What's wrong with Penzoil?

[Bizzy]

I haven't taken my valve covers off yet, but will be doing so on Thursday to do my 60k valve lash. I got my 94 with 67k miles on it and a steady diet of dealer provided Quaker State. Before I cleaned out the engine with Auto-RX I could see a definate brownish tint with a flashlight in the oil fill hole. Thise was a brown tint to the metal. After the auto-rx it was as clean as sdpatt's looks in the pictures if not cleaner. I'm running AMSoil synthetic now, and I'm at 4500 of 12000 before I change it completely. Oil is fairly clean, and down the filler hole is still as clean as it was 4500 miles ago. And the AMSoil bypass filter goes on next week, so my oil will be clear again, just have to figure out where I want to mount the filter block.

 

[fricker66]

Just wanted to offer my experience to this discussion. My dad is a faithful Pennzoil user but is also very faithful 2,500 mile oil changes. That said, I've seen my parents take several separate vehicles well past the 200k mark without a single internal engine problem. Here's a pic from this past fall when Steve and I opened up my 89 that had been maintained on a diet of Pennzoil up to 76k. (Pic was at 88k)

I highly doubt that my switch to Castrol 'cleaned up' the internals in this short amount of time. The only observation I have made is that timely oil changes are needed regardless of the brand used.

<small>[ February 19, 2003, 08:49 AM: Message edited by: fricker66 ]</small>

 

[Slo-Sho]

Castrol GTX for me...I choose to stick with a proven winner. It's fairly inexpensive too.

 

[LaTechSHO]

well...i've been using motorcraft 10-30 since i've had my SHO.... cheaper than castrol OR penzoil, and haven't had any problems....


Louis

 

[ILLSHOU]

Isnt motorcraft the original oil in the SHO from the factory?

 

[sdpatt]

Yep. Motorcraft is a quality oil made for Ford. It's up in the Valvoline/Castrol quality zone, but I've found it to be more expensive than Castrol and certainly more expensive than the cheap cost and cheap quality Pennzoil.

 

[billh]

Back in the old days when I was Drag Racing, I got to look at a confidential report written by a major auto manufacturer about oil. What this report said was the oil that could stand the most abuse, retain it's load carrying capacity for the longest time under the highest temperature was Castrol, closely followed by Valvoline. The oil that had the lowest internal friction, thus giving the best horsepower ratings was Texaco Havoline. The lowest overall quality oil as far as thermal break down and additives giving up the ghost in the shortest time was Pennzoil. Everything else fell somewhere in between. This report stated that all of the oils met the standards that they were rated at. Castrol did a far superior job. This report was written a long time ago and I always took it with a grain of salt, until;

Recently, I replaced the valve cover gaskets on a Chevrolet van with a 305. This van was purchased new by my father-in-law and has had oil changes every 2500 miles using Pennzoil. He is absolutely ****-retentive about oil changes, none of his vehicles go over 90 days or 2500 miles between oil changes. That old van now has 125,000 on the clock. I pulled the valve covers and had him take a look at it. He will not be using Pennzoil any more. The inside of that engine was very dirty and didn't look anything like is should have with frequent oil changes. The beat goes on.

 

['92SHO]

For what it's worth, I've heard the Penzoil rumors before and I choose not to run it. I run basic Mobil, not Mobil 1. Anyways, I just bought my 2nd Toyota pickup with 116k (now 135k) on the odometer from a guy who only used Penzoil, and I will say that that my oil (Mobil) has been the cleanest oil to come out of an engine after 3000 miles that I have ever seen. Wether or not it was due to the Penzoil run first I don't know, but my engine does not get oil very dirty. My SHO get the Mobil too. I can't really speak bad about the Penzoil.

 

[rendyx]

'92SHO:
For what it's worth, I've heard the Penzoil rumors before and I choose not to run it. I run basic Mobil, not Mobil 1. Anyways, I just bought my 2nd Toyota pickup with 116k (now 135k) on the odometer from a guy who only used Penzoil, and I will say that that my oil (Mobil) has been the cleanest oil to come out of an engine after 3000 miles that I have ever seen. Wether or not it was due to the Penzoil run first I don't know, but my engine does not get oil very dirty. My SHO get the Mobil too. I can't really speak bad about the Penzoil.

