I am new on here but have been doing some research about a Gen 2 for a little while and was always hoping to find one cheap to get for a daily driver. I found a 93 atx all original with 50k on it and don't know what I would be getting into. It's a very clean southern car with a nice body and paint and very clean interior. I can buy it for 3500 or maybe less. First thing is I keep reading about the 60k shim. Is that something that is automatic or some don't really need it? Is it very expensive or hard to do yourself? I don't have a lot of money and I always drive cheap cars to work. My logic was to find a Gen 2 that I can tell my wife is just a taurus and still have fun driving it to work and daycare. I also know a guy that has a 95 pretty modded that he would take 4500 for as it is or less taking off some of the mods. So my question is how important would it be to buy a all original one with 50k or one that has all the work done with extras but a lot more miles? I'm not going to race it or anything and it's going to be a daily driver. I was hoping that it would be pretty reliable and I can do some mechanic work myself too but I have to keep my wife off my case and can't be fixing things right away. Any opinions would be greatly appreciated. Only mods I would do to either or anything that I get right away would be to get my Dynaudio 3 ways installed into some kicks hopefully. That's the only way I can stand driving all my cheap cars is to have my stereo in them.
Need a little advice.
- Thread starter Aj1735
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Welcome to the community, AJ, good luck in your search 
Where are you located, are you in the "rust-free" zone or the salt belt ...
How many miles is a "lot more"? The key to success, especially with cars of this vintage, is going to be the maintenance that has been done over time. I don't expect everyone to match the mileage sdpatt has put on his SHO (400K+ & counting), but with proper maintenance of the whole vehicle, the SHO can last a good long time. So after test driving the vehicle, I would look for maintenance records, first thing. Normally, with an ATX, most major stuff is not due till 100,000 miles, but you have to remember, maintenance is time OR mileage.
Shims are rarely required if the car has been properly maintained. More likely you will have to replace the water pump, camshaft position sensor (CPS), crankshaft position sensor (CKS), and the timing tensioner first. Maybe the rod bearings later on, tho experience varies, and I'd grab a set or two to have handy. Also inspect closely for any leaks around the bottom of the engine bay. Inspect the struts & strut rods, they can be a PITA. Some of the suspension annoyances can be excised by using Gen 3 subframe/control arm parts. Alternators also go sometimes, inspect cabling between the alternator/starter/ground for corrosion. Expect to replace the battery.
Have you pored through these sites? There's a lot of good information on here that can make you savvier about your buy.
http://wikisho.com/wiki/Main_Page
http://web.archive.org/web/20110125052258/http://www.shophoenixproject.com/
Parts are also starting to becoming scarce, so look over the 60K/100K lists for an idea of what to gather & keep in your garage. A couple of vendors that are deeply involved with the SHO (gen I-III at least) community:
http://www.shosource.com
http://rcmautomotive.com
http://shonutperformance.com
"Regular" parts vendors (look for discounts on retailmenot.com) include:
http://www.rockauto.com
http://www.napaonline.com (esp. for lifetime warrantied alternators, for example)
http://www.oreillyauto.com
http://www.advanceautoparts.com
http://www.autozone.com
Events/updates on the SHO platform (not always up to date, but a good read) can also be found at:
http://www.shoclub.com
Where are you located, are you in the "rust-free" zone or the salt belt ...How many miles is a "lot more"? The key to success, especially with cars of this vintage, is going to be the maintenance that has been done over time. I don't expect everyone to match the mileage sdpatt has put on his SHO (400K+ & counting), but with proper maintenance of the whole vehicle, the SHO can last a good long time. So after test driving the vehicle, I would look for maintenance records, first thing. Normally, with an ATX, most major stuff is not due till 100,000 miles, but you have to remember, maintenance is time OR mileage.
Shims are rarely required if the car has been properly maintained. More likely you will have to replace the water pump, camshaft position sensor (CPS), crankshaft position sensor (CKS), and the timing tensioner first. Maybe the rod bearings later on, tho experience varies, and I'd grab a set or two to have handy. Also inspect closely for any leaks around the bottom of the engine bay. Inspect the struts & strut rods, they can be a PITA. Some of the suspension annoyances can be excised by using Gen 3 subframe/control arm parts. Alternators also go sometimes, inspect cabling between the alternator/starter/ground for corrosion. Expect to replace the battery.
