Gen 4 SHO Tested

[PonySHO]

I remember seeing a TV show a few weeks back, called SPEED Test Drive - 6 vs 8 Showdown at Loveland Pass - They compared the Lincoln MKS (I think, it's the one with the Eco Boost, higher end model) against V8 BMW, Mercedes, Audi, and a Masarati Quadaporte.

Here's the link to the Lincoln website for multiple segments of this competition:
http://www.6versus8.com/showdown/intro/index.html
Here's another link for The Auto Writer commenting on it:
http://thearticlewriter.com/autowriter/can-the-lincoln-mks-really-compete/

I'll ruin the ending and say the MKS came in 2nd, just barely behind the the Beemer. The test was done by Automobile and Motor Trend magazines, but there is some suggestion of bias since turbochargers have the advantage at altitude. Nontheless, the MKS was admirable given the competition. The second link suggest a more level playing field at perhaps the Nürburgring... I won't say more

 

[joesho_gb]

Pony
Thanks! I knew was I wasn't loosing my mind LOL

Think how cool it would be if they re-ran the tests with the SHO. Think it would change the standings at all?

 

[PonySHO]

Pony
Thanks! I knew was I wasn't loosing my mind LOL

Think how cool it would be if they re-ran the tests with the SHO. Think it would change the standings at all?

It would be interesting to see how the SHO would do. IIRC, it's got a little bit more horsepower, I don't know if there are significant suspension differences. I would like to see it at Nürburgring... check out the track:

Expectations would probably be much lower given SHO's fat ass, there are some pretty wicked turns. The competition it is up against is much better suited.

 

[RonPorter]

I agree that a RWD with this motor & setup would be an awesome car. In the 4 door rocket class, Chrysler has the 300 (C & SRT8), Ex-Pontiac had the G8, BMW has the M Series, and Mercedes has the AMG line. The SHO line for Ford would be cool as a Performance based family hauler.

But, I don't see Ford going that route, at least not with RWD performance cars. Excluding the Truck/SUV/Van line, Other than the Mustang, the only other RWD setup that Ford has (that is available State Side, and that I can think of) is the Crown Vic/Merc; which is well past it's prime.
Both the Mustang and Crown Vic use a Live Axle setup. To be competitive in the field, they would need to design a new independent setup, new chassis to handle the drive train, which is considerable $$$. Sure, the Mustang could use the rear setup to help offset the cost, but I think the "bean counters" wouldn't want a 4-door car to out perform their flagship Mustang.

So I guess right now, it's just a pipe dream.

The "bean counters" could care less if a 4-door sedan beats the Mustang, it's whatever sells. The '89 SHO was quicker than most '89 GT 5.0s.

AWD is the future of performance cars. Lambo already offers it on most models, and BMW and MB are slowly expanding ti across their models. Ford took a great step forward here with an AWD SHO. To make a RWD SHO would be a huge step backward.

Cars are not priced for what they cost to build, they are priced against their market slot. All this BS about a SHO with RWD only and less options will never happen. And if they would even consider it, the cost wouldn't be less. Look at the cost of a loaded SLO. You can get one priced up into SHO territory.

 

[RonPorter]

I remember seeing a TV show a few weeks back, called SPEED Test Drive - 6 vs 8 Showdown at Loveland Pass - They compared the Lincoln MKS (I think, it's the one with the Eco Boost, higher end model) against V8 BMW, Mercedes, Audi, and a Masarati Quadaporte.

If memory serves me right, The Eco Boost came in second, on mostly an uphill run.

It was good to see Ford show up well in that "test", but it was bogus as ****. Lessee, running a turbo car against n/a cars at high altitude. Why not just deflate the tires on the n/a cars while you're at it??

 

[RonPorter]

It would be interesting to see how the SHO would do. IIRC, it's got a little bit more horsepower, I don't know if there are significant suspension differences. I would like to see it at Nürburgring... check out the track:

Expectations would probably be much lower given SHO's fat ass, there are some pretty wicked turns. The competition it is up against is much better suited.