I used to run ordinary Mobil, until I heard all the great news about Castrol. I switched to Castrol, and now I only have to add about 1 qt. of oil every oil change (as opposed to about 3 with Mobil), I assume it does a great job cleaning the engine up inside, and will prolong it's life. I always believed that the wear on an engine should come from doing what it was made to do (high performance driving, many miles, etc.) not from wasteful behaviors (lugging, bad oil, etc.). Putting in good oil helps keep this true for me.

 

[LaTechSHO]

interesting to hear you say that motorcraft is more expensive scott.... at my store (o'reilly) motorcraft oil is about $0.25 cheaper a quart than castrol.....

anyway my car seems to like the motorcraft stuff...and as i have stated before... almost everything you buy with a ford name on it WAS NOT MADE BY FORD..... so i'm sure i am buying valvoline...or castrol... or something like that in a motorcraft bottle...

I had considered using fords "new" oil in my car
5-20 synthetic blend... supposedly ford will void warranties or something if it is not used in thier newer vehicles... but for now i'll stick with the motorcraft 10-30


Louis

 

[ILLSHOU]

Originally posted by billh:
[QB] The oil that had the lowest internal friction, thus giving the best horsepower ratings was Texaco Havoline.


Wouldnt that mean that texaco havoline would actually be a better oil than even castrol? Wouldnt that be the most important thing, having the least amount of friction in the engine?

 

[sdpatt]

Friction reduction is only one aspect of an oil's function. There are many more. A few of them being film strength, anti-oxidation, anti-foaming, low ash, etc....

 

[ILLSHOU]

ok, i got ya...so castrol gtx, seems to be the choice of everyone due to its all around quality...
Alot of people use 5w30 in the winter, and 10w30 in the summer, because the thinner oil is a little better on cold starts, but in the summer thicker oil is better for the high temperatures...Synthetic, such as maybe 5w30 Castrol Syntec is said to be good for the winters cold, and also not break down as easily under stress, such as high temperatures in the summer...They are also said to be cleaner.Why do most people recommend staying away from synthetic oils?...What harm do they cause? I am looking for a oil weight good to use all year round, for all temperatures and conditions, that holds up to hard driving no matter what the temp.

 

[sdpatt]

Now you did it. You may want to search on the several "discussions" regarding the properties and acceptability of the use of synthetic oil in the SHO. I have seen and heard, firsthand, quite unexpected results from both Mobil 1 and Castrol Syntech - worn cam lobes and metallic sounds at startup. Others have seen great service. The picture earlier in this topic of a 60,000 mile SHO with significant cam lobe wear from the use of Mobil 1 was a very shocking display. Synthetics should be superior to petrolium based oils, but the SHO engine may not always benefit from their properties.

 

[shojuan]

'92SHO:
For what it's worth, I've heard the Penzoil rumors before and I choose not to run it. I run basic Mobil, not Mobil 1. Anyways, I just bought my 2nd Toyota pickup with 116k (now 135k) on the odometer from a guy who only used Penzoil, and I will say that that my oil (Mobil) has been the cleanest oil to come out of an engine after 3000 miles that I have ever seen. Wether or not it was due to the Penzoil run first I don't know, but my engine does not get oil very dirty. My SHO get the Mobil too. I can't really speak bad about the Penzoil.