Have you pored through these sites? There's a lot of good information on here that can make you savvier about your buy.
http://wikisho.com/wiki/Main_Page
http://web.archive.org/web/20110125052258/http://www.shophoenixproject.com/
Parts are also starting to becoming scarce, so look over the 60K/100K lists for an idea of what to gather & keep in your garage. A couple of vendors that are deeply involved with the SHO (gen I-III at least) community:
http://www.shosource.com
http://rcmautomotive.com
http://shonutperformance.com
"Regular" parts vendors (look for discounts on retailmenot.com) include:
http://www.rockauto.com
http://www.napaonline.com (esp. for lifetime warrantied alternators, for example)
http://www.oreillyauto.com
http://www.advanceautoparts.com
http://www.autozone.com
Events/updates on the SHO platform (not always up to date, but a good read) can also be found at:
http://www.shoclub.com
sperold
Last to Know
That mileage is hard to believe on a 22 year old car that has been continuoulsy plated and driven.
My input is that it is likely that the slightly modded car is going to be a better value than the all stock car. The 1st reason is that the all stock 93 atx likely has never had the 60k work done (vc gaskets, valves adjusted, water pump, timing belt, crank sensor, crank seal, cam seals, cam sensor) which will set you back around $400 if you do it yourself or around $1000 if you pay some mechanic to do it. There is a reasonable chance that the slightly modded car has had that done. The 2nd reason is that the stock 93 likely has factory struts, and original bushings all around the suspension. There is a reasonable chance that the slightly modded car has had at least some of this done. All of the suspension stuff will set you back at least $500 if you do it yourself, and at leat $1000 if you pay someone to do it. The 3rd reason is that the atx in the 93 was not really stout enough, and it is only a matter of time before it needs rebuilt, and it is unlikely that has already happened if the miles are accurate. That will be a $2000 bill.
The net of this is that if you cannot do the work on it yourself, you simply cannot justify buying the SHO for your "cheap" daily driver.
The net of this is that if you cannot do the work on it yourself, you simply cannot justify buying the SHO for your "cheap" daily driver.
thegreatbriguy
SHO Member
i was going to disagree but then I remembered about the trans. if its really 50k it might be ok to drive around but, yeah, it will die, and that is a lot of work to fix or expensive...
Well the stock car was a southern car that sounds like it just wasn't driven very much at all. It's in Michigan near where my mom lives now after he bought it i think from TX. I grew up there in Michigan but now live in Iowa. My mom went and drove it an said that it seemed to drive like it should but she's not a real fan. Lol. She likes trucks and never like cars to begin with. The guy has done a lot of normal maintenance but nothing major like any engine, tranny, or suspension work.
The local modded car is here in des Moines and is very clean. He has had probably 10 plus sho's and a few now. This one has lots of mods and told me that he would take them off to make it more drivable and cheaper. I trust that he knows enough to keep it going as it should. I would really like to have it as quick as possible but still easily drivable if that's possible. I will paste what he has texted me that it has had done to it. I think that it has been in storage for a lot of its life too.
94 is mtx. Has quaiffe limited slip. Headers, short shifter, under drive pulleys, tokicos, eibachs, Borla cat back, 96 front brakes, black interior (wasn't offered beyond 93). $4,500 with the 18" Enkie wheels, less with something else. And less if you don't want some mods. It ran a 15.1 at the SHO convention in Indianapolis in 2005. We port matched the big bore intake to the heads after that. And it really needs a tuner. I'll look for pics. Don't have recent. It hasn't been out for awhile.Forgot to note the fiberglass cowl hood. Also big bore butterflies and extrude honed intake runners. The headers are 1-3/4" and are really too big for a n.a. car, 1-1/2" would be better, so an aftermarket y pipe would solve that. And the short shifter, while working fine, is grumpy and stiff in daily driving. Thought I'd elaborate some. We'd take off the headers and cat back and install a used aftermarket (way better than stock) y pipe and exhaust. Take off $500. We'd put a stock shifter in, take off $200. We'd take off the 18's and put on some stock chrome wheels from a Gen 3 that have good Michelin all season tires, take off $500. We put in a 3.2 that we rebuilt in 2001. It has 40k miles on it. Uses a little oil like most of them do. Maybe a quart between oil changes. $3300 with the exhaust changed, the shifter changed and the chromies installed.
