Car Stalls; Lurches from 1st

[Marccus]

'89 w/466K

When idling in traffic, the engine just stalls for no reason or advance warning but then starts right up or after one or two attempts. After starting up, it might start to lurch from 1st gear when I immediately re-engage the clutch to prevent this. Kind of like the lurching you feel when the motor mounts are gone, except it doesn't slip out of gear. I have the SHO Nut reinforced motor mounts (not the extreme kind).

There are NO codes except for #67 which is gone when I clear the memory.

About two weeks ago, it stalled consistently many times especially cruising calmly down the highway , when the tach would be erratic also and the engine was very difficult to re-start. I ran the trouble codes and all three of the circuits in the coil were shot. I replaced the coil and then had no problems at all except for this new problem that arose yesterday and today.

Any ideas? It would be hard to believe that it would be the coil again, especially since there are no codes.

Bad battery? Optima Red Top 4 years old this April. (Wish I had my voltmeter with me). Southern California or San Francisco location. I've check the grounds all the time to make sure they are all intact.

 

[SHOracer14]

'89 w/466K

When idling in traffic, the engine just stalls for no reason or advance warning but then starts right up or after one or two attempts. After starting up, it might start to lurch from 1st gear when I immediately re-engage the clutch to prevent this. Kind of like the lurching you feel when the motor mounts are gone, except it doesn't slip out of gear. I have the SHO Nut reinforced motor mounts (not the extreme kind).

There are NO codes except for #67 which is gone when I clear the memory.

About two weeks ago, it stalled consistently many times especially cruising calmly down the highway , when the tach would be erratic also and the engine was very difficult to re-start. I ran the trouble codes and all three of the circuits in the coil were shot. I replaced the coil and then had no problems at all except for this new problem that arose yesterday and today.

Any ideas? It would be hard to believe that it would be the coil again, especially since there are no codes.

Bad battery? Optima Red Top 4 years old this April. (Wish I had my voltmeter with me). Southern California or San Francisco location. I've check the grounds all the time to make sure they are all intact.

When the engine dies do all of the electronics die too? Ignition switch can cause an intermittent stalling problem but, it is tough to diagnose as it doesn't leave a trail when failing intermittently.

 

[Marccus]

I can't remember if all the electronics die also. My ignition switch went bad a long time ago and replacing with a new one did not work. So I bypassed the ignition switch many years ago with a momentary switch mounted beneath the dash on the metal plate under the steering wheel. I fed two wires through the fire wall and hooked them up to the relay on the firewall to jump the relay when I held the switch down. Works great and hasn't failed me yet.

But what does whether the electronics die or not tell you when the car stalls?

Thanks for your input.

 

[SHOracer14]

I can't remember if all the electronics die also. My ignition switch went bad a long time ago and replacing with a new one did not work. So I bypassed the ignition switch many years ago with a momentary switch mounted beneath the dash on the metal plate under the steering wheel. I fed two wires through the fire wall and hooked them up to the relay on the firewall to jump the relay when I held the switch down. Works great and hasn't failed me yet.

But what does whether the electronics die or not tell you when the car stalls?

Thanks for your input.

Just wondering if there is a loss of power being caused by anything else that could **** the engine i.e. bad ground connection somewhere, loose connector, etc. Hmmm.... let me think on it some more.

 

[SHOracer14]

If you are not getting an abnormally high or irradic idle (like IAC issue or vacuum leak) my only other guesses would be the typical crank and or cam sensor issues, or a dirty or faulty MAF. As long as all other connections are good those are the likely culprits. You have enough miles on that thing that almost anything is possible. Considering you had to bypass that ignition switch that is testament to there being some sort of issue on that circuit and there are others that could begin doing the same thing. Check into those things and if it gets worse or you get new symptoms let us know.

 

[Marccus]

Within the last three years, I replaced the the cam shaft sensor, crank sensor, timing belt, water pump, fuel pump, fuel filter, and mass flow meter. I gapped the crank sensor to the required gap (0.030 inches?) and used lock-tite (blue or red - can't remember) on the small philips head screws to ensure the sensor housing would not slip and get chewed up by the vanes.

I'll keep my eye on things to see if the symptoms occur again and/or things worsen. Thanks for your input.

