Opinions on most ideal camber setup...

[Ecoboost_xsport]

Hopefully I'm in the right section for this topic...

So I've had H&R lowering springs for some time but recently acquired the SPC camber adjustment bolts. Technically, after having it aligned when I installed the springs, the front was still within manufacturers spec but rear was only very slightly out. Just been dealing with it, no biggie. Anyway, fast forawrd to recently and I've swapped shocks/struts to the Bilstein B6s (ok, I'm still waiting on the front right strut to show up after 6 months of backorder, but looks like it will finally be on its way), I said, "what the heck, lets get the SPCs and really try to dial in some good camber"

I know a small amount of camber is good as you probably don't want all 4 wheels to be at exactly 0.0 vertical. My only question: If you were able to get a specific camber dialed in for your car, what would you shoot for?

Any suspension guru's feel like chiming in and elaborating?

 

[stripSHO]

I'm very, very far from a guru but I can say there's no 1 ideal setting for all applications. Suspension tuning is always going to be a game of compromise between traction, handling and tire wear. Want maximum traction at the dragstrip? You probably want 0 camber on all four as the car sits under WOT acceleration. But don't expect any cornering or tire life on the road. For anything else, it's a trial and error process to find what produces the best results for your car with your mods on whatever road or course you're driving on that day.

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

I'm very, very far from a guru but I can say there's no 1 ideal setting for all applications. Suspension tuning is always going to be a game of compromise between traction, handling and tire wear. Want maximum traction at the dragstrip? You probably want 0 camber on all four as the car sits under WOT acceleration. But don't expect any cornering or tire life on the road. For anything else, it's a trial and error process to find what produces the best results for your car with your mods on whatever road or course you're driving on that day.

Kinda where I sit at on the subject as well...

 

[RonPorter]

If you like handling, - 2 is good. With strut welds drilled out on a few SHOs I had, that's all we could get, and it worked fine for track days and had no weird wear. When I moved on to a Legacy GT with coilovers, I stayed at - 2 on street tires.

If I ever decided to run track rubber, I would go up to -3,and just keep that on the street, although I'm sure it would produce more uneven tire wear.

 

[jman1200]

As a reference, what do you get with the H&R without the camber adjustment bolts?

 

[Kevin81]

As mentioned above, -2. However, I have more questions. What do you plan to do with the car? 90% daily driving? Road conditions?

These are very heavy cars, so the see greater benefit from having negative camber, however, if you're not throwing it into turns on fairly smooth roads on the regular, going for a more aggressive set up is pointless, unless you want it for visual style. Also, the stiffer the spring rate, the less camber you need. I'm new to the SHO, so I don't know much about the particular springs from h and r. How do they ride? If you put both hands on the hood over your head light and put your weight on it, does it yield? If so, they're softer, and would benefit from increased neg camber. If not, its firm, and is keep it at -2.

 

[Kevin81]

For perspective...

On my other car, I adjust the camber via a 1/4 turn of the struts from VBP. The roads in CT suck, the car is light, and the suspension is firm. BUT. Car has a tendency to over steer. On the street, with the "cheap" tires, I kept it at -2 front, 0 rear, approximately. On the track, same tires, I adjust to -1 front, -3 rear. Why? To help balance the handling. More prone to understeer in front, keeping the rear planted for high exit speed on the turn. With the kumho extas I used to run, I found that -2 front and rear yielded very predictable results.

On the SHO, for handling purposes, I'd almost think a little more neg camber in the front than rear would be beneficial...due to the weight sitting over the front tires.

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

Well, my intent on this topic was to spark some conversation on what works for various scenarios and what you guys are running if it's something you are conscious about. But for me specifically, I'm looking for the 90% daily driver and occasional track visit. Keep in mind, I don't have the SHO, but the XSport.

One of the reasons why I initially brought this up was, after my last alignment, the car likes to...wander. When I goose it on a straight line (i.e., stop light challenges...allegedly, lol) it kinda of feels like I'm fighting it to stay straight. I realize a lot of that could be the road conditions, tire temps, etc...but it never feels like it wants to stay solidly straight. It doesn't pull to any side particularly, just feels a bit like its tracking erratically.

The H&R and Bilstein combo is really solid, I love the ride quality, very firm and responsive, but not bouncy.

Anyway, here's a pic of my last alignment. What do you guys think, way off or within reason? When I get the SPC bolts installed, I'm wondering where I should ask them put the camber at...

 

[Kevin81]

Well, my intent on this topic was to spark some conversation on what works for various scenarios and what you guys are running if it's something you are conscious about. But for me specifically, I'm looking for the 90% daily driver and occasional track visit. Keep in mind, I don't have the SHO, but the XSport.

One of the reasons why I initially brought this up was, after my last alignment, the car likes to...wander. When I goose it on a straight line (i.e., stop light challenges...allegedly, lol) it kinda of feels like I'm fighting it to stay straight. I realize a lot of that could be the road conditions, tire temps, etc...but it never feels like it wants to stay solidly straight.

