help... coolant flooding out... *now with pics*

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DavidT

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I got the pressure tester. As soon as I pumped her up, coolant started coming out pretty heavy. The leak is originating from above the lower radiator hose... about an inch or two towards the drivers side from the low. rad. hose, but higher up. Is the water pump the only other source in this area??? How do I tell for sure? (Water pump is only 5 mos old... it is from the list Scott provides for the 60K... remanufactured for around $40... I figured if its good enough for him, it has to be good enough for me) shrug

<small>[ February 02, 2003, 06:35 PM: Message edited by: dkautumna ]</small>
 

DavidT

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help me out guys... I am on jackstands right now. I don't want to start digging into the front end unless I KNOW I have too...
 

Rob94

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I'd guess that either 1)your lower hose clamp is not tight enough, 2)your water pump is not sealing to the block properly, or 3) your water pump is shot. Can't you see where it's coming from?
 

DavidT

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well its coming out pretty heavy and seeing how I am on my back on the floor of my garage... I am not sure... it is hard to get a good look up in there while a faucet of antifreeze is pouring out.
 

Xs SHO 1

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remove ur lower radiator hose and inspect it for holes/cracks. make sure u use some kind of pan to catch all the coolant that comes out....

<small>[ February 02, 2003, 01:21 AM: Message edited by: xssho1 ]</small>
 

DavidT

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I rechecked it. After running a pressure test and giving it a minute to subside, the coolant is gathering and dripping from the bolts on the corner of the oil pan.(about an inch away from the low. rad. hose)
 

Rob94

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That tells me coolant is running down your engine block. I think you are looking at a water pump. I'd remove your timing belt covers and get a good look at it.
 

projectSHO89

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Either your pump sprung a leak on the front seal (defective pump), the gasket at the split housing failed, the lower radiator hose/clamp failed, or one of the O-rings (either at the block or the trnsfer tube) has failed.

Easiest to replace is the lower radiator hose. You might want to try that before you pull the timing covers. NAPA 7311 IIRC. Once the covers are off you will be able to see if the leak is from the front of the pump, the block side, or the gasket.

No fun in any event.

Steve
 

DavidT

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thanks for the info. guys! I will probably tear into it after church today.
One thing I am confused on is that I am still told it could be the low. rad. hose (I only wish :( )How so? The source of the leak is from above the oil pan (at least I think it is)99% sure.
I am guessing if its not coming from the water pump, then how about the metal tube the low. rad. hose attaches to. Where does this "metal tube" originate at... behind the timing belt covers?

<small>[ February 02, 2003, 08:52 AM: Message edited by: dkautumna ]</small>
 

rangerj

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Dk,

Remove the top 2 timing belt covers. Refill your cooling system, and repressurize the system. You should have a clear enough view of the water pump and its connections, gasket surfaces, and weep hole, to determine where the leak is originating.

The lower radiator hose is connected to a metal tube that is connected to the water pump. The two surfaces are mated with a gasket. The water pump is sealed to the crossover tube with an "o" ring. The waterpump is mated to the block with a gasket.

Any one of these gaskets could have failed. If the water pump seal has failed the fluid will come out of the weep hole.

If you have to pull the pump, carefully check each and every bolt hole for stripped threads. This is especially true if the leak is coming from between the pump and the block, and there is no logical reason for the gasket to fail.

When (IF) you have to replace the pump or the gasket, be sure to torque the bolts as specified.
I have seen, and read on this forum, crossover tubes that have corroded and developed leaks.

While you have the system under pressure, look in the valley for signs of a leak eminating from the crossover pipe. The fluid would flow and run down the front of the engine block as if it were coming from the water pump.

Just as a reminder, catch the fluid in some sort of pan. Use some sort of filter if you reuse the coolant. I use the paint filters you get when you buy paint. However, an old pair of pantyhose your wife is going to dispose of also works as a good filter.

Even if you have to refill the system and pressurize it several times in order to determine the exact location of the leak, do that rather than guess. rangerj
 

DavidT

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19496084.jpg

Before I remove the middle timing belt cover, why is there a tube at the top of the water pump? Is that a port or something, or should there be a hose there? Also the 2 spots of antifreeze don't appear to do anything when I build up pressure. Any thoughts on this?
 

DavidT

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:mad:
I have to remove the timing belt, even if I am going with a remanufactured water pump?????
This, of course is assuming it is my h2o pump.
*fingers crossed* hoping its not...
if so, do I need a harmonic balancer pulley remover? (Thank God for Autozone) thumbs_u

P.S.
if it is my water pump... when we replaced it 5 mos. ago, we did not use the felpro gasket set. All we used is what came in the box from rockauto.com (A1 Cardone 571373). And I really can't remember if it came with a gasket or not... duh, I'm sure it did...BUT, Is this my problem?

<small>[ February 02, 2003, 08:08 PM: Message edited by: dkautumna ]</small>
 

SLOSHO89

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Whenever you change a water pump it is much easyer to take off the timming belt.

There are four seals on the water pump. There is an "O" ring between the H2O housing and the block. There is also an "O" ring on that metal tube that goes across the top of the motor ("O" ring at each end). Then there is a seal between the two halves of the water pump (where the green stuff is in your picture). The other seal is the one between the pump housing and the tube that goes to the lower radiator hose.

I think fel-pro makes a water pump gasket kit that has most/all of the seals.

