Tires

[TitoElSpicco]

Did a search and nothing came up, even though i'm sure this has been dicussed on here a million times over.

What's the widest tire that will fit on my car with the stock rims? I would like a 235-50 or maybe even a 245-50 even though that's probably not possible.

Any recommendations on tires? Preferably around or less than $100 ea. Wet/Snow traction doesn't matter, and I absolutely HATE those Kumho Ecsta Supra's. Pieces of crap.

Thanks!
Mike

Edit - It's a '99 if that matters, since it doesn't have the ride control and different rims.

<small>[ November 08, 2003, 10:24 AM: Message edited by: TitoElSpicco ]</small>

 

[99V8SHO]

I don't think that you can go wider than 235 without having rubbing probelms. 235 probably would not be a good idea on the stock rims anyways, because the tire will stick out farther than the rim and give you mushy handling, in which case you cannot take onramps as fast as you are used to. wink

 

[SHODWN]

If you really think the tires are crap, Maybe you save your money for driving lessons.

 

[OzzmanNT]

BURN!

 

[stephen newberg]

Yes, here we go again.

I agree that the Kumho 712s are poor tires. At least in the handling department if you drive the car ******* back roads that are not smooth, and praticularly if you drive in other than warm weather. They are, however, cheap, and certainly OK if you are not pushing them for high speed handling characteristics on poor roads.

Kirk, for some reason, seems to like them a lot and tends to get defensive when people note they are less than perfect.

Per the rest of your question, it depends on the tire and the suggestions of the manufacturer for the particular model. I have run 245s on the stock rims and not rubbed, but it was at the outside limit of the wheel width for that particfular model that the manufacturer indicated as useable, and a wider rim would have been better. But no, not all 245s will rub, and yes, some 245s can be used on the stock rims.

pax, smn

 

[SHOZ123]

I have the Kumhos 712s on 7.5" x 16 rims in the 245 size. Great tire, best rain tire I have ever had but mine were near impossible to balance. For this reason I will not buy them again.

 

[stephen newberg]

We did not have any rain while I had mine on, Paul, but I had a very bad time with them following road cracks, which we have a lot of here. Reminded me of the old Michelin X stops in that regard. I could have lived with that, but a worse problem was their response until warmed up on a cool morning. You would feel the squirm of the sidewall and the tread trying to moving in different directions during any transitioning situation. It could be outright scary at times. As a result, I took mine off before they were through half of the tread depth. I now use them to hold racing dinghies off the concrete floor of the boat shed during winter storage. They do that just fine. wink

pax, smn

<small>[ November 09, 2003, 07:36 PM: Message edited by: stephen newberg ]</small>

 

[SHOZ123]

The 45 ratio sidewalls were very stiff on mine and with 40+ lbs of air in them very little squirm.

 

[stephen newberg]

Yes, mine were the 245x45x17s, and I eventually went to that solution too, which took a lot of it out, but not if the morning was chilled. I think I was running 44 psi in the front and 40 in the rear to reduce the squirm. Certainly not ideal. And they still wanted to follow the road cracks. But they came free with the wheels, and in tires, you almost always get pretty much what you pay for.

pax, smn

 

[SHODWN]

Steve, Just so you know a GOOD performance directional tire will follow grooves in the road..Most do... They are a sticky tire, and they have GREAT traction. They were so go that they kept me at just a bit over a second slower than the S/c cars at Blackhawk Because you dont like an aggressive tire, doesnt meant that they are not good. An I could assure you that if you could get over small things like tracking of a tire you would have loved them.

Maybe more of your focus should be with your local highway dept for the conditions of your roads. And its not being defensive of the tire, but when unexpirenced people bash something like tires it gets under my skin.

And I know its not the best tire out there, but its as good as the Firehawk, which is one of the best. And I also know that from expirence..

When I buy tires I look for lots of things
Size availabilty
Weight
revs per mile
Sec width
contact patch
What compound the tire is made from
Thread pattern
Rain capabilitys (sp)

Then the last one PRICE

After being at several events and placeing all the miles that I do on my car. The Kumho 712 pound for Pound is the best all around tire on the market.

Sure I am looking at a differnt set for this coming year, something new but Im waiting for all the things to be listed from certain people before I think about going to a new brand. I could always go to the Firehawk again at 3 times the price for the SAME performance.

 

[stephen newberg]

Kirk, no offense, but I suspect I have been driving good performance tires for longer than you have been alive, and, IMO, the Kumho 712s are pretty close to the worst 'performance' tires I have ever owned..

I am very aware of how directional tires are supposed to react, having owned many of them, and I most certainly wish that the Nova Scotia government would pay more attention to road upkeep, but neither of those influence the basic point. I am not an 'unexpirenced people' and I too think the tire stinks. Paul thought they were great in the rain, but could not keep them balanced and hence would not buy them again, a third view.