The H&R and Bilstein combo is really solid, I love the ride quality, very firm and responsive, but not bouncy.

Anyway, here's a pic of my last alignment. What do you guys think, way off or within reason? When I get the SPC bolts installed, I'm wondering where I should ask them put the camber at...

You are in uncharted waters. So, my advice? Copy someone else. There are 2 fast SUVs out there, the hemi jeep thing, and the Porsche. Match the relative weight and tire size, and then extrapolate. They are both Nurbergring tested, real world handling. If you have similar weight, similar tire width, the similar camber should result in similar handling. Roughly. Kinda.

 

[stripSHO]

Well, my intent on this topic was to spark some conversation on what works for various scenarios and what you guys are running if it's something you are conscious about. But for me specifically, I'm looking for the 90% daily driver and occasional track visit. Keep in mind, I don't have the SHO, but the XSport.

One of the reasons why I initially brought this up was, after my last alignment, the car likes to...wander. When I goose it on a straight line (i.e., stop light challenges...allegedly, lol) it kinda of feels like I'm fighting it to stay straight. I realize a lot of that could be the road conditions, tire temps, etc...but it never feels like it wants to stay solidly straight. It doesn't pull to any side particularly, just feels a bit like its tracking erratically.

The H&R and Bilstein combo is really solid, I love the ride quality, very firm and responsive, but not bouncy.

Anyway, here's a pic of my last alignment. What do you guys think, way off or within reason? When I get the SPC bolts installed, I'm wondering where I should ask them put the camber at...

Sounds to me like you need more toe

 

[Kevin81]

Does it hold straight under normal accelleration?

Under hard acceleration, a car doesn't track straight for 1 reason...uneven distribution of power to the pavement. One or more wheels is losing traction, but the reasons for that aren't just limited to alignment. Chasis flex, for one. Is you're AWD system the same as ours...FWD till it loses traction?

When it pulls under hard acceleration, does it consistently pull to one side, or does it vary?

 

[SM105K]

The perfect setup...

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

The perfect setup...

View attachment 13953

Sweet setup! I can't wait to NOT do that, lol

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

The perfect setup...

View attachment 13953

Whoa there Hoss, save some camber for the rest of us!

 

[SM105K]

Whoa there Hoss, save some camber for the rest of us!

HAHAHA, I actually see crap like that on the streets....scary.

 

[jman1200]

As mentioned above, -2. However, I have more questions. What do you plan to do with the car? 90% daily driving? Road conditions?

These are very heavy cars, so the see greater benefit from having negative camber, however, if you're not throwing it into turns on fairly smooth roads on the regular, going for a more aggressive set up is pointless, unless you want it for visual style. Also, the stiffer the spring rate, the less camber you need. I'm new to the SHO, so I don't know much about the particular springs from h and r. How do they ride? If you put both hands on the hood over your head light and put your weight on it, does it yield? If so, they're softer, and would benefit from increased neg camber. If not, its firm, and is keep it at -2.

I do not have the camber adj bolts, daily drive my SHO and do get the inner side of the rear tires worn much faster.
Mine also pulls to either side on WOT depending on road conditions.

 

[Kevin81]

I do not have the camber adj bolts, daily drive my SHO and do get the inner side of the rear tires worn much faster.
Mine also pulls to either side on WOT depending on road conditions.

Has it been lowered? Often times lowering a car affects camber angle, simply due to reduced suspension travel.

As to pulling, I would assume that comes about due to the car not being a fulltime awd car. FWD cars always pull to the side the trans is on under hard acceleration. Could be a minute amount of torque steer on launch. Mine doesn't do that, though. Pulls straight.

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

Yes, it's been lowered. That alignment specs sheet is from my latest alignment job.

As for torque steer, yeah I had that bad on my old Evo and it would jump when I floored it ff the line and you'd have to be ready for it, but would stay steady when under way. This is more of a "wandering" feeling back and forth to either side while under full acceleration.

 

[Kevin81]

Yes, it's been lowered. That alignment specs sheet is from my latest alignment job.

As for torque steer, yeah I had that bad on my old Evo and it would jump when I floored it ff the line and you'd have to be ready for it, but would stay steady when under way. This is more of a "wandering" feeling back and forth to either side while under full acceleration.

Well...as mentioned, you can do a tiny bit of toe in on the front tires to stabilize, but that typically only helps at higher speeds, 80+ mph or so. What your describing almost sounds like the front tires aren't planted, possibly your car is squatting...hard.

How much power do you make?

 

[Ecoboost_xsport]

Well...as mentioned, you can do a tiny bit of toe in on the front tires to stabilize, but that typically only helps at higher speeds, 80+ mph or so. What your describing almost sounds like the front tires aren't planted, possibly your car is squatting...hard.

How much power do you make?

Haven't had it dyno'd lately, but likely hovering around 500whp...