The local modded car is here in des Moines and is very clean. He has had probably 10 plus sho's and a few now. This one has lots of mods and told me that he would take them off to make it more drivable and cheaper. I trust that he knows enough to keep it going as it should. I would really like to have it as quick as possible but still easily drivable if that's possible. I will paste what he has texted me that it has had done to it. I think that it has been in storage for a lot of its life too.
94 is mtx. Has quaiffe limited slip. Headers, short shifter, under drive pulleys, tokicos, eibachs, Borla cat back, 96 front brakes, black interior (wasn't offered beyond 93). $4,500 with the 18" Enkie wheels, less with something else. And less if you don't want some mods. It ran a 15.1 at the SHO convention in Indianapolis in 2005. We port matched the big bore intake to the heads after that. And it really needs a tuner. I'll look for pics. Don't have recent. It hasn't been out for awhile.Forgot to note the fiberglass cowl hood. Also big bore butterflies and extrude honed intake runners. The headers are 1-3/4" and are really too big for a n.a. car, 1-1/2" would be better, so an aftermarket y pipe would solve that. And the short shifter, while working fine, is grumpy and stiff in daily driving. Thought I'd elaborate some. We'd take off the headers and cat back and install a used aftermarket (way better than stock) y pipe and exhaust. Take off $500. We'd put a stock shifter in, take off $200. We'd take off the 18's and put on some stock chrome wheels from a Gen 3 that have good Michelin all season tires, take off $500. We put in a 3.2 that we rebuilt in 2001. It has 40k miles on it. Uses a little oil like most of them do. Maybe a quart between oil changes. $3300 with the exhaust changed, the shifter changed and the chromies installed.
Now I am wondering about the modded one and how much of it would be worth taking off of it? What would be the best combination of mods from what is on it or that he has for parts laying around? Sounds like as much as it would be great to have a very low mileage stock car, one that has the work done would be a better way to go.
Here is a pic from the 2008 trip to the Seattle Convention.
Here is a pic from the 2008 trip to the Seattle Convention.
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sperold
Last to Know
Only you know if you would like a standard or automatic transmission. If your wife can drive a standard, then no issue at all between the two.
If you can confirm the mileage on that original one, you won't really need to do anything on it (if it is not leaking from every seal due to sitting, and all the brake sliders frozen solid).
Go for a spin in the modded one in your area and see if you like it as is. I am not a big fan of swapping things in and out, because you are not going to have the luxury of refusing the car if you don't likethe replacements for the mod deletions. Once you have gone that far, the deal is done.
Go for a spin in the original one as well.
In the price range you are looking, there are plenty of first class cars in the sale section of this forum, newer automatic cars with nice additions, and MTXs too.
No one is going to snatch either one of those cars out from under you, so take your time, and when you get closer to a decision, make a low offer, and see who bites.
When my 95 MTX was written-off (and in great condition with lots of mods), I got the princely sum of $2,200.00 in the settlement, and waiting a full year to settle did not raise the value...... so take it from there.
If you can confirm the mileage on that original one, you won't really need to do anything on it (if it is not leaking from every seal due to sitting, and all the brake sliders frozen solid).
Go for a spin in the modded one in your area and see if you like it as is. I am not a big fan of swapping things in and out, because you are not going to have the luxury of refusing the car if you don't likethe replacements for the mod deletions. Once you have gone that far, the deal is done.
Go for a spin in the original one as well.
In the price range you are looking, there are plenty of first class cars in the sale section of this forum, newer automatic cars with nice additions, and MTXs too.
No one is going to snatch either one of those cars out from under you, so take your time, and when you get closer to a decision, make a low offer, and see who bites.
When my 95 MTX was written-off (and in great condition with lots of mods), I got the princely sum of $2,200.00 in the settlement, and waiting a full year to settle did not raise the value...... so take it from there.
Mikey
SHO Member
Always get the mtx over the automatic. I've gotten 200,000 out of a stock mtx until I side stepped the clutch and snapped the subframe collar. I know I know I was younger. Replaced the subframe and ran it 279000. Ran like a beast when I junked it. Could not be inspected due to rot. IMHO these are bullet proof. Upkeep will yield more performance than bolt ons. If the guy had 10 SHO s buy from him. Good luck, these cars are an obscure piece of automobolia, and theyre great!
