Considering V8 SHO

[avatar28]

My current 95 has a LOT of issues, including randomly stalling and not starting (I suspect crankshaft sensor). Yesterday I was driving and found someone selling a Gen3. They're asking $1500 as is. I think it's probably too much. The car has 154,000 miles. No maintenance records at all. It sounds like there is an exhaust leak or two and possibly a muffler delete. Radio doesn't come on. I'd almost certainly replace it anyways so that's probably not a huge deal. I have no idea if the cams have been welded or not. Is there an easy way to tell that wouldn't involve trying to take apart the engine in the parking lot? It sounds like it ran okay other than the exhaust issues I mentioned. I'm going to try to go by later today with my Bluetooth OBD reader and see what Torque has to show me about it.

Honestly, if I can get 6 months to a year out of it for $1000 I feel that I won't have done that badly. I would like to get something much newer and more reliable but I'm not in a financial position to do so right now.

 

[stephen newberg]

If the cam sprockets are welded the only other normal weak point is the transmission if previous owners have pretended it is a stop light racer. You need to pull a valve cover to look for the welds, no other real way to tell. For the transmission you are looking for clean shifting without hesitation through all the gears when in drive and downshifts without problems when done manually. If both of those things pan out, likely the car is fine for a good long while and you would only need to clear up whatever the exhaust issue is to get way more than just a year out of it. Aside from those two things, these drive trains run pretty much forever.

pax, smn

 

[sperold]

Most likely the cams are not welded as there is bound to be a record of that expense if it happened (at least an **** declaration).
The transmission will need a drain and refill of fluid at the very least.
Exhaust system renewals are never cheap and easy, especially if the original system has been changed.
Do you have emission testing and safety inspections to contend with?

It might be easier to put the crank sensor in the car you have.

The Gen3 would be a worthwhile purchase if you can get it cheap enough, and you have the patience to do the work it will need.
I think it would be easy to add $500.00 to whatever purchase price you can swing if you are careful with your parts sources, and it would be easy to exceed that.

But it would be worth it if you like the car.

 

[luigisho]

Drive it to check the tranny. You already know about the cams. Pull the codes after you get it warmed up and driven a bit. My Gen3 was way more reliable than the the 1's &2's I've owned. That being said it at that mileage where stuff will need attention from time to time.

If you can find a local muffler or off road shop they can (if they choose) splice in exhaust piping to fix leaks-- as opposed to a big dollar bolt in cat back or whatnot.

 

[avatar28]

Okay, I went by and spent a few more minutes looking at it. I'm still very much on the fence. I didn't take it for a drive due to time constraints. I pulled the codes with torque however: P0135, P0141, P0155, P0161, P1451 & P1518.

The first four are the four oxygen sensors, either an open or short circuit. Seems odd that all four would be dead, no? It sort of makes me wonder if they're present at all. If they were pulled, it would explain the exhaust leak sound I'm hearing. P1451 is the evap canister vent solenoid. No idea where to even begin on that one. And the last is a stuck open intake manifold runner (which I understand is more or less expected at this point?).

 

[avatar28]

Most likely the cams are not welded as there is bound to be a record of that expense if it happened (at least an **** declaration).
The transmission will need a drain and refill of fluid at the very least.
Exhaust system renewals are never cheap and easy, especially if the original system has been changed.
Do you have emission testing and safety inspections to contend with?

It might be easier to put the crank sensor in the car you have.

The Gen3 would be a worthwhile purchase if you can get it cheap enough, and you have the patience to do the work it will need.
I think it would be easy to add $500.00 to whatever purchase price you can swing if you are careful with your parts sources, and it would be easy to exceed that.

But it would be worth it if you like the car.

The car came through an auction. As I understand, it was part of a lot of cars but this one was too old for the lot. Hence no idea about the cams. There are are zero maintenance records in the glove box.
I'm expecting that I would want to change oil, transmission and coolant to be safe actually but that makes sense.
We do have emissions but no safety checks. And, worst case, my parents live in the next county over and they don't have emissions so I can register there if it came down to it.

Very possibly the crank would be easier but that doesn't address all the other issues (like it's 120k past due for a front 60k, it needs oxygen sensors, new suspension bushings all around, probably a new suspension (I can't even align it properly), camshaft seals, decarboning (EGR code) and I'm sure a slew of other things. Ideally I would keep both cars and have the time to get my 95 fixed without the time crunch and be able to give it to my son eventually.

 

[luigisho]

Did you get to drive it? At my age I would probably walk from it. I bought a bunch of SHO's that I really wanted when I was younger and drove my wallet into the ground. Why not get an econobox to tool around in and save the wrenching for the 95

 

[rubydist]

I would run away from that thing.

