checking timing belt

[DavidT]

OK, so I need to make sure everything is in time. Do I need to pretty much do the same procedure as CHANGING the timing belt? All I want to do is make sure it is in time(it is fairly new). (Do I need to bump the crank bolt with the starter, etc...?)
Also I was trying to find the spout connector. What exactly is it? I know it is small, grey, and less than an inch cube in size, BUT I can't seem to locate it!
Thanks.

 

[projectSHO89]

Look for it adjacent to the cam sensor.

Steve

 

[sdpatt]

You can remove just the upper timing belt cover to check the timing belt installation. Remove the upper cover and rotate the crankshaft until the second, white notch on the damper aligns with the "0" mark on the timing tab on the lower timing belt cover (0 degrees BTDC on the #1 cylinder). The index marks on both camshaft pulleys should be aligned with the index marks on the rear timing belt cover at the 12 o'clock position. See the pictures here of the alignment of the upper marks. If the camshaft pulley index marks are at the 6 o'clock position just rotate the crankshaft one revolution in the clockwise direction and check again.

 

[DavidT]

Thanks Scott,
To rotate the crankshaft, do I have to jack up the car, take off the splash shield, do the bump the starter trick, etc...?

 

[SolidState]

No, leave it in gear and rotate the wheel. Bumping the starter is only used to loosen the harmonic balancer bolt.

 

[sdpatt]

You can also use a 19mm socket on the crank damper bolt and a socket wrench from either above or below to turn the crank. You will need to position the damper precisely so that the white notch is aligned to the "0" mark.

 

[DavidT]

Is the crank damper bolt on the crank pulley?
Bear with me guys... I've got the hood up NOW and getting ready to attempt this myself... I've never done this before and I am trying to remember things from when I had a 60K. To CHECK the timing, I assume I still have to remove the battery and the crossover on the intake. Then the upper cover. Is this correct? Just rotate the crankshaft from there? I assume the crank pulley will be visible?? (Don't I have to look at it too, to see if everything is in time??)

 

[sdpatt]

You correctly described how to remove the upper timing belt cover. The crank damper is visible without doing anything else. The "0" mark I referred to is located on the tab on the lower timing belt cover and is easily visible from above. Just make sure you line the damper's second, white notch up with the "0" to check the timing.

 

[DavidT]

the upper timing belt cover WILL NOT break free! It is getting hung up... Do I have to remove the engine roll damper? Cause if I do, I am not sure how. At the bottom, at the top, or at the bracket that holds it to the strut tower case?

 

[DavidT]

OK! I got everything off! Now, checking the timing... I am ignoring the marks on the BELT. I have rotated the crank (using the tire)... the lines on the cam pulleys are lined up with the lines on the rear upper cover. Now... I look down at the crank pulley... (I have not removed anything below the upper timing belt cover), I see the thing that says "10 0", there is a notch on the pulley that sits right below the "plate" with the "10 0", THAT NOTCH IS ABOUT 1 INCH LEFT OF THE "10" on the "plate". Does this mean the timing is off? I need input please. eek! burn_out squint

 

[shojuan]

When the dots on the cam pulleys are lined up with the lines on the cam cover the white notch on the harmonic balancer pulley should be aligned with the 0 mark on the timing belt cover.

WooHoo!!! I think you might have found the problem! You're probably all jazzed up now. You can always just start taking things apart and put the belt on properly then welcome yourself to the 220 HP club! Woohoo!!

I've had a bit to drink, hope I didn't misread your description, somebody else confirm.

Rick

 

[DavidT]

Woo hoo! Call me stupid. I sure can post some idiotic statements! I rolled the crank pulley around to line up the WHITE mark to the "0" on the tab. The marks on the cam pulleys are EXACTLY one tooth LEFT of the marks on the rear timing cover. Soooooooooo, is this my 99 horsey problem thumbs_u ? If it is, whaT ALL DO i HAVE TO DO NOW? (stupid cap lock button!)

 

[luigisho]

Look for the pic Scott posted with the belt installed correctly. You need to remove the belt, get all those timing markes where they're supposed to be and reinstall the belt. You should be getting close to solving the problem. Nice work.

 

[shojuan]

One tooth can make a big difference. Because you just need to pull the belt off and put it back on you shouldn't have to take as much apart as you would if you were swapping an old belt for a new. So, I guess you've got to decide whether to pull an all-nighter or wait till the weekend.

Either way you will be so stoked once you get this fixed!

