Cutting the Welds ?

[CircleTrackSHO]

SHORacer14 said:

"Oh yeah, I'm sure you've already cut the spot welds from the struts.... give yourself a shitload of camber."

Please, tell me more. I"m not sure what Shoracer mean, but it sounds like something I want to hear more about !!

anyone with experience or instructions, please chime in.

 

[JustinSane]

the upper front strut mounts have a plate thats welded to the inner fender, if you air chisel or cut the welds holding the plate in place you can adjust the camber alot more.

 

[CircleTrackSHO]

okay.. instead of moving the plate, I unbolted the top of the strut, dropped it down, moved the strut as far back and as far inside as it would go (coils barely clearing side of strut tower), re-drilled the holes and reattached the strut. Have I accomplished the same thing as grinding off the spot welds and moving the plate ?

 

[JustinSane]

i never tried that method so i cant tell you if you got as much or not, moving the plate will move the hole so if that hole is your limiting factor then i would think you could get more.

 

[HotRodKid]

sounds like you acomplished the same thing, but its nice to have the plate cut free, as it allows easy adjutment when ever you like

 

[CircleTrackSHO]

sounds like you acomplished the same thing, but its nice to have the plate cut free, as it allows easy adjutment when ever you like

I agree 100% and if I had known in advance, I would have done it that way. As it sits, I'm still going to need to find a way to get more camber I fear.. we will know more in about 8 hours, as I'm headed to the track. wish me luck.. Viva la SHO !!

 

[JustinSane]

dont forget the videos , they are awsome.

 

[hawkeye18]

okay.. instead of moving the plate, I unbolted the top of the strut, dropped it down, moved the strut as far back and as far inside as it would go (coils barely clearing side of strut tower), re-drilled the holes and reattached the strut. Have I accomplished the same thing as grinding off the spot welds and moving the plate ?

I would say most likely, yes, but you weakened that plate a lot in the process. That plate has to bear the load of every impact the strut takes... now, granted, impacts aren't really that common on race tracks, but still, I'd weld the original holes up just to be on the safe side... I really wouldn't want that plate buckling in.

If you want to be really creative, I bet there's a way to weld a spacer into the LCA/subframe mount so that you would push the LCA out further, increasing camber on the lower end. Also, you could get creative with the bushings on the strut rod in order to move the knuckle forward. I mean, ****, with an air grinder and a MIG welder, there's no limit to what you can do...

 

[midnightauto]

you can re-drill the holes on the subframe to move the lower control arm out about a inch and a little more if you get a offset bushing. you may also look into other cars with similar lower control arms to see if you can get one a little longer. but as you push out the bottom to gain camber keep a eye on axle length.

 

[hawkeye18]

oh yeah, I forgot about the axle. Well... uh... there's gotta be a longer axle out there that'll work! ...right?

 

[Racer X]

you can re-drill the holes on the subframe to move the lower control arm out about a inch and a little more if you get a offset bushing. you may also look into other cars with similar lower control arms to see if you can get one a little longer. but as you push out the bottom to gain camber keep a eye on axle length.

2 reasons that won't work:

(1) You're going to distend the axles. Obviously, this will cause bad things to happen.
(2) You can't enlongate the strut rod to accomodate the repositioning of the LCA.

 

[Shoaz]

2 reasons that won't work:

(1) You're going to distend the axles. Obviously, this will cause bad things to happen.
(2) You can't enlongate the strut rod to accomodate the repositioning of the LCA.

Although I don't necessarily think that moving the knuckle out is a good idea, due partly to (1), (2) could be taken care of with the Ingalls adjustable strut rods. It's not a stock piece, so I don't know whether it'd be legal. It does "look" pretty stock...

 

[CircleTrackSHO]

dont forget the videos , they are awsome.

Battery died in the camera, so no video tonight of the 1/4 mile track... sorry.

That being said, we ran a solid 3rd tonight... and it should have been first.

