11 second SHO.

[somedude_001]

well I am really thinking about running 11's in my turbo SHO, but here is the kicker. I am going to try doing it on the stock engine. I am just waiting till I can get some more helpfull gauges to watch the engine closer.

when I ran my 12.9 @108mph 2.10 60' the run was almost perfect with the execption of me accdently launching at 8psi instead of 12.5. the car left with perfect traction. and ran straight down the track.

origionaly I was going to give it a go wish somewhere between 17 and 19psi and see how it goes, but after thinking realisticaly I realized that was just a bad idea. My new idea is much more safe I think. 10psi 50-75 shot of spray and meth injection to get the charge really cold. I was just wondering if anyone knew for sure if the pistons will take the pounding from the No2. It looks like i need to pick up about 10mph over my last 1/4 mile pass, and in adition i'm going to aim for a high 1.9 60' which i think is reasonable with some real slicks... Oh the car launches at 3600-3800 rpm with this stall under boosted load 2900 before boost hits.

to recap:

Goal 11 second pass in the 1/4 mile

engine mods:
start with the 230K origional engine with fresh bearings.
extrude hone intake
big bore butterflies (40mm)
turbo at 10psi~
NO2
meth injection
+4 pooints luck
3.98 final drive change

I wanted to adda pole but i aparently can't

1. Your goal is redic a SHO can't run 11's
2. Call me before you run I've never seen a SHO engine scatter itself
3. Your tranny is going to hate you, and you will fail
4. Everything will work and you will make your goal

 

[SASHO91]

I'd spray the IC before i'd spray the motor. Spray the IC, and use the meth. And bump the boost to 12-14psi...That's what I would do.
Plus you will probably have to setup the rear suspension or add a "wheelie bar".

 

[somedude_001]

I'd spray the IC before i'd spray the motor. Spray the IC, and use the meth. And bump the boost to 12-14psi...That's what I would do.
Plus you will probably have to setup the rear suspension or add a "wheelie bar".

the meth will do the same thing as spraying the IC and spraying the engine is so I can make power more safely as it is much more predictable.

I don't have traction problems on kumo victoracers launching at full boost so I will worry about it when it is a problem.

edit: 12-14 psi will not get my into the 11's I need a lot more power. probably another 100whp 4psi will not get me that.

 

[Sho Amo]

you think you can run more than 14 psi on the stock motor? that is my only question but other than that i think you can do it.
what are you doing about your tranny? did it get rebuilt already?

 

[SASHO91]

Ok then...

Option 1.....



EDIT:
As long as the charge temp is cool (IC) you can run 14psi.
EDIT:
Is there any concern when spraying meth AND nitrous? I would think so... but i've never heard of this being done.

 

[somedude_001]

you think you can run more than 14 psi on the stock motor? that is my only question but other than that i think you can do it.
what are you doing about your tranny? did it get rebuilt already?

if only I had video of the abuse this engine has been through. my boos gauge fitting leaks so it only displays 16inches of vacc when it is really around 20-22. over the winter (20~ deg weather) I had a wastegate failure for a couple of days and the engine develpoed a miss when the gauge displayed 17psi. I was still running rich and the car was stupid fast... yeah it will handle 14 no problem. I just don't know how it is going to handle the boost and spray. has anyone pushed this engine that far on stock internals. If you have pm me i would like to talk. I know SHOnut has but i havent seen him on in a while. just want some insite so i don't melt pistons. I want to get 100% out of this engine but not 101% because taht would be bad

 

[SASHO91]

A guy in texas, MikeD, just melted a piston or two from Boost+N2O.. allthough he was running 125shot on 9lbs or so. Atleast that's what I can gather.

IMO you will melt something... THAT much HP is going to take it's toll (in the form you want to add).

 

[St Louis SHO]

I honestley believe it is 100% possible on stock parts. The tranny may not make 50 passes, but thats the only thing I'd be worried about at all. (my best rob schnieder voice) YOU CAN DO IT!

 

[BlackonBlack89]

I think traction will be your biggest concern. More power is just going to make it worse. I am interested on what you are doing about wieght transfer. Slicks will help but only so much if all the weight is going backwards.
And another thing... Axles. Are they a weak point in the ATX as they are in the MTX. I am not sure with ATX but I think the stockers will not last long.

The engine is very stout but why not just get low-comp pistons. It will allow more room for error and is not that expensive for what it can save. ($700)

 

[somedude_001]

traction isn't my major concern because there is always a better tire.

axles are completely useless to upgrade on the ATX because the shaft in the transmission from the diff to the left axel is weaker than the axle itself.

i'm not going to do pistons because I don't have any money. the cars primary porpuse is roadcourse, autoX, and DD for summer. I just want to set a reccord that wont be toutched for many years. I ran high 12 without breaking a sweat, and i really don't understand why it took 12 years after the last one was made to have a 12 second ATX.

 

[Sammy~D]

the meth will do the same thing as spraying the IC and spraying the engine is so I can make power more safely as it is much more predictable.

