'95 ATX, codes 181, 189, 215, smells like gas

[nomov8sho]

OK, here's the situation:

Just replaced my DIS with a junkyard part last week, and everything was good.

Yesterday it started running a little rough and seemed down on power, and I got a little smell of gas under the hood, but no codes.

Today, I had intermittent CEL, a stronger smell of gas under the hood, and it seemed a little more sluggish. I got the following codes from KOEO test:

181 lean rear O2 signal @ part throttle
189 lean front O2 signal @ part throttle
215 Ignition Coil 1

What do you think? Would a leaky injector seal or fuel pressure regulator seal drain off enough fuel pressure to run it lean?

I'm kind of believing the lean code since it's coming from both O2 sensors, which are less than 1-1/2 years old, but I just got it up and running after an extended battle with a bad DIS to the point I thought it needed Cats. Would the O2 sensors foul that quick?

I would think if it were the DIS causing a miss again it would be rich if anything.

I'm kind of grasping at straws, but here's my current plan of attack:

-change fuel filter, tighten down fuel pressure regulator
-clean MAF
-change coil pack
-swap in 2nd spare DIS
-unplug TPS if the above fail to fix problem
-check fuel pressure

Other ideas? Anyone?

Thanks in advance,
-Josh

 

[93markVIII]

if you smell gas under the hood, there is a leak. find it before your car blows up...

if you are low on fuel pressure, then yeah, your car is gonna run lean.

 

[SHOdded]

If not a leak, possibly an overflowing vapor canister or faulty check valve/purge solenoid.

 

[rubydist]

in my experience, lean on both banks is often an indication of a vacuum leak. there are a bunch of 20 year old vacuum hoses on the engine - good chance that one of them has a big crack in it.

on the coil failure code, my experience has been 50/50 on whether it really is a coil issue or a dis issue. if you have a known good coil, I would swap that in, but I'm guessing dis. they are very sensitive to you doing a good job of heat sink paste behind it.

gas smell has nearly always been due to a purge solenoid issue causing a saturated vapor canister in my experience. just eliminate the solenoid and let it vent all the time. btw, the hose from the canister to the intake is one of the most common sources of vacuum leaks, since the fuel ruins that hose after all these years.

 

[nomov8sho]

I'll certainly check my vapor canister and vacuum lines,but I replaced all of it less than a year ago when I did the 60k.

Something to check , anyway.

Thanks,
-Josh

 

[nomov8sho]

Well, update time...

I did the full 60K about a year ago and replaced ALL the hoses with silicone, new fittings, etc.- I did find a cracked boot at the EGR valve vacuum line, but it popped the 181 and 189 codes again after I replaced it.

It failed emissions last week with marginal NOX readings, so I cleaned the MAF and put on a new air filter, and cleaned the EGR (that's when I found the cracked boot).

Pulled the SPOUT, and passed emissions today, but it's still popping 181 and 189, has a little "popping" in the exhaust at idle.

Any thoughts? I'm starting to get the feeling I'll be replacing the Cats soon....

 

[SHOdded]

Is the fuel smell still there (idle/under load)? I keep thinking unburnt fuel for the popping noise, but your O2 sensors are indicating a lean condition. Can you verify what all in the ignition path you have tested/replaced (DIS, coil pack, spark plug wires, spark plugs,etc)? Leaky injector(s) or seal(s)? Exhaust leak, maybe a pinhole leak, possibly at the manifold?

EDIT: When you did the 60K, did you clean out the EGR tube/nostrils?

 

[rubydist]

now it sounds like you have a small exhaust leak - it will suck fresh air into the exhaust and 'fool' the 02 sensors into thinking its lean, and when you get off the throttle it can snap and pop. I would start by checking around the place where the y-pipe clamps to the exhaust manifold, as they are notorious for small leaks there.

 

[AREA 91]

When you replaced the DIS, did you remove the crossover tube?
You may have forgotten to tighten the clamps down.

 

[nomov8sho]

Is the fuel smell still there (idle/under load)? I keep thinking unburnt fuel for the popping noise, but your O2 sensors are indicating a lean condition. Can you verify what all in the ignition path you have tested/replaced (DIS, coil pack, spark plug wires, spark plugs,etc)? Leaky injector(s) or seal(s)? Exhaust leak, maybe a pinhole leak, possibly at the manifold?

EDIT: When you did the 60K, did you clean out the EGR tube/nostrils?

Replaced DIS twice with junkyard parts. Spark plugs / wires less than 1 year old, did a visual on wires for burnt / cracking, checked for oil in plug wells- none found. I was going to replace the coil pack, but have not yet done so. Maybe next step.

Both J-yard DIS units were aftermarket. Both times, the new DIS seemed to clear the issue up, but I'm not positive that wasn't just from the codes / calibration being cleared when I unhooked the battery. I finally grabbed an OEM Motorcraft a few weekends ago from a T-bird SC and I'm going to try that as an easy test.

The popping noise seems to be at idle, is not regular like a miss or spark skip- it may be happening under load and in motion also, but just not loud enough to be heard in those conditions.

I did not do injector seals at the 60k, I was thinking it might be worth a shot to do those, and have the injectors sonic cleaned at the same time. I may get a J-yard set to refurb and have ready to swap in.

-Josh

 

[nomov8sho]

When you replaced the DIS, did you remove the crossover tube?
You may have forgotten to tighten the clamps down.

Nope, did not remove crossover tube.

-Josh

 

[nomov8sho]

now it sounds like you have a small exhaust leak - it will suck fresh air into the exhaust and 'fool' the 02 sensors into thinking its lean, and when you get off the throttle it can snap and pop. I would start by checking around the place where the y-pipe clamps to the exhaust manifold, as they are notorious for small leaks there.

I'll definitely look for exhaust leaks. Good call.

The "popping" seems to be random and is only noticeable at idle.

Since I replaced the 02 sensors and cleaned MAF and EGR the performance has been normal, no bogging or falling flat, no 215 codes.

Still showing the 181 and 189 lean codes on KOEO test, no codes KOER.

-Josh

 

[nomov8sho]

Also, on an unrelated note, one of the front brake pads disintegrated a few days ago. Just to add insult to injury I guess.

Fortunately, having multiple SHOs, I had planned for just such an occurrence and have set of rotors and performance pads on the shelf from the last Rock Auto clearance.



-Josh

 

[rubydist]

also, take a look under the hood at night and spray some water on the plug wires. just because they are relatively new does not guarantee that they are good, and a leaking spark can also sound like a snap or pop. at night with some water sprayed on it, you should be able to see it too, if that is what is going on.