The object of discussion boards is discussion. This is all good, and should be encouraged, since different opinions are, in fact, what people normally want to hear. But it does not help to rudely suggest that if someone does not agree with you, they need to learn how to drive. That will not encourage discussion. Perhaps, they simply see things differently. Not everyone is going to agree with you, and if that 'gets under your skin', well, perhaps while I am working on the Nova Scotia Transport Department about their upkeep ills, you can work on growing a thicker skin.

pax, smn

 

[SHODWN]

You think that was Rude? Oh boy you dont read much do you.. What I offered was My opinion and thoughts. And I still think you have no real knowledge of performance tires and have bad roads. Ask the Queen for more money. Or come with us for some track time. Ill give you ride that you wont forget and it will be on Kumhos..

Paul also balances his own tires, so throwing that in the mix does nothing..

Next?

 

[stephen newberg]

Yes Kirk, it was rude. As you are being now. And I read all the time and probably have fogotten more about tires and road handling than you have ever known.

No, you did not offer an opion, Paul did that, as did I. You just told the person they did not know what they were talking about and then suggested they learn to drive.

I suggest you learn to be polite. I know it will be hard for you, but it would be good for your soul.

pax, smn

 

[SHODWN]

Na not really. I offered my Opinion you dont like it? Stuff it Newberg.. Im glad you forgot half of what I know and been driving twice as long. That tells me that your over 60 and SLOW.. It would be like taking tire lessons from my dad, talking about his Polyglass radials on the Z28.

Pointless.. Like your comments.. this person wants to know about good tires, I did that.. ALso he wanted to know about the widest tire, you told him that you ran 245's on your wheels. He has STOCK 16.5 inch wheels a 245 is too wide for that wheel, so in other words I may be giving my opinion on the tires and touching on the fact that I dont like you. But you go and give bad and UNSAFE advice to a person that you dont know.. WHos worse?

 

[K-Dawg]

Kirk, what other tires have you compared the Kumho 712s to? You are among the very few that I have heard recommend the 712s.

 

[stephen newberg]

Kirk, if you had read my post, you would have noted that I said the manufacturer of the tire said that 245 on 6.5 was the lowest width wheel they suggested for that tire, and I also indicated it was not the best choice. I doubt the manufacturer suggested something unsafe. But I do think it was at the limit, which was also what they indicated.

You have a serious problem Kirk. When people do not agree with you, you get mad and rude. You need to work on it.

pax, smn

<small>[ November 10, 2003, 09:15 PM: Message edited by: stephen newberg ]</small>

 

[TitoElSpicco]

one of my friends has kumho 712s on his honda s2k. he hates them. they're unpredictable, you never know what they're gonna do.

best friend had 712's on his '95 SHO. same thing, he's scared to drive ******* them because he never knows that they're going to do.

i had them on my ****** GT before my SHO and i felt extremely unsafe taking any turns at any decent rate of speed because i could never tell if they were gonna hook and turn or slide out from under me.

as far as straight line traction, the crappy sears-brand tires that came on the ****** hooked better.

i've experienced these tires on quite a few cars, and well have quite a few other drivers, and you are the only person i have ever met that recommends them.

don't get me wrong, i'm sure for some people they're a nice tire, but i don't believe the half-dozen people i know that have owned the tires all need driving lessons when they all love their dunlops/yokohamas.

 

[SHOZ123]

With the 245/45/16s on 7.5 " rims I was not able to break them loose. Seems that either the tires were undersized or the drivers were inexperienced.

Now if I wanted to break them loose all I have to do is hit the brake at the wrong time.

 

[Glue Maker]

I have 245/50s on stock rims. Everything works just fine, but they are only on for drag racing... They fit just fine in the front wells, but I dont think they would fit in the rears frown

 

[stephen newberg]

"With the 245/45/16s on 7.5 " rims I was not able to break them loose. Seems that either the tires were undersized or the drivers were inexperienced."

Paul, mine broke occasionally when pushed, but the roads here really are very rough, and that will have been the major contributing factor. I thought the Kumho 712s to be otherwise pretty sticky. If they had not been, the squirm problem would have actually been reduced, with the greater inclination of the tread to try to conform to the inertial motion changes of the sidewall.

But I continue to think it is an error to assume that because other drivers got different results than you did, they are inexperienced. Professional race car drivers end up using different tires for various reasons, and will comment on problems they had with a tire that one of their compatriots is happily using. Differences in the cars, the setup, the surfaces, ambient conditions, and driving techniques all add into tire preferences. Though inexperience certainly can be a factor, it would not be the first one I would ever assume, just because someone's view on a particular tire did not match my own. Different experience, certainly, but not just inexperience.

pax, smn