1995 Sho Codes

[Reinovator]

Well, I've never had to look at timing marks- due to a belt skipping a tooth or two- so I don't know how things line up after it's run for a while. But I do remember cars running like crap after jumping a timing belt tooth. Might be worth your while to replace the belt and check the belt tensioners and the harmonic balancer-- it is a 2 piece unit that can separate over time. try running a search on the timing belt jumping a tooth and see what's archived on the board. I know it's been discussed several times

I did get it torn down who ever did the Last timing belt seems to have some Knowledge of these types of Systems the did use anti- seize on the harmonic Pulley. it came of with ease and it does seem to be off a tooth I have had time to take the timing gear off though. it started raining and the wind picked up alot. one the I did notice is alot of fluid thrown from the power steering pump I'll have to change that. and while I'm at it I will swap out the Cam sensor with a used one I have. It may have some fluid in side it and in the electrical connector, Since I'm already that far in to it.
Couldn't hurt.

 

[Reinovator]

looks like it is off one tooth. I don't think it skipped, I think the guy who put the belt on was not careful and got it off one tooth at installation. It will run remarkably different if the valve timing is off one tooth v. correct...

I agree. we'll see. I'm going to change out the cam sensor with a used one off a running 3.0 engine I pulled a few years ago, It smoked a little. won't get to it until Sunday going to take my son and family out of town for his seventh birthday (He has Aspergers syndrome) tomorrow should be fun.

Anything you folks think I should look for while I have it torn down this far?
And thank you all again.

 

[luigisho]

I presumed it could have jumped a tooth assuming that it ran ok before and problems started out of the blue. I would check the tensioners and gauge how old the crank sensor and front main seal are since they will be exposed.

 

[Reinovator]

I presumed it could have jumped a tooth assuming that it ran ok before and problems started out of the blue. I would check the tensioners and gauge how old the crank sensor and front main seal are since they will be exposed.

Thank you for the advise. The timing belt looks new, I bought it in this condition, I'm hoping to have the lower gear off Sunday , If the rain stops. It has had work done before the gentleman parked it. Anti-seize is in good condition on outer harmonic pulley, I don't know if the crank timing gear has been pulled before the anti-seize is pushed up onto the gear. I will have to pull it to find out. If it's all good then from what I have been told here the next step is Cam sensor and Wiring. we shall see.

 

[Reinovator]

the lower gear looks Great popped right out ( but it was firmly seated) anti-seize must have been used there too i could see a little . There was a little oil, very little. in the area . so I went ahead and re installed every thing back as it was. I used a vise with aluminum jaw covers and slowly collapsed the belt tension er it was pretty firm no apparent leakage.





From there since every thing was out of the way i installed a good used Cam sensor from a running engine. while I was removing the old sensor the pig tail retaining tabs snapped of so i get to change that plug. I will finish tomorrow.

 

[Reinovator]

Put it back together, a little hard to start, but that would be normal. When it did catch it ran smooth at about 12hundred RPM then Idled down to 1.5 hundred RPMs.
NO check engine light. I let it idle for a few min then gave it a rev. and it fell on it's face at 4 hundred rpm. then idled well still no check engine light. I'm going to check fuel pump pressure after a test drive to get more gas.

 

[luigisho]

Sometimes the car falls flat when the computer starts to relearn idle.

 

[Reinovator]

Sometimes the car falls flat when the computer starts to relearn idle.

Oh, Ok,Thanks .

 

[Reinovator]

Wow runs OK, picked up my boys from school no real problems up to 35 mph. Put a couple of fresh gallons of gas in then did some acceleration tests. 30 to 60, zero to 60 zero to 40. no hiccups, I could feel some slight hesitations at first may need some fresh plugs, but over all it seemed OK.

Question?
Could the timing belt have been jumping and causing a miss reading, from it not being installed correctly, as in the tensioner not being compressed and just the pulley being used for tension?
just a thought, some thing I was wondering about.

 

[rubydist]

I doubt seriously the timing was jumping, because if it jumps, it only jumps in one directly and would not (likely) have been only one tooth off. I believe it was assembled one tooth off, as this is very common and easy to do.

 

[Reinovator]

I doubt seriously the timing was jumping, because if it jumps, it only jumps in one directly and would not (likely) have been only one tooth off. I believe it was assembled one tooth off, as this is very common and easy to do.

