QS Syncromesh Fluid

[SHOpar]

I am having problems with extremely notchy shifting in my '95 MTX, and after searching through the forums, it sounds like I may have an internal problem with my blocking rings or syncros.

I have been running Mobil 1 ATF for over two years now, but the trans has never shifted as smoothly as other SHO's I've driven. Lately it has gotten worse, and oftentimes only goes into gear half way, requiring additional effort to get it fully engaged. Sometimes 1st is impossible to get into at a stop.

What's odd is that I never have problems with the trans grinding while shifting unless I only partially engage the gear. When very cold, 2nd grinds slightly, but always has - same on every other car I've owned.

So basically it sounds like a lot of people have similar shifting problems that have been solved by this GM syncromesh fluid. I notice some people have used the Quaker State/Pennzoil alternative, but I was wondering if this is the same stuff as the GM fluid. Here's a link about the QS version.

I notice QS says their fluid is paraffinic-based, and that's the whole reason I'll NEVER use QS or Pennzoil products in my engine. If it truely is the same stuff as the GM fluid, I'll use it, since it's readily available and MUCH cheaper.

Thanks for any input!

 

[Dr.Evil]

It might be your clutch. Mine was doing exactly what you are describing, and I needed a clutch. When I had it done, I had them put in Redling fluid and it was way better. But them all of the reline leaked out, and they put regular ATF in and it is still kind of notchy. I was going to try the "Ford Friction Modifier" or the GM Syncromesh, but am not sure where to get it....straight from the dealers?

 

[Toneboski]

How would you extract the existing fluid to put the sychromesh in, in an MTX?

 

[Dr.Evil]

Isnt the syncromesh a little bottle of additive?? or do you fill the whole tranny with it...?

 

[DougLee25]

You fill the whole tranny up with it. A friction modifier is only a little bottle.

Doug

 

[shojuan]

Toneboski:
How would you extract the existing fluid to put the sychromesh in, in an MTX?

You use a little vacuum pump. Some cheapskates have even just used a few pennies worth of tubing and siphon it out. You stick the tube down the filler hole. Getting some tubing that was rolled up and stays curved when unrolled really helps to get the tubing down to the bottom of the tranny.

I used hand operated Sunpro vacuum pump/vacuum gauge that use for 1 man brake bleeding and vacuum diagnostics. I think the most I got out was 2.5 quarts. I think sdpatt has said that he was able to get 3 quarts (out of a total 3.1 qaurt capacity!) using a vacuum pump. It all depends on how far down you can get that hose.

 

[Dr.Evil]

When I looking at it up on a lift when the trans was leaking, I saw that mine had 2 drain plugs! One on the side and one on the very bottom! thumbs_u

 

[NotSoSlowSHO]

Dr.Evil:
When I looking at it up on a lift when the trans was leaking, I saw that mine had 2 drain plugs! One on the side and one on the very bottom! thumbs_u

That is one FILL plug and one drain plug. The drain plug is not original.

 

[ckinart]

yes,
you can make your own drain for the mtx if you wish, see www.shotimes.com for details. I did this with my mtx, and made my life a little easier.

NotSoSlowSHO:

Dr.Evil:
When I looking at it up on a lift when the trans was leaking, I saw that mine had 2 drain plugs! One on the side and one on the very bottom! thumbs_u

That is one FILL plug and one drain plug. The drain plug is not original.

 

[Toneboski]

shojuan:

Toneboski:
How would you extract the existing fluid to put the sychromesh in, in an MTX?

You use a little vacuum pump. Some cheapskates have even just used a few pennies worth of tubing and siphon it out. You stick the tube down the filler hole. Getting some tubing that was rolled up and stays curved when unrolled really helps to get the tubing down to the bottom of the tranny.

I used hand operated Sunpro vacuum pump/vacuum gauge that use for 1 man brake bleeding and vacuum diagnostics. I think the most I got out was 2.5 quarts. I think sdpatt has said that he was able to get 3 quarts (out of a total 3.1 qaurt capacity!) using a vacuum pump. It all depends on how far down you can get that hose.

i'm an idiot, but where's the fill-hole. Im not near my car right now, im at school. Thanks.

 

[SHOpar]

Dr.Evil:
It might be your clutch. Mine was doing exactly what you are describing, and I needed a clutch.

That's what I was initially thinking, and am still keeping my fingers crossed it's a bad clutch and not blocking rings and/or synchronizers.