Good News:

We missed qualifying, started from the back, between laps 1 and 8 quickly moved into 3rd spot.. cars in 1st and 2nd were running door to door and I was right on their rear bumper, ready to pass as soon as they made a mistake or make a hole for myself if need be.

Bad News:

I didn't stop in at the pit board before the feature, they shortened our race from 20 to 12 laps due to an earlier long wreck filled race. So while I was running round in 3rd place bidding my time I was eating the few laps I had left to make my move. On Lap 11, they waved the white flag, I was completely unprepared.. I got wide and made it 3 wide, couldn't hold the line through the corner and finished 3rd.

Morale of the Story.. always check the pit board before you start a feature race.

Synopsis of changes:

1.) The rear sway bar really, really helped with the push. Car turned much better. In fact, it might turn a bit too good for the current set up. I'll try to get you a photo, but we were tricycling the car through the corners... as much as 8 inches off the ground. I had a fan in the pits after the race say they were scared I was going to roll the car over. I'm sure it looked worst then it felt.

2.) Fixing the toe-in definitely helped getting into and up to the apex of the corner.. however, there still isn't enough camber to make the tire stick.

Summary:

I went back to using hard brakes on entry, set the nose, roll into throttle at 1/2 way through and ******* gas on exit. I definitely ran better laps when I was able to get slowed down. If I drove in too deep, it'd push right up the track and I'd lose over a second on that lap.

Other Issues: The SHO didn't like the distance of the track. In first gear on my 15" tires, I was at 7000 rpm and pinging off the rev limiter before we even got half way down the straights.. In second gear, I left the corners at 3100 and below the power band, I didn't get "full power" till about 4100.. then the motor would just come alive, but at that point I only had a 45 to 50 yards of straight left.

I'll need to either get 16" rims and bigger tires and try to run in 1st or get 14" tires and try 2nd again.

Camera is on charger as we speak, I'll have video from Saturday Night up on Sunday. promise.

 

[Shoaz]

The secondary intake runners open, via control from the EEC, at 4krpm. This keeps the torque up and basically starts a second torque peak. This is probably what you're feeling.

And, yeah, keeping the rpms above 4k makes a big difference in getting out of the corners. With the MTX it's not too hard to do with gear selection, but your case is a bit more constrained.

 

[Bob Gervais]

okay.. instead of moving the plate, I unbolted the top of the strut, dropped it down, moved the strut as far back and as far inside as it would go (coils barely clearing side of strut tower), re-drilled the holes and reattached the strut. Have I accomplished the same thing as grinding off the spot welds and moving the plate ?

You accomplished more than you would if you had drilled out the spot welds and moved the strut mount around. The square holes under the top plate only allow for about 1/4" of movement, most likely not anywhere near as much as you've moved it by relocating the holes.

I wouldn't worry too much about welding up the factory holes, you haven't weakened that section all that much, if at all. Chalk it up to another paranoid statement.

Have you moved your subframe to its forwardmost position? This, in combination with your strut relocation will give you the maximum caster the factory parts will allow. If you look under the car, you'll see the four subframe bolts, directly in front of the front mounts you'll see a hole in the subframe that lines up with a hole in the framerail. Stick a steel bar in there after loosening the subframe bolts, and move the subframe as far forward and to the passenger's side as you can. This will give you more caster and more neg. camber on the pass. side which is probably where you'll need it most. It will also keep the engine/trans/axle locations the same so you won't need to worry about pulling the axle too much.

Check into those Ingalls adjustable strut rods too. They are very factory looking, especially with a coat of black paint.

 

[CircleTrackSHO]

Race Update in the other thread..

http://www.shoforum.com/showpost.php?p=766384&postcount=88

 

[SHOMON]

hey guys just my 2 cents but i'm positive that there are adj. upper strut mounts i think sho bros sells them i think ingalls makes them not sure of how much camber they allow for but some people recomend them for lowered street cars to get the alignement right it basically replaces the upper strut mount went to shobros site they are made by ingalls and allow
+-1 degree of camber