Rick

 

[DavidT]

ARe you kidding? Who could sleep at a time like this?
You are right, I am uncertain as to what my next steps are.
Do i need to loosen the crank bolt, get a harmonic balancer puller, etc..., or is it less complicted seeing how I am NOT changing the belt, just timing it.
Is it critical to line the marks on the belt with the marks on the pulleys? If so, why?
Lastly, I am pretty sure everything was in time when I had the new belt installed. Of course, it never ran like it should, though. So, is it possible the computer could retard, or adjust the timing to compensate some other problem?

 

[luigisho]

It's easier to see that everything is lined up properly with the markings. If the timing marks on the gears , cam and crank, are lined up properly the marks on the belt aren't critical but will help before you put the covers back on. The markings on the belt are spaced to line up exactly with the timing marks on the gears.

I think unless you can get the covers off without removing the harmonic balancer everything will have to come off. If the timing covers do come off then maybe you could loosen the tensioner and reinstall the belt with the har.bal. on. Never tried to do it that way.

<small>[ October 10, 2002, 11:27 PM: Message edited by: luigisho ]</small>

 

[shojuan]

Did you install the new belt last time or did somebody else do it? They probably put it on the same way that it was before: Wrong. Maybe they charged you for a new belt and never bothered changing it!

OK, the benefit of waiting till the weekend is that sober people can help you out. I'm drunk, I've only done one 60K and my wife is calling me upstairs to watch "Must see TV" (I've already missed Friends).

You're going to need to pull the harmonic balancer pulley. So, you're going to have to pull the accessory belts. I guess I'm somewhat wrong. You can probably avoid removing the engine torque strut, but it's really no big deal to remove it anyways and it should make access easier. After you pull the harmonic balancer, note the orientation of the guide washer and put it aside on top of the balancer pulley in the same orientation. The bottom and middle timing belt covers are going to having to come off. Make sure to take your time and get them off without breaking them or stripping the bolts. It's easy, just don't get too excited and try to take short cuts. It's not worth it to go at it kamikaze style. Use PB Blaster on the bolts. Some are longer than others so take your time and put them in the covers in the right place when you set them aside. When you get to where you are able to pull the timing belt off, you are going to loosen the tensioner puller and then use an allen wrench in the provided hole to rotate the tensioner 180 degrees to the left then tighten the pulley nut to hold it.

Shoot, I'll just email you the document that Scott emailed me when I did my 60K. It's put together from the Helms manual and seems a bit better than what was in my 89 helms manual.

Crap, sorry I'm drunk. If you really are going to go at it tonight and will be up, I can give you my cell number and I'll call you back (got free minutes after 9PM pacific) if you get seriously stuck. Since I don't have anywhere I need to be tomorrow and I've been staying up until about 4AM pacific time lately I'm not going to need sleep before you do.

Rick

 

[DavidT]

Rick, and everyone else... THANK YOU for all your input thumbs_u
Alas. I do not have a harmonic balancer puller! I guess I'll rent one tomorrow. So both accessory belts must come off?
Also, I noticed the pulley at the 8:00 position from the alternator does nut have a nut on it eek! What does that pulley go to?
Also, I was there when the t. belt was replaced... it seemed good to me.

<small>[ October 11, 2002, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: dkautumna ]</small>

 

[shojuan]

That's the alternator/AC belt tensioner pulley. There should be a nut there. Doh! eek!

Yeah, the accessory belts need to come off to get access. It's not hard, you just need the allen bit that will fit and enough extensions to reach the tensioners. The four rib tensioner can be a bit tricky to get the bit in there. Basically, go through the document I sent you, make sure you have all the tools you need and have at it. You've got the whole weekend and the shoforum to help!

Rick

 

[sdpatt]

I will email you the (now defunct) SHO Registry magizine's 3.0L timing belt change procedure when I get home around noon. Yes, you will need to remove the roll damper, accessory belts and crank damper (among other things). Your situation will be slightly different than the procedure describes since you must line the camshaft index marks to the 12 o'clock marks on the rear timing cover before removing the belt. The damper index will not be aligned with the "0" mark on the tab before you remove the damper and the lower timing cover.

The 12 o'clock camshaft position allows them to remain in place when the belt is removed. If they move, you will need a strap wrench (or other means) to rotate the camshafts to the 12 o'clock position. Once the belt is off, you can move the crankshaft as you need to remove/install the CPS and align it for the installation of the new belt.

Position the crank damper so that the index dimple on the pulley tooth lines up with the index ridge at the 5 o'clock position. The white lines on the belt will guide you to make sure that the new belt is installed with the crank and the cams are in the correct orientation. Go here to see pictures of the correct orientation of the cams, crank and belt during the belt installation.

It's great to see that you have identified the cause of your car's low output. Bad maintenance has probably been the cause of many of the different problems that the SHOs have experienced.