 

[avatar28]

I think I've about decided to give this one a by. I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I might have to get out of the SHO game altogether. I feel like I'm just throwing good money after bad on my 95, I can't afford a 5th gen right now and it doesn't sound like the V-8 SHOs are well liked at all. My boss has an 03 Civic he's offered me for $1500. It would be a nice, safe, reliable, boring car. *shudder*

 

[rubydist]

what do you mean boring - it has 98 horsepower!

 

[stephen newberg]

Oh, the Gen IIIs are well liked by those that have them, but like any car they have a few things that must be attended to, plus, at this point, the youngest one is 20 years old, so other things will have accumulated over time. Thus, like any older car, they will need care and attention to bring up to ***** if they have not been kept at a high standard for 2 decades or more by their previous owners.

The problem is that with a small amount of funds it can be hard to find a fun older car, as the fun ones tend to have been used harder. So, you can keep looking for a better value Gen III or try something completely different. Whichever way you go, best wishes to you, and if you do end up with a Gen III, everyone here will be happy to hear all about it.

pax, smn

 

[sperold]

You will put up with a lot if you like the car.
If you don't like the car, you will not tolerate anything.

Get something you like, even if it doesn't make a lot of sense at the time.
The Gen3 is a great car when the maintenance is complete, just get one cheap enough that you can afford the maintenance.

 

[luigisho]

Go boring for a cheap car with tons of available parts. I love the GenIII but it is now at an age where some attention will be needed and parts may or may not be easy to come by. I think if you have any of the GenI-III SHOs you should have a backup available. Even if it's just a significant other with a vehicle to get you around when needed. Been there done that.

I now have a '14 F150 in addition to my low mile '93 SHO. First real (over $200/month 60 month) vehicle financing ever and I ain't no spring chicken. Just too busy to wrench on daily drivers and bum rides anymore.

 

[stephen newberg]

I think that makes a lot of sense. I used the Gen III as a daily driver until 2012, but at that point it was getting to be a concern from a daily use standpoint for the sorts of reasons just noted. And that was having a 2005 Jimmy around to use for half of everything anyway. As a sole car, its really past its time in that roll and is more than should be expected of it.

pax, smn

 

[avatar28]

Well, I'm back to considering it again. I decided that I had been driving cars of convenience long enough and I should get something I really wanted and that was newish. I had found one that I really liked, a 2013 Escape with the 2.0L Ecoboost and all the options. My girlfriend convinced me that I'm really going to struggle with the payment (about $450/mo) and that I really should get a few things paid off first and she would help make room in our budget to get the one I want. So I'm back to looking for a cheap car and I can't stop thinking about this one. I only need it to last at least a year or so.

The last time I looked at it I took my BT OBD reader. It was throwing codes for all four O2 sensors, the intake runner stuck open (I think open) and the evap solenoid. I noticed when it was running that it sounds like there are multiple exhaust leaks. I'd have to look to confirm but I suspect that someone removed all four sensors for whatever reason. It DOES sound pretty though. I love that V-8 rumble.

 

[stephen newberg]

When in good shape, cams welded, and transmission not abused, this car can be very low cost and trouble free for really long periods of time. However the one you are talking about does not seem to fit that bill. As a result, it could easily be very expensive to keep going and, if the cams have not been attended to, is very possibly not going to run for a year. From the sounds of what you need to have in transportation, I am not at all sure this particular Gen III is going to make you a happy camper. Might be a lot safer, and less agonizing and expensive, to try a different one for a beater.

pax, smn

 

[luigisho]

For me the hardest lesson I've learned, in cars and life in general, is when to walk away from something I really want. It's easy to spot trouble and easy to justify getting something that needs some work. I would look for a well cared for car and travel to get it. Let the previous owner replace the suspension, weld the cams, etc. Old cars at auction are a crap shoot in the best of circumstances and usually have more than one expensive repair issue.

 

[NebraskaSHO]

Run from that car. The Gen III will be expensive to repair no matter goes wrong with it. The best bet if you are interested, is to save, and find one in better condition. Plus the oldest one is now 21 years old, and the newest is 18.

MY .02.

I have an 05 F150 FX4 with 87k miles. I love that is cheap-ish to repair, common, and has given me 4 years without much trouble (4wd vacuum hub & sticking parking brake). The Escape would be a smart choice. About the same size as my wife's 14 Cherokee Latitude.

 

[avatar28]

Well, I've ordered about $140 worth of parts for my current SHO. Still have a couple more things to get but I guess I will be sticking with it a few more months at least anyways.