valve clatter on start up?

[pete c]

My 93mtx has a second or two of valvetrain clatter on startup after it has set long enough for the oil to drain down out of the top of the motor. Is this normal? Everything sounds great once the earl gets back up into the top end of the motor. A few years ago I read that jaguar (I think) designed into their engines a feature which allowed the crank to spin a few times prior to lighting off the ignition. This gives the motor a couple of turns to get the bearings wet before it fires. Seems like a good idea. Does anybody make anything for a sho which would do the same thing? Would it just be a waste of money and would I be going through starters more frequently?

 

[sdpatt]

Would you be using a synthetic oil in your SHO? I have heard that same "unoiled" sound from a few different SHOs that were using Mobil 1. I heard the same noises with my engine back in its younger days when I switched from Castrol GTX to Castrol Syntech. I switched back after a few oil changes because I didn't llike to hear that sound.

If not using a synthetic, what oil are you using? The lack of lubrication on startup is where most engine wear occurs. Yours sounds to have taken quite a toll on your shims and/or cam lobes. Have you had a valve gap adjustment in the last 60,000 miles? That too, would help.

 

[clintonk]

My '95 MTX does this too, but not every time. It's not due for its first 60K yet, and I've used only Castrol GTX since I bought it at 35K. Given this issue, plus the car's age, I plan to do the 60K on time!

Clinton Knight
'90 White 183K
'95 Green 53K

 

[petec]

yes, I am using mobil 1. I have had the car for less than a week, so I don't really know when/if the shims were checked. I plan on doing the 60k within the next month. What do you guys think about slick 50? One of their claims is that it helps the oil adhere to metal parts. Is it compatable w/ syn. oil?

 

[jcostantino]

uhh... you're not serious about slick 50?

don't loose your engine because you put that junk in it

Jeff

 

[srfdude]

<strong>uhh... you're not serious about slick 50?

don't loose your engine because you put that junk in it

1

Still not totally convinced about the junk part. I used Slick 50 for 6 years in my Gen 1, before I read some bad reports and quit using it. Still running fine.......
Mike

 

[twr]

No clatter here - I have been using Mobile 1 since the car had 38k on it - now has 67k.
Terry

 

[sdpatt]

First, I recommend changing to Castrol GTX 10W-30 from the Mobil 1 at the next change. See if that makes a difference. I think you will find that it sounds more oiled at startup.

News flash: I have used Slick 50 several times in the lifetime of my 261,000 mile SHO. Say what you will, but it has certainly lasted longer than many others.

Scott

 

[bradman]

I too have used Slick 50, not in my SHO, but in an old clunker Oldsmobile which is still running. Who knows if it really helped, but it certainly didn't hurt.

However, also have some noise on startup in my SHO in which I use Castrol GTX (sorry Scott). It's usually not too bad unless it sits for a several days, but it still makes me cringe when I hear it. I've also had the valve lash and 60K done recently. What else can I do? I figure if the engine goes, I'll just have to fix it.

 

[quick91]

Know a guy who had a ford probe gt (2.2L Turbo) and was having the same problems. Also received valvetrain noise from his 92 eagle talon awd turbo and from his 95 eclipse gsx. You wanna know the SINGLE product that solved all noise and even helped a few leaks in the process??????
Hi-Tach Oil Stabilizer.
Now I'm not a fan of additives, BUT this stuff works and for most folks, you have to live by your means and listen to the noise, or fix the problem. Problem is with expensive SHO parts, a lot of times your means are not your most preffered way to solve the problem.
A note on oil consumption:
2-3 Qts/week down to 1 per 3000 miles with hi tach in an 89 sho with 250K. Interesting.

 

[quick91]

Another popular trick amongst the DSM boys (Eclipse, Talon, and Laser Turbos) is to run a quart of transmission fluid through with the oil for one oil change, and they all say it will eliminate that pesky noise upon startup.
Is it the perfect solution for a SHO?
Probably not, but on the other hand if it works for them..........you may consider...

 

[Chrisssssssss]

I have had that problem for about 2 months in my 3.0 before the rod bearings went. I have no idea whether it is related, but something to consider. I think that this point I switched back from mobil 1 synthetic back to castrol GTX because oil consumption was too great to put synthetic through it all the time. I don't remember whether it was doing it before or after I switched to dino oil though. Like I said, just something to think about, not to scare you...

 

[pete c]

scott,

I think I will go to the 10-30 castrol. That 5-30 stuff is like water! As far as I know, the only advantage to the 5 weight stuff is a slight reduction in the hp needed to pump it thru the motor. Has anyone ever monitored the fuel mileage difference between 5-30 and 10-30?

I think my maintanance philosophy from here on out will be WWSD? Kinda like the 'what would Jesus do?' bumper stickers!

Another possible advantage might be a reduction is whatever gasket leaks one might have, and I think I've got a slight rear main leak since I have a little oil residue on my oil pan. No puddles in the drive yet though.

 

[stevetatro]

Isn't 5W-30 and 10W-30 hypothetically the same once they're both at normal operating temperature?

Can't see how gas mileage would differ.

 

[TwiceSHOwn]

Well at least one difference is that the base oil is different.

5W30 is 5 weight oil that has additives to get it to 30.

10W30 is 10 weight oil with additives to get it to 30.

The reason car manufactures used to not allow more than a 25 point spread is because over time the additives break down leaving your oil closer and closer to base stock.

Thats the info i have anyway...

 

[RStalveyARFF]

be careful with the tranny fluid. My friend did it and ran the car with the fluid in the engine, and seized it. You're supposed to throw it in, run the car for 10 minutes, then change it.

 

[twr]

More often than not the clatter at start up is a result of worn rod bearings. The lack of oil pressure to fill the voids in the bearings allows the rods to rattle around the crank journals. Once the pressure is up the rods stop clattering. I have owned 3 Honda that have done this - all of them had 150k+ hard miles on them and unknown maitainance.

Terry

<small>[ June 20, 2002, 05:57 PM: Message edited by: twrsho ]</small>

 

[petec]

Rod bearings sound like a possibility. I don't think the sound I here is the rods, but, if they were worn couldn't it cause the oil fron the top end to leak down more quickly? It could also prevent pressure up top from building as quicly as it should. Another thing I'm seeing which concerns me is that if the engine bogs just a little, as in pulling away from a stop with too little throttle, the oil light is very quick to come on. I have never noticed this before in an engine. Usually the oil light doesn't come on until the engine stalls completelyShould I do rod bearing on a 90K motor with an unknown service history? I guess it could be cheap insurance. Is pulling the oil pan a major pain in the ass?

<small>[ June 20, 2002, 07:29 PM: Message edited by: petec ]</small>

 

[Sho-N-Go]

timing chain tensioners ring a bell?

 

[RStalveyARFF]

it's a big possibility. When the engine sits, the chain gets slack, and slaps on the underside of the valvecover until it gets tight. If you check, just pray it isn't the rear one... that's 96. the front is like 50.... From shonut, 2 cam timing chains cost 52.