They would have to slip in some non-std brakes, or at least brake pads. As Kirk has found, for most spirited driving the 12s brakes are fine, but lean on them and they don't cut it. Remeber when they ran the CTS-V at the "Ring, it already has Brembos from the factory.

 

[joesho_gb]

It was good to see Ford show up well in that "test", but it was bogus as ****. Lessee, running a turbo car against n/a cars at high altitude. Why not just deflate the tires on the n/a cars while you're at it??

Never said that it was 100% level playing field. Yes, the higher altitude helped the FoMoCo car place as well as it did, but it was still an impressive show.

They would have to slip in some non-std brakes, or at least brake pads. As Kirk has found, for most spirited driving the 12s brakes are fine, but lean on them and they don't cut it. Remeber when they ran the CTS-V at the "Ring, it already has Brembos from the factory.

I think the brakes should be upgraded with the Performance Package being added to the car.
Obviously, if you choose that package, you want to be driving it a little harder than normal. If not, then make it an option that can be added on separately.

The Ring would be a great idea, but I can just imagine watching the results, and seeing the AWD being overwhelmed by the weight shift in some corners, kicking the rear way out. Although watching the 19's start smoking would be cool to see, watching the driver recover would be something to see.

 

[roadhammer]

The only people who should be able to comment on the car are people who can AFFORD one, and have Driven one.

 

[roadhammer]

BTW, I sold my 06 s500 amg sport and purchased a tuxedo black, 402a, loaded 2010 SHO. The car does just about everything perfectly, if I want a track car I can take my supercharged 700hp mustang cobra.

 

[OSU 4 SHO]

Go test drive any NEW 2010 car, and please name any one of them that sounds, drives and behaves like a 20 year old SHO. You wont, because cars are exponentially better now.

Everyone else stated everything else.

 

[mkaresh]

They would have to slip in some non-std brakes, or at least brake pads. As Kirk has found, for most spirited driving the 12s brakes are fine, but lean on them and they don't cut it. Remeber when they ran the CTS-V at the "Ring, it already has Brembos from the factory.

Others have also noted that the stock brakes are not remotely suitable for track use. The SHO simply isn't meant to be tracked.

 

[RonPorter]

Others have also noted that the stock brakes are not remotely suitable for track use. The SHO simply isn't meant to be tracked.

Not true on either count. SHOs are finme at the track. Granted, some tweaks make them better, but still fine.

The brakes should be fine for track days with a stock car. Sure, the pads probably start going away near the end of a session, but that's the way every set of stock brakes on any SHO has been.

Folks who are new to track use, or stay stock and in the midrange run groups, will probably do fine with the stock brakes with some better pads (again, just like every SHO ever built). For the rest of us who lean on them harder with more susp[ension/tire upgrades, more is always needed.

Having been on the 911 lists for years, and having one of the guys that ran track events for years, it is pretty safe to say that about the only car with adequate brakes right off the street are 911s. He found that everything else needed better brakes, especially Corvettes. Vipers and BMWs were OK, but could be improved.

Mfrs just don't set up for track use unless you are buying the high $$$ car like a 911 GT2 or GT3, or a BMW Lightweight.

 

[drivinhard]

there are very, very few cars you could take off the showroom and go run full out 10/10ths on a track and not have friction, or fluid temp issues. And the ones that could, nobody on here could remotely afford.

And the ones that you can afford that you SAY hold up, you ain't drivinhard enough

I'm still waiting on kirk to let me test his. Hey kirk, free NASA SE weekend promo going on. The new NCCAR track in NC looks interesting enough...

http://nasa-se.com/1steventfree.php

 

[mkaresh]

Must say I'm getting my info second hand, from Jack Baruth. One of his reviews:

http://www.speedsportlife.com/2009/...s-sho-the-return-of-the-great-american-sedan/

Relevant bit:

"The brakes are miserable. Let’s restate that, just so nobody misses it. The brakes on the SHO are in no way up to the task. It’s not just they aren’t track-worthy. They aren’t even ready for a fast road. This is a thirteen-second car with the same kind of brake hardware one might find on a Camry, and the mismatch is egregious. There is a “Performance Pack” coming with better brake pads, but what this car needs is the Brembos from the Shelby GT500, stat."