 

[Marccus]

Stalled again at a light while idling. Just before this the engine was running a little rough. The radio was still playing while it was stalled. I tried several times to start it but it was completely dead but the tach needle went past 7000 and back and acted erraticallly. Finally. after two attempts with nothing it started when I held the throttle wide open. It acted like this several years ago AFTER I replaced the crankshaft sensor. I took off the timing cover etc, and checked the crankshaft sensor and it was fine. I don't feel like doing that again! Eventually that problem went away and is now resurfacing after several years of being absent. I think the problem has to do with faulty wiring as all the sensors are pretty much new. Once started it ran fine and starts on the first attempt from then after. If it does stall it is always when the car is idling during traffic!! :banghd: . Without this problem it runs like it is new. But I haven't checked the codes again and will do that tonight as I am at work now.

 

[Marccus]

Is there a (two digit) code for a bad crankshaft position sensor?
'89 w/466K

 

[ViPER1313]

This really sounds like the cam position sensor or DIS. Also, check the wiring harness that sits on top of the rear valve cover behind the intake snakes. It has a tendency to rub against the metal ridge on the firewall and can wear through. My friend had an 89' that would stall all over the place for that very reason (only at low RPMS and depending on how the wheel was turned....) - one of the cam position wires was frayed and shorting out on that metal ridge.

 

[Marccus]

That’s a very interesting observation of your friend’s problem because that’s exactly what happened to me when the car just died like this in previous times. I just lifted the harness that is up against the firewall and jiggled it and then the car would start. I removed the metal bracket that held the harness to the firewall and wrapped all the wiring in a thick layer of self-fusing silicone rubber tape and then used zip ties to hold it up off the valve cover. I’ve also jiggled and disconnected/connected the wiring on the cam sensor and the CPS sensor the coil, etc., just to see if that would help start it. It usually worked but I could never figure out which wire(s) were causing the problem. I guess I’ll just have to keep at it. But I don’t think any wires are worn from fraying since they are all so well wrapped.

 

[Marccus]

I believe I found the problem to the faulty wiring . The car stalls when the wiring on the coil connector is pulled to the side. This is the same direction that the heavy part of the harness is pulling it – towards the firewall and down. So I used very thick self fusing rubber tape (made by 3M for insulating wiring inside heavy duty motors) to keep the harness from pulling the wire on the connector. But I’ll have to get a new connector at a junkyard since these are difficult to repair.

Also something strange happened. I initially though the battery cable where it ran below the coil was shorting itself out on the metal it was touching. This was right near where the clutch cable moves in and out when the clutch is engaged. It lucks like the metal protrusion on this piece was jabbing the cable and wearing it out. When I moved the cable and then turned the engine on, a big puff of white smoke drifted up in this area and by the strut tower . But I couldn’t find any break on the cable where it could possibly short itself out. Also, I had just changed the thermostat this weekend and unavoidably spilled coolant on the bell housing. I thought I washed it all off with water. Doesn’t coolant give off white smoke when it evaporates? Anyway, I can’t explain this phenomenon.

 

[ViPER1313]

I hope one of your fusible links (they are taped up in that wiring harness by the strut tower) didn't go up in a cloud of smoke...... You will know soon enough if your car starts to charge weak.

 

[Marccus]

Excellent point and diagnosis. :thankyou: That must have been what happened. I know where they are and I'll check them out right away. Where can you buy fusible links of different gauges? I didn't notice any at Pep Boys or Autozone. Can you still tell what gauge size the link is after it went up in smoke? I guess I could just install a smaller gauge wire to get buy. I wonder what caused it to blow.

 

[Marccus]

Car Died Competely; Need local assistance.

'89 w/466K

Too early to celebrate. Car completely died. Battery is still good, lights, sunroof, power seats, etc. all work strong. I tried jumping the relay on the firewall; I get a good spark, but nothing happens; it is still dead.

Can anyone assist in the Bakersfield, California area on California Avenue where it crosses under the 99/58 freeways to help me diagnose the problem.

This is the only car I have and I need it to get to work. I'm on a temporary work assignment and I don't have all my tools with me.

Also, there are no error codes. Sorry to sound pushy, but for the second time, is there a error code for a bad CPS. I can't believe this would be bad, as I checked it once before when I had intermittant starting problems and it was fine.

It think it has to do with the puff of smoke I saw by the strut tower brace when I started the engine when I was having the stalling problem.

If no one can assist in the area, do you suggest having it towed to a Ford dealership or would they be as useless as me to try to find the problem since this car is so old.

Thanks.