need serous stopping power

[SeanMc]

yes, but that doesn't mean anything. The point of the 11.6 rear upgrade is to move the caliper out more. In doing this it creates more braking force by giving the stock caliper more leverage basically. For instance, take a small ratchet and try to loosen a bolt, then take a large breaker bar and loosen that same bolt(at the same torque). The larger bar will work in the same way as the larger rotor on the rear end. Basically the same amount of force will be found at the caliper, but it will create more stopping power with the larger rotor.

I did notice my braking was much flatter.

 

[jedhead]

I need more brakes too. But i do like my PBRs and want to be able to use the slicers. If I get some 13 x 1.0 (or are they 1.1) and have them cut down to like 12.4 or 12.5 would they clear the slicers? I guess i am asking what is the largest rotor I can run with the PBRs under the slicers?

My custom 12.5" TCE/Baer Racing set up fits under slicers with some grinding on the caliper. Keep in mind that the Bear Racing set up uses corvette rotors that sit further towards the hub than the standard Cobra setup. This deeper offset allows clearence for the slicers and also puts the unsprung weigh inboard for better handling. I think I have the best of both worlds with the lightwieght of the Wilwood set up with the more maintanance friendly floating PBR calipers.
I made 4 back to back stops from 100mph to 40mph while I was bedding the FPCM Z rated pads. I experienced no fade.

Bob

 

[somedude_001]

well part of the problem with teh car now, is that the front brakes blow sparks will brake-spooling the turbo during roll races

yes, i said that right, they blow SPARKS

so while the current brake setup might be fine for alex on a road course with better use of the brake .... roll races are still going to destroy them because theres only one way to apply the brakes and peg the gas while maintaining a 40 roll

I would make it 2 or 3 laps at gingerman or 3 laps at toronto motorsports park, and these would be overheated for sure. i'll give the 13"s a try and see how that goes.

what was the deal with the corvett calapers? don't they use a taller pad on a 13" rotor or was this something different that I was thinking of?

oh and the comment on my driving style. I am very ******* my brakes but I try to be off of them as much as possible at the track then I stand on them to slow, maybe I should change my style a bit. I don't have a lot of track exp yet.

 

[ACV1081]

12.5" corvette/baers here... the slicers rub ever so slightly on the inner part of the wheels, but a few passes down the 1/4 with my drag radials remedied that This is one **** of a setup, and with bias plugs on my stock vented rears I can slow down in a hurry. When I autocrossed for the first time people were commenting on how well my car braked and didn't break loose with the kumho mxs. Most of my times sucked, but that was operator caused



Good luck with the choosing... I should add though the corvette rotors are HEAVY.

 

[jedhead]

12.5" corvette/baers here... the slicers rub ever so slightly on the inner part of the wheels, but a few passes down the 1/4 with my drag radials remedied that This is one **** of a setup, and with bias plugs on my stock vented rears I can slow down in a hurry. When I autocrossed for the first time people were commenting on how well my car braked and didn't break loose with the kumho mxs. Most of my times sucked, but that was operator caused



Good luck with the choosing... I should add though the corvette rotors are HEAVY.

Buy a set of Todd's 12.5" 2 piece rotors. They weigh one pound more than stock 10.2" rotors.

Bob

 

[ACV1081]

Buy a set of Todd's 12.5" 2 piece rotors. They weigh one pound more than stock 10.2" rotors.

Bob

May someone please save me the trouble of shooting me a price on those badboys?

 

[Shoaz]

May someone please save me the trouble of shooting me a price on those badboys?

Expensive, but call Todd (TCE) to get a quote.

Ya gotta pay to play. This is a case in point.

 

[ACV1081]

Expensive, but call Todd (TCE) to get a quote.

Ya gotta pay to play. This is a case in point.

Oh I've paid plenty... just finding that I don't want to play as hard as before when it comes to the SHO Seems my modding occurs more regularly @ Lowes than car sites as in years past.

 

[jedhead]

Todd has a thread with the rotors for sale here:
http://www.shoforum.com/showthread.php?t=69008

Better price than what I paid for mine.

Bob

 

[ACV1081]

Todd has a thread with the rotors for sale here:
http://www.shoforum.com/showthread.php?t=69008

Better price than what I paid for mine.

Bob

Thanks Bob... that's what I was hoping for

 

[drivinhard]

Coupla thoughts on brakes from some past experience. Were I building a track car, I'd work backwards this time around. Ie, start with your tire/wheel package first (keeping in mind the brakes you plan to run, and future upgrades). If you are going to run it in a series, find the max wheel dia and width and (spec) tire if required. If no series, the sky is the limit. Josh's TD wheels (PR 1.2) have THE BEST caliper/spoke clearance you are going to find. 17x8" run around ~20, not super duper light, but reasonable, I wouldn't classify them heavy. They are very "open", great for cooling. Caliper/spoke clearance won't matter much if you run 11.6 or 13" Cobra's, but if you start stuffing TCE 1.1" or 1.25" rotors with 4 or 6 *** calipers, you are gonna need some space as the outside of the caliper starts to get out there. They are available in 8" width (about the min needed IMHO for a heavy car like the SHO) so you can nicely fit some 225/235 track rubber on there. I will repeat the last point because it's sorely overlooked, I'd get your car on the widest rim you can (typically 8" for the SHO).

