Replacing Valve Cover Gaskets And Plug Well Seals

[TK`S SHO]

The Phoenix site said to use rtv sealant on valve covers and plug well seals. The box for the gasket set said not to use anything. When yall have done this in the past,what was the verdict. I also have a bad oil leak, don`t really know where its comming from,any suggestions? Car also has a bad vibration that feels like its comming from the drivers side. I have allready replaced both outer tyrod ends,cv axle on pass. side. I have both inner tyrods but I`m not sure if that is the problem, so I have not installed them yet. ANY REPLY`S ON THESE PROBLEMS WOULD BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.

 

[ShadetreeSHOguy]

first off welcome to the forum. and to answer your question about the valve cover gasket and plug well seals, the gasket sealant is not REQUIRED , but is reccomended in the corners where there's a sharp angle on the gasket(ie where the valve cover curves over the cam lobe), other than that, you dont have to use it. on the other question, im having the same problem and ill be watching for answers on it too :corn:

 

[qiksho]

As said earlier you need to put RTV on four corners...you will see where it is when you take the old ones off. If you don't you will have leaks. You do not want to use any sealant on the plug well seals. Don't ask me how I know....

Your vibration is probably:
1) out of balance tire(s)
2) Bad wheel bearing(s)
3) C/V axle

You can check your bearings with the wheels off the ground by checking for movement at the 6 and 12 oclock positions. THese typically fail between 120-150k on the SHO's I have owned.

 

[TK`S SHO]

Thanks for clearing up the matter about the rtv. The oil leak is comming from the back side of the engine and leaks a small puddle every time that I drive the car. Someone on another post said it could be leaking at a sensor on the lower back side of the engine causing oil to be sprayed everywhere. What other possiblities could their be? The car has 122,000 miles.

 

[TK`S SHO]

The issue with the vibration is still a mystery? I have replaced the pass. side cv axle, both outer tyrod ends,but need to check the wheel bearings today after I get the upper 60k finished. I do not have the special tool to do the valve lash adjustment,but there appears to be no wear on the shims and just a little wear on the rockers. I have seen the pictures on Phoenix site,those shims looked pretty bad. How important is this adjutment,and is the shim wear consistent on all SHO`S.

 

[oh_SHO]

Typically the valves are within tolerances. I did not change any shims when I did the upper 60K on my Dad's SHO at 125K. Something you might also want to check is the oil pressure sending unit located on the back side of the motor. I have had two of these fail and spew oil all over (unless your upper 60K fixed the leak). My Dad's 151K ATX has a smilar vibration. I think the wheel bearings are bad but I haven't had a chance to check it...

 

[mosho93]

Something you might also want to check is the oil pressure sending unit located on the back side of the motor. I have had two of these fail and spew oil all over (unless your upper 60K fixed the leak)

I also had a sending unit go out on me. I pulled up to the pump to fill up with gas and there was a huge line of oil comming in behind me. I checked my oil and it was barely touching the dip stick. Luckily i live right by the station. I filled it back up with oil and limped home. The sending unit is in a very tight spot to get to but probably would be easier with the intake off. Just have to make sure you dont get frustrated with it as you can barely move your wrench. good luck

 

[rangerj]

A couple of added thoughts;

A common axium in diagnosing vibrations is;
Front tire balance, wheel bearing, warped brake disk, etc is felt in the steering wheel,
Vibrations felt in the seat are usually coming from the rear due to tire balance, wheel bearing, less than adequate shock absorbsion or dampening, etc.

Note: the above are just rules of thumb and not absolute!

As for the oil leak, try using a flash light and a mechanics mirror in order to find the source of the leak. Check all around the edges of the valve covers, especially the lower edges and then the areas where the cam seals are. It may help to clean up the engine and check for leaks a few days later so you can see the oil flow. If you still cannot find the leak, there are dyes that can be added to the oil and are visable under ultra violet light.

 

[kickeralpine]

why cant you put rtv i the plug wells i did no problem

 

[SHOdownTN]

why cant you put rtv i the plug wells i did no problem

You can but it's not needed. If you want to for insurance go ahead.

 

[SHOdownTN]

To check wheel bearings and front end parts:
Jack one side of the car up by the lower control arm.
Doing this will take the weight off of the ball joint. Then, grab the wheel in the 6 and 12 oclock positions and try to wiggle it up and down if it feels stiff then all is ok. This will check the wheel bearing and the balljoint. If you get movement have someone look at the balljoint and see if there is play there.
Next grab the wheel in the 3 and 9 oclock position and try and wiggle it. If it feels tight the tie rod ends are ok. If wiggles easily and feels loose have someone look at the tie rod ends.
If it wiggles both up and down and sideways is a real sign of bad wheels bearings.
If all is ok get the wheels balanced. If it's still there you may have to look towards cheaking to see if it's the axels. Also, it can be possible to have a tire separate but unlikely. Try rotateing your tires before you rule out the wheel balance. Choppy tires usually can vibrate and will make noise.