I have to agree with you this and my wifes 89 SHO are the only timing belt "Belt" Cars I have ever owned. I have had Timing chains jump back and forth one or two teeth But they were rare, ( a 302 for in a 70 torino and a couple of 350 chevs I've owned) this happens on deceleration, in my experience. This is why it was suspect to me. because the last time the car died I was decelerating. which in my mind( a dangrous place to go alone) with the tourque on the crank suddenly slack and momentum built up in the cams slack belt could skip but both cam gears staying together and the crank skipping? not likely.
Then again I have seen stranger things.

 

[Reinovator]

Update! so far so Good I've only gone a Few miles on this Fix other priorities have taken up my Time check engine Has come on three times then gone off, Interesting. I'm going to pull codes, tomorrow after Talladega. I'm still not Quite positive what the Problem may have been but next ABS Light.

 

[Reinovator]

Pulled the new codes Finally.
539, 539, 1, 172, 173, 172 ,173
Ok the first one from SHO wiki.

539 Air conditioning on / defrost on during KOEO. Ooops should have that off.
172 HEGO sensor indicates system lean (RH).
173 HEGO sensor indicates system rich (RH).
Maybe I need an O2 sensor?
But this was an Key on Engine Off, KOEO, reading is this a accurate code for that withe the key on engine off?

 

[luigisho]

How old is the sensor? Both codes might be a failing sensor.

 

[Reinovator]

How old is the sensor? Both codes might be a failing sensor.

I have no Idea I just got the car a few of weeks ago. I have some used ones I may swap them out just of fun.

 

[rubydist]

well, one does not change the rear oxy sensor "just for fun" as its a bit of an adventure.

however, we need first to confirm that when you changed the last parts (crank sensor, etc.) that you had the battery disconnected at that time. because if not, you still have old codes in there.

if you had the battery disconnected, I would first change the rear oxy sensor, but I would also put some injector cleaner in the gas. it is possible to have the right bank be lean in certain situations and rich in others, and if that is happening it is nearly always an injector issue.

 

[Reinovator]

well, one does not change the rear oxy sensor "just for fun" as its a bit of an adventure.

however, we need first to confirm that when you changed the last parts (crank sensor, etc.) that you had the battery disconnected at that time. because if not, you still have old codes in there.

if you had the battery disconnected, I would first change the rear oxy sensor, but I would also put some injector cleaner in the gas. it is possible to have the right bank be lean in certain situations and rich in others, and if that is happening it is nearly always an injector issue.

Thank you But yes I did Have the Battery Disconnected And Oh boy You are correct It is not a "Just for fun" endeavor I would say it's more like Brain surgery Than fun. I'm at a point where Sarcasm has Taken hold a little trying to maintain 7 Vehicles. I made the choice to do this and this is how I get through it at times.

Getting to your Suggestion Injector cleaner is some thing I did Not think about. Thank you. I will give it a try. This vehicle sat for 18 months befor I picked it up I have bee trying to buy it for 3 years and he finally let go of it. I even got it for a third of what i offered him originally 2 years ago.

And on a side note I have figured out the power seat switch Reconditioning basics a stiff zip tie will help reset the copper contacts. I can do a Walk though If there isn't one.

 

[rubydist]

yes, the "it sat for 18 months" is an important piece of data for troubleshooting - it is very likely that you have at least one injector that does not like to shut off, and another (or two) that are gummed up (or maybe its the same one that acts different at different times), so that at lower rpms it runs rich and at higher rpms it runs lean. start with the injector cleaner.

 

[Reinovator]

yes, the "it sat for 18 months" is an important piece of data for troubleshooting - it is very likely that you have at least one injector that does not like to shut off, and another (or two) that are gummed up (or maybe its the same one that acts different at different times), so that at lower rpms it runs rich and at higher rpms it runs lean. start with the injector cleaner.

No doubt! Some fuel injector cleaner and (maybe some rubbing Alcohol) Or just good old Fashioned Good fuel will help too! I try to run premium at alltimes in my SHO's but it weird where we live That fuel is not a Priority in my town A llitle north 8 miles is not to far to get good fuel, but my lady has a quirk about running our cars down too Empty

 

[Reinovator]

One more thought My 93's PCM connector and ABS connectors are Black and red while my 95's are both black is there a reason for this or did they just run out of Red connectors in 95?