Idler Pulley Question

[DougLee25]

OK, I have done a search on this and came up with a few things. My idler pulley, or so I believe, is the once that tightens up the belt for the AC and alternator, correct?? There is another one identical to it for the PS pump, also correct?? Well if so, I did a search to find the bearing and I came up with this part # NSK 35BD219T12VVCG33. I order that and I got this bearing that def. didn't look like it was correct. I pulled the pulley out today, and sure enough, that bearing is totally wrong. The number stamped on the pulley is part # NSK 35BD219DUK. What is the deal here? What bearing did I order? Please set the record straight! **** Thanks for your time!

Doug

 

[Off Road SHO]

Doug,

If the pulley puts tension on the belts and tightens them up, it's called a tensioner pulley.

If the pulley is not spring loaded and just rotates, it's called an idler pulley.

Tensioner pulley assemblies are vehicle specific as are the ones in our beloved SHOs. The pulley that rides on the assembly is just a pulley with a very good set of sealed bearings inside.

ANY idler pulley that has the right back set, almost correct diameter, and right size bolt hole in it will work for an idler pulley in our cars. All it has to do is provide a place for the smooth side of our belts to rub against, nothing more, nothing less.


Since you now have the pulley removed, take it to a friendly AZ or Checker Auto and match it up with any pulley the same size. Good Luck

Tom

 

[DougLee25]

Ok well what was the whole deal with the bearing numbers? What was that for?

Doug

 

[Bizzy]

Doug, I'm not sure what bearing you ordered, but the NSK number for the idler bearing should be BD20-15T12DDWACG3-01.

 

[SHOZ123]

Nachi NAC35BG05S10GST2F

NSK BD20-15DWA

NTN 35bd219-duk

 

[DougLee25]

The NSK bearing is discountinued till May. That shoots that idea. I guess I could try the other #'s Paul gave me. Seems the bearing places say there is no cross reference for it though?? Got me. I'll keep you all posted.

Edit: Paul didn't you say before that you could use a '99 SHO tensioner pulley?

Doug

<small>[ December 16, 2003, 10:28 AM: Message edited by: DougLee25 ]</small>

 

[K-Dawg]

Uggghhh... I've been trying to get something other than the whole new original pulley to work myself. So far no luck. A-hole parts guys that think they know everything suck too. rant

Post if you find something that works. I'm getting close to breaking down and spending the $110+.

 

[DougLee25]

SHOZ123:
Nachi NAC35BG05S10GST2F

NSK BD20-15DWA

NTN 35bd219-duk

Just to let you know the Nachi and NTN part #'s are wrong. The specs are like a 55mm od, 35mm id, & 20mm t. Those specs are identical to the first bearing I ordered which is also wrong. Still hitting dead ends as of now...

Maybe I'll just go hit up the lathe and make myself an aluminum pulley with a standard size bearing and be done with it?

Doug

 

[rangerj]

Doug,

You could press the bearing out of the pulley, then select a "standard" sized bearing that is closest to the NSK, but slightly larger in Outside diameter, and machine the pulley to "press" fit the new bearing.

If the inside diameter is within a few thousanths it will work on the stud (mount), which is not a press fit.

The down side to the above is the cost of the machine shop work at approximately $85 per hour, plus the cost of the new bearing at about $30.

You are looking at about $115 minimum with set-up time and the lathe work. If you are going to do this do both pulleys, as they both use the same bearing.

The NSK bearing used is a "proprietary" item that has not been "released" (by the manufacturer, Ford, or Yamaha?), and is not sold as a replacement part. Maybe it will be some day, but it isn't yet.

There are several "standard" sized bearings that are reasonably close, and are readily available from Bearings Inc., Timken, and BCA (Bearings Corporation of America). BCA and Bearings Inc. are distributors, Timken is a manufacturer.

Go to a bearing distributor and you will find a person who knows bearings. Thats what they sell! rangerj

 

[SHOZ123]

Sorry i'm just responding with what others have told me. I do know the Gen 3 idler pulley has the identical bearing in ti that the Gen 2 pulleys have. What Ford calls this bearing I don't know.

Here are some pics of the gen 2 and gen 3 pulleys.

http://www.superford.org/members/content.php?id=1647&sID=9259


Here's another number to look up that I have been told works. Nachi part #NAC35BG05S10GST2F

 

[rangerj]

SHOZ123,

I'm fairly certain he is referring to a Gen.I pulley and bearing set-up.

Doug,

I would be certain to mention to any bearing supplier that you want a bearing that can stand up to a 7,000 RPM engine. I do not know what that works out to for the bearing RPMs. Any Mechanical Engineering students want to calculate the bearing RPM. rangerj

 

[DougLee25]

rangerj:
Doug,

You could press the bearing out of the pulley, then select a "standard" sized bearing that is closest to the NSK, but slightly larger in Outside diameter, and machine the pulley to "press" fit the new bearing.