I don't have traction problems on kumo victoracers launching at full boost so I will worry about it when it is a problem.

edit: 12-14 psi will not get my into the 11's I need a lot more power. probably another 100whp 4psi will not get me that.

in genral boosting 1 psi=10hp

 

[somedude_001]

in genral boosting 1 psi=10hp

the SHO's seem to get 12-14hp with turbos but 10 is a good rule of thumb

 

[Sammy~D]

thats what i was taught at the tech school i went to..1 psi=10hp on avarage

 

[yamahaSHO]

Well.... I got 200 (167 wheel) extra crank hp with 9-10 PSI and no other changes to the motor. That's about 20hp per 1 PSI.

Theoretically, doubling boost over atmoshperic (which is about 14ish PSI, not 0), *in theory*, will double your power.

 

[SASHO91]

traction isn't my major concern because there is always a better tire.

A tire can only do so much....
If that was the case, I guess the guys with 4-link suspensions are just crazy...

i'm not going to do pistons because I don't have any money. the cars primary porpuse is roadcourse, autoX, and DD for summer.

If this car is your DD then why are you going to put it through ****? It's not a matter of if you are going to break something, its a matter of when.

Im just saying, if your'e gonna do it to your DD, do it so the car makes it through to the next round.

How much hp did Tim pick up from spraying the IC???? IIRC, he did not even rasie the boost either.... went from what, 380whp to 430whp??? i can't recall the specifics...
I guess what im saying is, spray the IC and up the boost abit more 15-18lbs (you said you ran 17lbs before) and run the car then... See where that puts you, then tackle the task of the next phase.

 

[somedude_001]

Well.... I got 200 (167 wheel) extra crank hp with 9-10 PSI and no other changes to the motor. That's about 20hp per 1 PSI.

and he is supercharged I thought you had massive headwork?

 

[somedude_001]

A tire can only do so much....
If that was the case, I guess the guys with 4-link suspensions are just crazy...

i'm not making that much power and I can't run a 4 link in the front

Im just saying, if your'e gonna do it to your DD, do it so the car makes it through to the next round.

I have my trusty saturn. for when I break the SHO. you can't have a boost SHO as your only car. I learned that early on. I just DD it for the summer because it is more fun to drive than a POS saturn with less than 130hp

How much hp did Tim pick up from spraying the IC???? IIRC, he did not even rasie the boost either.... went from what, 380whp to 430whp??? i can't recall the specifics...
I guess what im saying is, spray the IC and up the boost abit more 15-18lbs (you said you ran 17lbs before) and run the car then... See where that puts you, then tackle the task of the next phase.

that is what the meth does and it is more effective than using expensive NO2 on my intercooler.

spray engine > spray intercooler

if i was going to spray the IC I would use CO2 it is MUCH MUCH less expensive.

 

[yamahaSHO]

and he is supercharged I thought you had massive headwork?

Between the NA dyno and SC dyno's I have, there has been no changes, aside from the fuel pump. As long as all the head work was the same, it shouldn't skew reading (again, in theory).

My 214whp was about 260bhp
My 381whp was about 460bhp

With 20hp per 1 PSI, (10 PSI net 200 extra hp), you can add another 80hp to take me up to 14 PSI.

10 PSI + x = 14 PSI
4 PSI x 20hp = 80hp
460hp + 80hp = 540hp
540hp / 2 = 270hp

The wrong fuel pump (255lph pump on stock FPR) caused issues and probably cost me 10ish hp. So you can see, in theory, the 260hp and 270hp are pretty close with a fuel pump change taken into account.

Make sense?


BTW, NOW I have lots of head work.... I have no dyno yet, but it's hitting 14+ PSI on a bigger and better flowing motor.... It should show improvment.



EDIT: To add to the 1 PSI = 10hp comment....

Take a small Honda motor.... My Civic makes 127hp at atmoshperic pressure (14ish PSI at sea level). If I were to add 14 PSI on top of that, I should see around 254hp on that amount of boost (127 x 2).

127hp / 14 PSI = 9hp per 1 PSI.... See how the general rule of thumb does NOT apply?

 

[SASHO91]

spray engine > spray intercooler

if i was going to spray the IC I would use CO2 it is MUCH MUCH less expensive.

I never said spray the IC with nitrous....

 

[Sammy~D]

Between the NA dyno and SC dyno's I have, there has been no changes, aside from the fuel pump. As long as all the head work was the same, it shouldn't skew reading (again, in theory).

My 214whp was about 260bhp
My 381whp was about 460bhp

With 20hp per 1 PSI, (10 PSI net 200 extra hp), you can add another 80hp to take me up to 14 PSI.

10 PSI + x = 14 PSI
4 PSI x 20hp = 80hp
460hp + 80hp = 540hp
540hp / 2 = 270hp

The wrong fuel pump (255lph pump on stock FPR) caused issues and probably cost me 10ish hp. So you can see, in theory, the 260hp and 270hp are pretty close with a fuel pump change taken into account.

Make sense?


BTW, NOW I have lots of head work.... I have no dyno yet, but it's hitting 14+ PSI on a bigger and better flowing motor.... It should show improvment.

i hate math