URGENT!: GEN 2 Sub-Frame Compatibility. . .

[Mr95Gl]

Will a GEN 2 SLO Subframe, work on a GEN 2 SHO? Today coming into my parking lot, there's a slight L shape turn (turning left into the bottom of the L), I applied some throttle and as went to turn right the tires began to slip, and the car pretty much jumped the damn curb. The whole rim literally caved in. I immediately stopped the car, and noticed that there was oil leaking on the floor from around the subframe bushing. When I got it to the shop, and put it on the lift, you could see where the lower control arm meets the subframe had bent in. I purchased a 92 SLO subframe from a local yard, but i'm not to sure if it will work on the SHO. Any insight as to where the oil could of been coming from? It was engine oil. Also, when I shift it from park to gear the engine pretty much jerks. . . . . never done that prior. This is just about the worst thing that could of happened at the most unfortunate time, but I'll go bankrupt before I let that car sit and rot. So far I'm $400 into this mess (pretty much what I paid for it), $300 labor, and $100 for the subframe. I definately need new endlinks, lower control arms, and possibly the inner and outer tie rods. My axles have less then 2,000 miles and I hope I can salvage them.

Talk about one of the worst days of my life. . .

Frantzdy

 

[SuperHO]

That don't sound too good......check your clearance between your subframe and oilpan....then check and see if the oilpan itself is cracked....if you went up on the curb that hard, it's possible. As far as I know, the SLO and SHO subframe are NOT compatible with each other...but I've been wrong before.

 

[SolidState]

All Gen 2 ATX subframes are the same. The only different subframe is the MTX, and is interchangable from 89-95.

 

[Mr95Gl]

All Gen 2 ATX subframes are the same. The only different subframe is the MTX, and is interchangable from 89-95.

That's very relieving.

That don't sound too good......check your clearance between your subframe and oilpan....then check and see if the oilpan itself is cracked....if you went up on the curb that hard, it's possible.

I checked the oil pan, and it "seemed" fine. The oil began dripping as I jack the car up from the front. Then it stopped dripping, and hasn't dripped a drop since. I also had a slight antifreeze leak as well. I don't think I went that far onto the curb to reach where the oil pan was, because it almost immediately after hitting the curb drop down onto the pavement. I just hope all goes well, with a minimal blow to my pockets tomorrow. I'll find out just how bad it really is once we get the subframe off. Thanks for your responses! Much appreciated.

Frantzdy

 

[Mr95Gl]

Just thought I'd drop in and give an update. The subframe came in yesterday after 6 hours of waiting, and the measurements came out to be perfect. So it seems, we'll have to drop the y-pipe in order to remove the subframe. . . . I snapped a couple of pics with my camera phone but none of the actual subframe. I'll take some of that when I get there shortly.



You can see from this angle where the bottom of the tire is inward.









Not the best pics, but just an idea.

Frantzdy

 

[Racer X]

Where is the other end of that chain tied to? I hope not the intake, because it won't hold the weight of the engine and transmission.

And also, you don't really have to drop the Y-pipe; you can snake the subframe up and over. It's not the easiest thing in the world to do, but thats what I've done in the past.

Where are you getting the work done?

 

[Shoaz]

Where is the other end of that chain tied to? I hope not the intake, because it won't hold the weight of the engine and transmission.

That's a piece of seat belt tied through two runners and around the fork on the lift.

I don't recommend this at all, but in this case it held up the entire subframe and drivetrain assembly.

I'd definitely not use the tanks to hold anything up, if that's what you meant.

 

[Mr95Gl]

Old SubFrame . . . . . . .



Trans mount. . . . .



Another view. . . . .

Where is the other end of that chain tied to? I hope not the intake, because it won't hold the weight of the engine and transmission.

And also, you don't really have to drop the Y-pipe; you can snake the subframe up and over. It's not the easiest thing in the world to do, but thats what I've done in the past.

Where are you getting the work done?