I hope this helps you out.

Efren
 

Blast7

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You don't have to remove the timing belt but it is a good idea. I never removed mine on my black SHO when I replaced the waterpump. However, coolant did spill onto the belt and it isn't necessarily a good thing.
 

LI_SHO

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Ill second what blast7 said.
I replaced my waterpump w/o taking off timing belt...and i only took off the top timing belt cover.
 

Diameg

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I'm just throwing this in to the *** to see about any opinions.
Keep in mind that I have NOT taken apart that part of the engine, so I am merely speculating based on no experience or first hand knowledge.

Would it be plausible for those that want to replace their waterpump and NOT remove their timing belt to just get a whole bunch of plastic and tape in there to cover as much of it up as possible? I know, given it's location, that would be difficult to do, but is that a viable (but less desired) option?

For what it's worth, when I replace my waterpump, I'll be doing the timing belt as well anyways, but I was just wondering if anyone has experimented with a way to change the WP but spent the time and effort to cover up the belt as best as possible given the tight quarters?

Just curious.
 

DavidT

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doh! I'm an idiot, there is no opening on top of the water pump... :rolleyes:
I am having a time getting the middle timing belt cover off.
1.Will it come off with the lower TB cover still on?
I just want to get it off to be able to see the whole WP when I build up pressure again. I'm still not 100% sure where the leak is coming from.
Also, one last question (for now),
2.Is the lower radiator hose towards the front of the oil pan or the back? I think I have spotted similar hoses in each place... unless I am losing my mind :D
 

projectSHO89

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Here's the sequence (condensed) per the Helms for the replacement of the WP on the 89:

1. Drain
2. Disc Batt
3. Remove battery and tray
4. Remove belts
5. Remove AC/Alt idler pulley and bracket
6. Disc DIS and Ground
7/8. Remove U intake crossover tube
9. Remove RH tire/wheel
10. Remove Fenderwell liner
11. Remove U TB cover
12. Remove Crank pulley
13. Remove L TB cover
14 Remove Center TB cover bolts and position out of way
15. Remove WP bolts
16. Remove WP


Steve
 

rangerj

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DK,

If you have not yet removed the timing belt; 1. if you decide that you need to do that, first set the engine up in the timing position, that is line up the cams and the crankshaft at TDC,

2. if the pulley is not in your way why pull it, loosen the belt tensioner and remove the belt from the cam sprockets. It is important that the crankshaft and cams be in the proper position AND not be moved during the pump replacement,

3. the green spots in the picture are definetly signs of a leak, make sure the mating surfaces are clean and not scrached or gouged by the gasket scraper or such. I like to use a "widget" razer scraper on soft metals like aluminum, and finish with a Three M scuff pad (it is a nylon like sanding pad).

4. Permatex "Copper Spray-A-Gasket Hi-Temp Adhesive Sealant" helps to hold the gasket in place AND helps seal. Spray both sides of the gaskets. Spray them on a piece of wax paper, one side at a time, and let them get tacky before spraying the other side. Auto Zone should have it (any auto parts store). Do not use silicone sealers between machine fit surfaces.

5. Use a little spit to lubricate the "O" rings to help them slide into place. A little spit on the rubber helps them with the insertion. (OK who snickered?)

Carefully examine the water pump for signs of leaks. If your leak is between the mating surfaces, was a gasket kinked or torn, was there a nick in one of the surfaces, or did you not replace all of the seals and an old seal failed after the new pump was installed??

6. After the pump is removed thread the bolts into the holes by hand. Make sure the threads feel OK. Are there any signs of stripped threads, such as metal chips on the threads, or in or around the holes. (Did the leak occur because of a loose bolt?)

7. When installing the pump you can tie the gasket in place using thin thread through the bolt holes. Get all of the bolts started, but leave them loose enough to see all around the gasket surface.

Is the gasket where it shoud be? If yes, cut and remove the thread and run the bolts down until they bottom. Tighten the bolts and torque them to specification.

Start your torque in the middle and work your way out to the edges. For example, top middle, bottom middle, top one over to the right of middle, bottom one over to the left of middle, top left of middle, bottom right of middle, etc, Work your way out until all the bolts are torqued to spec.

Check to see if your pump has a specific torque pattern. If not, do it the way I suggested. That way you do not warp the pump when you torque it down. Check your reference source to see if any of the bolts require a sealent on the threads.

I do not remember if the SHO has such a requirement, but I do know that the other 3 liter V-6 does have one or two bolts that require sealant. Anybody?

Take your time, be patient and deliberate. If anything else comes to mind I'll throw it out to you. Hope this helps, rangerj
 

LI_SHO

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Diameg:
I'm just throwing this in to the *** to see about any opinions.
Keep in mind that I have NOT taken apart that part of the engine, so I am merely speculating based on no experience or first hand knowledge.

Would it be plausible for those that want to replace their waterpump and NOT remove their timing belt to just get a whole bunch of plastic and tape in there to cover as much of it up as possible? I know, given it's location, that would be difficult to do, but is that a viable (but less desired) option?

For what it's worth, when I replace my waterpump, I'll be doing the timing belt as well anyways, but I was just wondering if anyone has experimented with a way to change the WP but spent the time and effort to cover up the belt as best as possible given the tight quarters?

Just curious.
that was my goal when i did my wp...unfortunately there is NO way to prevent coolant from getting where you dont want it... =)
 

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