Which brings me to my second point...rubber. If you want to stop, get some track tires. The best street tire in the world still won't grip like a track tire. The braking "limit" is when the tires go beyond the traction limit. Race tires are far, far ahead of street tires. yeah they cost a lot, yeah they wear fast, but run some laps with them, and you'll never go back. Tires stop the car, not the brakes. the brakes just slow the wheels. Assuming the heat stays in check, you could outbrake another SHO using 96 brakes and race pads on race rubber compared to some 6 piston 13" set up on street tires. Trust me on this. they WILL work your brakes harder though, more heat, so you'll want as much leverage (dia) as you can get, rotor thickness, and as high temp a pad as you want to go. When I TT'd my old 89 I ran a 12.2"x1.00 wilwood kit from TCE with WW "A" pads and ATE fluid. No complaints, other than at the time the FSL's were an option and they added stiffness over the BSL's would have been great. As mentioned above, I did get some pad taper, but nothing too out of whack. Typically I tried to rotate them from event to event, sometimes during.

The wilwood kit cost a lot to get into, but the replacement costs of the stuff is cheap. Like $8 seal rebuild kits for the calipers, and no slider pin and piston boots to burn up all the time like on the 96 and Cobra kits. The "A" pads last forever, are pretty cheap (check ebay) I have done 600 miles (2 days) at Road Atlanta, running hard, mid/high 1:40 laps and only used maybe half the material. They are ******* rotors though.

Also re: above, i would NOT run 13" brakes on a track under those 16x7" PR2

 

[TYSHO]

well part of the problem with teh car now, is that the front brakes blow sparks will brake-spooling the turbo during roll races

yes, i said that right, they blow SPARKS

That's because Hawk pads SUCK ASS. I don't know how many times I've said that, but I've seen Hawk pads spark like **** on a stock SHO with stock brakes...the suck and can't even stop a SHO from 140.

Want some good pads? Go with PFC and get the Z-rated ones, those guys make some bad ass brake kits and their pads are great!

 

[RJ-92]

My custom 12.5" TCE/Baer Racing set up fits under slicers with some grinding on the caliper. Keep in mind that the Bear Racing set up uses corvette rotors that sit further towards the hub than the standard Cobra setup. This deeper offset allows clearence for the slicers and also puts the unsprung weigh inboard for better handling. I think I have the best of both worlds with the lightwieght of the Wilwood set up with the more maintanance friendly floating PBR calipers.
I made 4 back to back stops from 100mph to 40mph while I was bedding the FPCM Z rated pads. I experienced no fade.

Bob

Hmmmm. I think that's the route I will be going. What is the difference with the mounting brackets for the calipers between the baer 12.5 kit and the cobra set-up? I imagine they are thicker where it meets the knuckle moving them inward? Any idea how much inward?

 

[jedhead]

Hmmmm. I think that's the route I will be going. What is the difference with the mounting brackets for the calipers between the baer 12.5 kit and the cobra set-up? I imagine they are thicker where it meets the knuckle moving them inward? Any idea how much inward?

The knuckles were already machined by Baer Racing. Alot of material was removed from the knuckles.

Original knuckles with dust shield on the left. The modified knuckles without dust shield on the left


Bob

 

[HotRodKid]

wow, looks like a good bit of weight was taken off the knuckles themselves, that should help offset the weight of the larger brakes

i know its not something you would feel while driving, but still ...

 

[jedhead]

wow, looks like a good bit of weight was taken off the knuckles themselves, that should help offset the weight of the larger brakes

i know its not something you would feel while driving, but still ...

With this brake setup, my lightweight wheels and tires, I have 10lbs less unsprung weight on each side in the front. I also have 3lbs less rotating mass on each side, (4lbs less for wheel/tire, plus 1lbs for the rotor) too. The lower rotating mass will help with the acceleration and the lower unsprung weight will help with the handling. I figured I did well in greatly increasing braking power without adding any extra weight or rotating mass, although this set up was expensive.

Bob

 

[HotRodKid]

wow, better weight savings then i expected !

now just find aluminium knuckles that can be modified to fit on the car, lol

 

[shomesomesho]

I made 4 back to back stops from 100mph to 40mph while I was bedding the FPCM Z rated pads. I experienced no fade.

Bob

where'd you purchase the pfc z-rateds for the cobra calipers?

I been looking everywhere for them but can't find the precious little buggers.

 

[TYSHO]

I been looking everywhere for them but can't find the precious little buggers.

AutoZone

412Z: $69.99

 

[shomesomesho]

Cool, thanks!