If the inside diameter is within a few thousanths it will work on the stud (mount), which is not a press fit.

The down side to the above is the cost of the machine shop work at approximately $85 per hour, plus the cost of the new bearing at about $30.

You are looking at about $115 minimum with set-up time and the lathe work. If you are going to do this do both pulleys, as they both use the same bearing.

The NSK bearing used is a "proprietary" item that has not been "released" (by the manufacturer, Ford, or Yamaha?), and is not sold as a replacement part. Maybe it will be some day, but it isn't yet.

There are several "standard" sized bearings that are reasonably close, and are readily available from Bearings Inc., Timken, and BCA (Bearings Corporation of America). BCA and Bearings Inc. are distributors, Timken is a manufacturer.

Go to a bearing distributor and you will find a person who knows bearings. Thats what they sell! rangerj

Rangerj,

I originally thought of this, but the pulley looked like hardened steel which is a bitch to machine on a lathe. Do you have any idea what bearing you ordered? If so, I will just order that and go that route. Thanks for your time.

Doug

 

[rangerj]

Doug,

I dug out my reciept from Bearings Inc. and all it says is "Timken bearing".

Keep in mind this was almost two years ago, but the following is what I remember.

I pressed out the bearing and went to Bearings Inc. with the bearing and the pulley. One of the sales reps first tried to find the specific bearing. He could not find it in the NSK bearing catalog so he called their U.S. Sales rep.

Thats how we found out it was a "proprietary" item, that is one that was made to order for a specific customer with a contractual restriction on the manufacture and sales.

By now the place had three people involved in trying to match the bearing. All three measured it with their micrometers, and re-measured it until they all agreed on the measurement.

By now it was getting to be a circus. Anyway the conclusion was to use a bearing that was slightly larger in the outside diameter, if I remember right it was about 8 or 9 thousanths, and an inside diameter that was within a few thousanths either way, and a width that was within a 64th of an inch either way.

They found a timken bearing that met the requirements.

I had a machine shop measure the bearing and determine how much had to be machined out of the pulley in order to have a "press" fit. The inside diameter was a few thousandths larger, but because the stud it mounts to is slightly tapered this does not matter.

The slightly larger width (a hair in the narrower of the two pulleys) does not matter either. It works. Bearings $30 each (2).

As for machining the pulley, I don't know if the machine shop had any problems. If they did they didn't say! $75 to machine both pulleys and press in the new bearings.

You could just buy the OEM items for $85 and $110.
rangerj

 

[DougLee25]

Rangerj,

The Timken bearings are a two piece design. Is this what you have?

Doug

Edit: Timken does not make ball bearings according to my rep?? Any clues now?

<small>[ December 19, 2003, 10:29 AM: Message edited by: DougLee25 ]</small>

 

[SHOZ123]

My original post back in the day about using the Gen 3 pulley was to press out the bearing and install it into your old pulley.

 

[rangerj]

Doug,

I know what I used was a 1 piece sealed bearing. I thought it was a Timken! shrug Like I said it was a couple of years ago. I would have gone out and looked at the bearing for a number, but the car is in "storage".

Anyways, SHOZ123 says that the Gen III pulley has the same bearing, that is the NSK BD 20 15DWA. SHOZ knows. At least look into the GenIII pulley/bearing.

If I remember right the GenIII pulley and bearing is about $30. I can't vouch for this because I have never done it. But, like I said, "SHOZ knows"!

Then it would be a matter of pressing out the GenIIIs bearing, and pressing it into your pulley. rangerj

 

[DougLee25]

Ok guys, thanks for all your help. I have one other guy that is looking into a bearing solution for me. If that falls through, either I am going with a Gen 3 pulley or I'm going to machine my own.

Doug

 

[K-Dawg]

Does anyone know the correct part number for the Gen III pulley? The one that has been posted dozens of times on the forum is not correct.

 

[DougLee25]

Torrie from Ford Parts Network said this # should work.... I believe she said there were three #'s though. Try this one F3DZ-6B217-B Genuine Ford serpentine belt idler pulley $ 68.99 ea. Let me know if that works.

Doug

 

[projectSHO89]

DougLee25:
Torrie from Ford Parts Network said this # should work.... I believe she said there were three #'s though. Try this one F3DZ-6B217-B Genuine Ford serpentine belt idler pulley $ 68.99 ea. Let me know if that works.

Doug

This is the correct number. It lists for around $85 at a regular Ford store.

Not a whole lot cheaper that the correct pulley with a new bearing. The difference is around $20, plus you still have to press the bearings in and out.

The $30 figure is for the tensioner pulley for the WP belt. It is incorrect for this application.

Steve