I am going to try the Syncromesh fluid to see if there's any improvement. If it helps, then my trans probably is going to need a rebuild soon. If it doesn't then it is most likely the clutch the way I see it.

Dr.Evil:
I was going to try the "Ford Friction Modifier" or the GM Syncromesh, but am not sure where to get it....straight from the dealers?

I bet Ford Parts Network and several other online suppliers could get you the Ford Friction Modifier much cheaper than a dealer could. As far as the GM Syncromesh, it sells for about $10/quart through dealerships, but you can get it for almost half that at gmpartsdirect. Quaker State also makes their own version of this stuff that sells at auto parts stores, but I don't know if it's the same stuff, and was the question in my original post.

Toneboski:
How would you extract the existing fluid to put the sychromesh in, in an MTX?

Install a drain plug like I did or suck it out with a pump like others have said. The drain plug is definitely the way to go, and pretty easy to do. SHOtimes explains this mod quite well here.

<small>[ February 26, 2003, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: SHOpar ]</small>

 

[SHOpar]

So back to the original question, can anyone tell me if the Quaker State version of Syncromesh is the same as the GM version?

I want to try some of this fluid, and will save time and money by picking up the QS stuff at the local Autozone, but I am wary of anything QS/Pennzoil, so if it's not the same I won't use it.

Any info would be helpful! THANKS!

 

[Jayman]

Why not have a professional check your clutch before you do anything? Perhaps that IS the problem. Then you can leave the synthetic fluid in there and not worry about which fluid is better.

 

[SHOpar]

Jayman:
Why not have a professional check your clutch before you do anything? Perhaps that IS the problem. Then you can leave the synthetic fluid in there and not worry about which fluid is better.

Yeah, I think I will. The shop that did my last clutch has a lifetime warranty on parts, so all I'll have to pay is labor. Only bad part is I want to buy the clutch kit from SHOnut with the ceramic throwout bearing, but I am sure they won't be willing to do that.

Anyways, the QS Syncromesh is NOWHERE to be found around town, so I think I'll order some from GMpartsdirect and put it in when/if I get my clutch swapped out.

 

[rendyx]

I use the GM stuff, and it's very nice. But, I'd check your clutch first as others have suggested. If it is that, you'll be draining the tranny anyways. I'd go with the GM stuff myself. It seems to produce great results, and I haven't heard much about the QS/Pennzoil products. Of course you might give 'em a shot!

 

[heath94]

I had to do something, shiftinf was getting dangerously difficult , so i picked some pennzoil synchromesh and put in last night, incredible improvement, of course the old fluid was black.127k Smooth shifts now, I may switch to the GM stuff now that the tranny is not totally shot

 

[Dr.Evil]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by NotSoSlowSHO:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Dr.Evil:
When I looking at it up on a lift when the trans was leaking, I saw that mine had 2 drain plugs! One on the side and one on the very bottom!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is one FILL plug and one drain plug. The drain plug is not original.

No, there is one filler and 2 drain plugs. One on the side/bottom and one directly on the bottom.
I think I will order up some of that GM stuff...sounds like good stuff even if it is made by GM wink

 

[Bizzy]

I siphoned mine out casue I don't need a vac pump for anything other than pulling the fluid out of the tranny. I can't justify $20-$30 for a pump that I'll use once. I got some .170 inner diameter hose from Home Depot, and got the siphon going. I just let it run for the time while I was working on my y-pipe. Took about 2 hours to get like 2.25-2.5 qts out.

I put pennzoil in and a little GM stuff too cause the Autozone only had 2 qts of the pennzoil. I highly doubt that there is any difference between the GM syncromesh and the Pennzoil/Quaker State stuff. Cept the Pennzoil stuff is 1/2 the price, and there isn't any shipping charges like from gmpartsdirect.com

I like the way my tranny shifts now with the syncromseh, it feels much more fluid and precise. It also significantly reduced my 2nd gear grind when really cold. I just shift into 2nd slow now and no grind, where as before it always required slow shift and double clutching when it is really cold out. 30 or higher and there is no problems at all.

 

[heath94]

I used a suction gun to pull the fluid out, I had to out a smaller hose on it and it was a little messy, but you can get suction guns for 5 bucks. took about 10 or 15 minutes to pull out. I put all but about 3 tbls of the third quart in. Well worth the trouble and mess.

 

[Dave Ladely]

Is this Synchromesh oil synthetic? At that price it sounds like it is. Is it better than Amsoil or Redline?