 

[TK`S SHO]

Thanks for all of the info on the leak and vibration. I have the inner tyrod ends but I need someone to post step by step and what tools that are needed. I have changed the outer tyrod ends and the pass. side cv axle.I am still getting a poping noise when I back out of the driveway. The vibration at 73 mph sounds like a train going by when you are sitting at a rail road crossing. It sounds like its making a knockin noise.Sometimes you can hear a chirping noise at low speeds.

 

[SHOdownTN]

Thanks for all of the info on the leak and vibration. I have the inner tyrod ends but I need someone to post step by step and what tools that are needed. I have changed the outer tyrod ends and the pass. side cv axle.I am still getting a poping noise when I back out of the driveway. The vibration at 73 mph sounds like a train going by when you are sitting at a rail road crossing. It sounds like its making a knockin noise.Sometimes you can hear a chirping noise at low speeds.

Could have a tire separation problem. Can you feel it in the steering wheel or does it feel like it's in the rear?
If you feel it in the steering wheel it is on the front. Might have something in a tire or a tire separation. It's easy to spot it it is. Jack the car up and turn each wheel and watch the tread. If it gets slick in an area or the tread is thinner or looks like the tread line moves away from tread line. This can also be spotted on a tire spin balancer.
I would suggest getting them balanced on a spin balancer and be sure to tell them to look at the tires for a possible separation.
I may be a little over board but it doesn't hurt to check while it's there. Shouldn't cost anything and if they tell you there is one then ask to see it and to show you where it is. I would bet it's something alot more simple.........

 

[TK`S SHO]

Hey SHOdown,I feel this vibration in the gass pedal,steering wheel.Would that sound like what was described in the previou post? That was the first thing that I did, I had a bent rim on the front and had it rotated to the back. The tire that was moved to the front had a feathered edge. I understand what you`re saying but would that sound like metal knocking together?

 

[foshotime]

Dude i garauntee if you dont put black rtv on all of your gaskets (valve cover and tube seals) eventually they will leack oil. Take it from me who has perfomed the procedure on my 93 MTX. Better to be safe than sorry. and it wont harm anything.

Rich

 

[platoribs]

You do not want to use any sealant on the plug well seals. Don't ask me how I know....

With all due respect I've read this a couple of times and would like to know what adverse effect YOU experienced by applying RTV to the plug well seals.

This kind of statement is really annoying on a forum where information is shared for the benifit of others less knowledgable. :hpoop:

Please advise or if someone else knows what problem qiksho had please share so we can all learn from his mistake!

By the way I applied RTV on my plug well seals (lightly) because I don't have the kind of money to replace plug wires after less than 60K miles.

 

[qiksho]

With all due respect I've read this a couple of times and would like to know what adverse effect YOU experienced by applying RTV to the plug well seals.

This kind of statement is really annoying on a forum where information is shared for the benifit of others less knowledgable. :hpoop:

Please advise or if someone else knows what problem qiksho had please share so we can all learn from his mistake!

By the way I applied RTV on my plug well seals (lightly) because I don't have the kind of money to replace plug wires after less than 60K miles.

I applied rtv on the plug well seals on my 89 once upon a time, when I didn't have new seals to put in as a temporary fix. Well a few months later I get the seals and do the valve adjustment, here because of the nature of the seals it pushed the rtv out and I had it hanging over, which could if it comes off block oil passages. I also still had leaks in 2 plug wells. I only had it like this for a few months. I could see trying this with old hard seals, as a temporary fix, but there is no reason to do this with "new" seals that are not hard. I have not had any leaks on the last 3 top 60k's I have done with NO RTV on the plug well seals.


You DO have to put RTV on a few spots on the valve cover corners that go over the cam casting.

 

[HopefulSHO]

I've installed three sets of the Fel-Pro valve cover & plug well gaskets without using any RTV anywhere, with no leaks. Three years and 50k later, so far so good. I would not use it if you don't have to.

 

[jelloslug]

I would also advise against using RTV on the plug well and valve cover seals. I used it on the seals when I did a 60k my 3.0 that was in my '90, I applied it very sparingly on the seals to avoid too much spilling over the edges. When I changed the rod bearings about 30k miles later I found quiet a bit of RTV stuck to the inlet screen for the oil pump.

 

[foshotime]

Ok not to make any of you fell bad because we all have somthing in common. Explaine to me what is black RTV? Well i will tell you. RTV is a silicone based gasket maker. The black means it is for high temperature. Now exactly what are tube seals. they are GASKETS to keep oil from leacking in to the plug wells. All the RTV does is creats a seal to keep oil from leacking.

Now the reason for others saying they have applied it and still leacked is because 1. they did not thouroghly clean the surface of the valve cover, and engine block where the tube seals are fitted. 2. They did not apply it properly. Now, to apply it propperly do not run a string of rtv in a circle around the tube seal. You have to take the tube of RTV and bounce it up and down on the area you are applying it to, to make little tiny circles. The purpose of this is to create a kind of suction cup action. And make sure it is all the way around and on both sides of the tube seals. Also make sure you let the RTV dry for 24 hours before you drive the car again. If you follow these instructions exacly there will be no exese RTV and no oil leacks. Gauraunteed...

Also make sure you apply enough RTV on the valve cover gaskets in the same manner as the tube seals.


THANK YOU!!! I REST MY CASE!!!