Honestly, I'm not exactly sure we he had the other end tied to. The work was done at a local shop down here in Brooklyn, Hamal. He had the old subframe out, and swapped in the new one in less then 1 hour and a half. It turns out the oil that I saw leaking from the subframe was infact coming from the tranmission mount which was damaged. The biggest pain of the job was inserting the strut rod into the lower control arm, and having the LCA line up properly into the spindle. Took us 30 mins to realize that I needed a new spindle and strut. So to recap. . . . .
LCA - $45
2 endlinks - $44
SubFrame - $100
Tranny mount - $35
Spindle - $50
KYB Strut- $50
O2 sensor - $43
Labor - $300
Alignment - $65
4 GEN 3 Chromies - $303.24

Yep, marvelous way to spend over $1,000 in two days. Lastly, are the GEN 2 SLO, and SHO front swaybars the same? What I've noticed different about the car is the steering is very hard. VERY hard. Thanks for all the answers through out this ordeal, it's feels good to be on the road again.

Frantzdy

 

[SolidState]

They are interchangable, but not likely the same diameter. I can't really see the sway bar causing front steering stiffness.

Perhaps you damaged a tie rod or even the steering rack?

 

[Mr95Gl]

Perhaps your right. Would a damaged tie rod prevent an alignment from being within spec? Also, what other indications should I look for in a damaged steering rack? Again, thanks for the response!

Frantzdy

 

[SolidState]

well, that fluid you found could be from your power steering rack. Alot of SHOs use ATF as PS fluid. And a damaged tie rod could indeed cause alignment issues.

 

[SuperHO]

Your allignment could also be off due to removal of the subframe....even using proper subframe allignment guidlines, you'll still have to have it straightened out.


but yeah, a bad rack will definitly cause stiff steering....

 

[Mr95Gl]

well, that fluid you found could be from your power steering rack. Alot of SHOs use ATF as PS fluid. And a damaged tie rod could indeed cause alignment issues.

Actually the fluid I saw leaking was dirt black, which I assumed was motor oil which turned out to be some type of liquid oil that they put in the transmission mount.

Your allignment could also be off due to removal of the subframe....even using proper subframe allignment guidlines, you'll still have to have it straightened out.


but yeah, a bad rack will definitly cause stiff steering....

Wait, I'll have to have the subframe straightened out? I'm not using same one that took the hit, or it doesn't make a difference? Also i've made two some what important oberservations yesterday. . . . . . .

1. On a flat surface, the car drives straight. On a surface leaning toward the passenger side, the car pulls to that side and the same goes for the driver side. . . . . . .

2. In all the excitement of getting the car back, I didn't realize that two different types of endlinks were used for the sway bar. Passenger side plastic, driver side metal. Could that be a cause of what I mentioned above? The steering seems to be stiff when the car starts pulling to one side, meaning having to hold it at a position where it doesn't pull.

Frantzdy

 

[SolidState]

no, this is starting to sound more and more like an alignment issue.

I would definately get matching sway bar links on there, doesn't matter if thay are composite or aluminum, just make sure they are the same.

Lastly, you'd be surprised at how dark PS fluid could be, especially if it has been in there a while. Not saying that it IS definately PS fluid, but still check the fluid levels of the PS system.

 

[Mr95Gl]

no, this is starting to sound more and more like an alignment issue.

I would definately get matching sway bar links on there, doesn't matter if thay are composite or aluminum, just make sure they are the same.

Lastly, you'd be surprised at how dark PS fluid could be, especially if it has been in there a while. Not saying that it IS definately PS fluid, but still check the fluid levels of the PS system.

Ok, sounds good to me. I'll pick up another set of sway bar links, and throw them on. And while I'm down there I'll check the PS fluid level. Thanks for the help!

 

[Racer X]

Frantzdy, on the pulling issue on off camber roadways, mine does the same thing. Even my old 93 Police Package did it. On the SHO, I have new LCA's L/R, new tie rod ends L/R, new inner tie rod R, and new struts, springs, and mounts all around, AlSFB's with no play, and it still will pull if the road leans left or right.

The only thing is does need right now is new swaybar bushings, but other than that the car is tight.

 

[Mr95Gl]

Guess I'm 7 hours to late. . . . I picked up a set of sway bar endlinks. Guess I'll hold on to them, or maybe even have you drive the car one of these days and you tell me what's what. Sooooooooo, who wants to help me identify the culprit that's causing a grinding / rotational type noise. . . .

Frantzdy

 

[Racer X]

Won't be home until late tonight... how's tomorrow night after 7pm?

 

[Mr95Gl]

Just might be able to make that. Give me a call. . . . . you've got a PM.

 

[93SHwagon]

Will an 89 subframe bolt up to a 93 slo?
The 89 will have the engine and tranny on it,I just wanted to know if the 4 main bolts that hold the subframe to the body will be the same.