I too used Mobil 0 oil in the SHO for a long time (between 105,000 miles and 146,000 miles) because it was dirst cheap at walmart and I figured it was probably a decent oil. I guess the little consumer reports eek! writeups saying all motor oil were the same got to me (after swearing by Castrol GTX in my youth in the 80's). During those 40,000 miles money was extremely tight where even a cheap oil change could have been the straw that broke the Camel's back. In all honesty I didn't give a crap about the SHO at that point as long as it could provide basic transportation. It had a failing CPS and other problems but it could get my wife 40 miles to work and 40 miles back every day without acting up. There were three oil changes during that period where the SHO went 11,000 miles on one change of oil. That's 33,000 miles of serious oil abuse on cheap dino oil. When I did the 60K at 148,000 miles the engine was very clean but had some corrosion pitting on a few cam lobes. Actually there is some varnish in the spots that must not get hit with much oil. I suspect the Mobil 0 was cleaning things up over a period of time. But who know? Same with the pitting. I can speculate, but I will never know exactly when or why the pitting occured on the cam lobes. It could be a manufacturing defect for all I know. Anyways there are some pictures here: http://www.shoforum.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=17;t=003385#000000
Two things I can say for certaintly: It was very, very naughty to go 11,000 miles between oil changes on dino juice. The SHO engine is still running strong however in spite of that abuse. Secondly, the cheap ($.88 a quart when Castrol GTX is $1.88 a quart) Mobil 0 Drive Clean oil did a good job of cleaning up the engine, or at least keeping it clean in spite of really crappy oil change intervals.

However, like I said before, I'd rather have some varnish with no wear than spotless with wear.

<small>[ February 19, 2003, 04:14 PM: Message edited by: shojuan ]</small>

 

['92SHO]

shojuan:

Secondly, the cheap ($.88 a quart when Castrol GTX is $1.88 a quart) Mobil 0 Drive Clean oil did a good job of cleaning up the engine, or at least keeping it clean in spite of really crappy oil change intervals.

However, like I said before, I'd rather have some varnish with no wear than spotless with wear.

So are you pro or con for Mobil? What oil do you put in your vehicles now?

 

[MilTownSHO]

sdpatt:
Yep. Motorcraft is a quality oil made for Ford. It's up in the Valvoline/Castrol quality zone, but I've found it to be more expensive than Castrol and certainly more expensive than the cheap cost and cheap quality Pennzoil.

I currently use Motorcraft oil in all of our cars because I get it free from Ford! When I don't work there anymore I will be switching to Castrol for sure (at least for the SHO anyhow)

 

[shojuan]

'92SHO:

shojuan:

Secondly, the cheap ($.88 a quart when Castrol GTX is $1.88 a quart) Mobil 0 Drive Clean oil did a good job of cleaning up the engine, or at least keeping it clean in spite of really crappy oil change intervals.

However, like I said before, I'd rather have some varnish with no wear than spotless with wear.

So are you pro or con for Mobil? What oil do you put in your vehicles now?

Well it kept things clean. If I could only afford $.88 a quart oil now (but could afford regular 3000 miles changes) then I'd probably use it again. Right now I'm using Redline 10W/30 with a Mobil 1 MI-301 filter. If I went back to dyno oil I'd use Castrol GTX. When I replace the rod and main bearings in my truck I'll switch back to dino juice (because it burns so much oil!). I'm thinking of trying Mobil Delvac 1300 in that (about $1.50 a quart at walmart).

So, I'm sort of neutral on the Mobil 0 oil. When I opened up the valve covers things weren't perfect in my SHO. It was clean. But there was corrosion pitting. With regular 3000 mile oil changes the situation could have only been better. The car was never driven really ******* that oil though. Just easy long highway miles and never opening up the secondaries.

 

[Tommy's SHO]

FWIW, here are some Motorcraft oil facts.
Motorcraft Oil Lubricants

 

[billh]

ILLSHOU:

Originally posted by billh:
[QB] The oil that had the lowest internal friction, thus giving the best horsepower ratings was Texaco Havoline.


Wouldnt that mean that texaco havoline would actually be a better oil than even castrol? Wouldnt that be the most important thing, having the least amount of friction in the engine?

In addition to what Scott said, Havoline had the highest detergent content. Maximum power usually comes at price. We did a lot of work LOWERING oil pressure on our drag car. Our goal was 30 to 40 lbs at 8000 RPM. This usually meant that the engine had around 10 lbs at an idle. Scary. We used to run three or gour quarts total in an eight quart pan, (not counting the three quarts in the Accusump held) None of this has anything to do with our SHO's, but like I said, Maximum power usually comes at a price.