Notably, Baruth also criticizes the brakes in the 335i, and fried the brakes in his personal S4 in the Cadillac's CTS-V challenge, and so ended up participating with one of the Cadillacs. He didn't fry the brakes in the Cadillac.

He is clearly very ******* brakes.

 

[RonPorter]

Must say I'm getting my info second hand, from Jack Baruth. One of his reviews:

http://www.speedsportlife.com/2009/...s-sho-the-return-of-the-great-american-sedan/

Relevant bit:

"The brakes are miserable. Let’s restate that, just so nobody misses it. The brakes on the SHO are in no way up to the task. It’s not just they aren’t track-worthy. They aren’t even ready for a fast road. This is a thirteen-second car with the same kind of brake hardware one might find on a Camry, and the mismatch is egregious. There is a “Performance Pack” coming with better brake pads, but what this car needs is the Brembos from the Shelby GT500, stat."

Notably, Baruth also criticizes the brakes in the 335i, and fried the brakes in his personal S4 in the Cadillac's CTS-V challenge, and so ended up participating with one of the Cadillacs. He didn't fry the brakes in the Cadillac.

He is clearly very ******* brakes.

So he's a former BMX guy, eh?

Me thinks he dooesn't brake properly. He could probably fry brakes in anything.

He probably kills clutchs quickly, also. Gotta learn to quit riding the pedals.

 

[DDakRT]

Never said that it was 100% level playing field. Yes, the higher altitude helped the FoMoCo car place as well as it did, but it was still an impressive show.

It was "impressive" because it was set up to be, they can't have an expensive Ford/Lincoln commercial with their own car finishing last now can we?

 

[PonySHO]

The brakes should be fine for track days with a stock car. Sure, the pads probably start going away near the end of a session, but that's the way every set of stock brakes on any SHO has been.

The first time I took my R out to the track, it had 1100 miles on it. At 1200 miles, the stock pads were toast. Even performance level pads for the track won't last a real long time. The problem is proper cooling. Without it, the rotors overheat and you get heat cracks and your brake fluid boils... then your brake pedal goes to the floor and that's scary.

 

[thepawn]

At this weight, it will be like my truck, probably one lap and its done.

I swapped out for 14" brembo GT's on my Lightning and they've been fantastic. For those who want to race it, I'm sure you'll see aftermarket kits popping up.

 

[1slickRED89]

That's what I mean. I've driven the Fusion Sport, and although I liked the Chassis and other aspects, I thought the motor was a letdown.

But, Fusion Sport + 3.5L EcoBoost = driving from the back seat when you floor it! That's what I want(ed) to see with the SHO.

I just looked at the Fusion sport, and found out it has AWD available. that would be an awesome car. $385 will put factory racing stripes on it too.

I think pretty highly of the the 3.5L duratech. its a tough motor. I think it sounds good too, it has a snarl to it. I'm sure it could make 300 HP N/A with a few grand invested.

the 3.5L fusion sport gets 27 highway, which is two ticks better than the SHO.

Ford has quite a few hot cars out there right now...

 

[LotusDriver]

Having been on the 911 lists for years, and having one of the guys that ran track events for years, it is pretty safe to say that about the only car with adequate brakes right off the street are 911s. He found that everything else needed better brakes, especially Corvettes. Vipers and BMWs were OK, but could be improved.

Mfrs just don't set up for track use unless you are buying the high $$$ car like a 911 GT2 or GT3, or a BMW Lightweight.

I'm not so sure about that. For the price of that 911 you can purchase two streetable Lotus Elises or Exgies that would out-brake, out-corner and out-time the 911 on a track. And just about everything else in any price range.