As long as body is good (rustfree/straight) and maintenance is upto date (no seals leaking either) so you don't have to do anything for a while, I think the $3,300 is a good price for the modded SHO. As I suggested before, get familiar with the info on the SHOPhoenix site so you have at least a book knowledge of what these cars/engines are about.
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luigisho
SHO Member
Your original post stated that you don't have a lot of money. I'm not sure that the maintenance is something you will enjoy on these cars.
How many miles are on the modded one and was all the maintenance done on it or how long it ago was it done. I would lean toward the modded one as well, but it depends if you want an ATX or MTX. My first SHO was an ATX (tranny got rebuilt at 90K), but have only bought MTX's since then
He said that the modded one has about 100k on the car and around 40k since motor was redone. He was telling me that it has never seen salt before and originally came from AZ. He knows his stuff and has lots of parts from previous cars and I think has 2 Gen 2 now and 4 Gen 3's. He is a pretty nice guy and I trust that when he says he can do whatever to mod or un mod one that it will be done right.
It's not that I'm broke, but it's more about my wife's perception. I can't buy a car that she will say that I don't need when I have a running 04 impala with 190k on it that will die at any point. If I buy one and I have to do a bunch of maintenance on it right away, I will never hear the end of it. She would then complain about me buying such an old piece of junk. I am 37 and would just like to enjoy my daily (hopefully cheap) driver. I can't afford maintenance on a M5 and can't afford a 90's impala ss just for a driver. I can't think of many other sedans that would be very fun to drive. Plus I am 6'4",so it's not real good for me in a small car and haul my 2 yr old and 4 yr old in it unless it's a full size car. The sho is border line small.
I think that I am forgetting about the stock one. He said that a bunch of the maintenance items have been done like brakes and tie rods but no engine or tranny anything. I think that I wouldbe bbetter off spending around 3 grand for the modded mtx vs 3500 for the stock atx. I really appreciate all the help and advice also. Everyone seems so nice and friendly on here.
Any other ideas or suggestions for me out there?
It's not that I'm broke, but it's more about my wife's perception. I can't buy a car that she will say that I don't need when I have a running 04 impala with 190k on it that will die at any point. If I buy one and I have to do a bunch of maintenance on it right away, I will never hear the end of it. She would then complain about me buying such an old piece of junk. I am 37 and would just like to enjoy my daily (hopefully cheap) driver. I can't afford maintenance on a M5 and can't afford a 90's impala ss just for a driver. I can't think of many other sedans that would be very fun to drive. Plus I am 6'4",so it's not real good for me in a small car and haul my 2 yr old and 4 yr old in it unless it's a full size car. The sho is border line small.
I think that I am forgetting about the stock one. He said that a bunch of the maintenance items have been done like brakes and tie rods but no engine or tranny anything. I think that I wouldbe bbetter off spending around 3 grand for the modded mtx vs 3500 for the stock atx. I really appreciate all the help and advice also. Everyone seems so nice and friendly on here.
Any other ideas or suggestions for me out there?
That mileage is not that high and if its been maintained, then the more reliable it should be as a daily driver. The one thing to consider using a SHO as a daily driver is to have a back up car in case something needs to be fixed so you won't be rushing around to get it done since you have another car. Would you be able to keep your current car as a backup? I've always had another SHO as a backup car. The nice thing about these cars is the insurance is low and for the price it is hard to match the power and gas mileage you get. This forum and the members have a lot of knowledge on fixing and trouble shooting these cars. If you are willing to fix the car yourself, then the SHO is not a bad car to use as a daily driver.
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I have a F350 crew cab dually also that I haul horses with and I can drive that anytime I need to. So I have another car and just want to enjoy whatever my daily driver would be. Always put my nice stereo in wwhatever I drive also so at least that usually makes it tolerable. Right now I have 3 way active Dynaudio speakers, 4 zapco c2k amps with a alpine 9965 and H701. I really like experimenting with the stereo and see how good I can get it set up.
I think that I am going to try and get through the bad weather with my impala hopefully and then try to buy the red mtx here locally in the spring. I know that he will work with me on what I want left installed on it and it sounds like it should be a pretty nice car to drive as long as it's maintained.
I think that I am going to try and get through the bad weather with my impala hopefully and then try to buy the red mtx here locally in the spring. I know that he will work with me on what I want left installed on it and it sounds like it should be a pretty nice car to drive as long as it's maintained.
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