world of serious competition. It's a ton of fun, especially when you're doing well (and I know you know that). IMHO, though, the way to keep it fun is to not take it too seriously.

Absolutely. I just remember all the looks of disbelief on other drivers' faces when they realize they've been smoked by a Taurus, and that puts the whole thing in perspective. :) I dunno, sometimes I think I'm having way too much fun and it shows. . .folks look at me funny when I'm in grid and break out into laughter for no apparent reason. :lol:
 

shomesomesho

G-force addict
Joined
Mar 1, 2005
Messages
1,206
Reaction score
43
Location
more rubber, more HP.....
Nice Job. Must be funny that a taurus is beating all of those other cars.

Trust me, the look on other drivers' faces is priceless. It's kinda like the big time slugger who gets called out looking at strike 3. Fear, uncertainty, and doubt all rolled into one.

Some of them even refuse to talk to me anymore, or look me straight in the eye, but that's ok. Their problem, not mine. :evilgrin:

Where are the pics....thats my favorite part:dribble:

Sorry, don't have any. Photographer didn't show up this time. Maybe next weekend.
 

zak

Supporting Member
Supporting Member
Joined
May 15, 2002
Messages
1,771
Reaction score
497
Location
east of Hartford
Are you running coilovers then? What rates if I might inquire?
- zak
 

Forum statistics

Threads
107,098
Messages
1,181,377
Members
16,160
Latest member
tinkerkathleen

Members online

No members online now.
Back
Top