clutch service update #5: take two

[Bank of SHO]

Having the car apart a second time, I can't find any problems so far. Before I reinstall the tranny, is there any way to be sure it is working correctly? How easily should it shift by using a punch in the shifter stub? Is there any reason at all you can think of to blame the tranny for the bad shifting I was having when the car was running?

The flywheel and pressure plate were once again tightened a little at a time in a cross pattern and in stages with a torque wrench. The clutch disc was centered as close as I could see/feel it. Should the pressure plate and flywheel be touching at the bolt mating surfaces? There is a VERY slight gap between them around the dowl locations. I assume this is the aluminum flywheel deforming a tad.

 

[masho95]

Bank of SHO:
Having the car apart a second time, I can't find any problems so far. Before I reinstall the tranny, is there any way to be sure it is working correctly? How easily should it shift by using a punch in the shifter stub? Is there any reason at all you can think of to blame the tranny for the bad shifting I was having when the car was running?

The tranny should shift pretty smoothly with a drift in the gear selector shaft. Obviously you're using a small drift and it's not going to be as easy as the shifter, but it should go from gear to gear will a little force. If the car was having problems shifting into gear with the car running and not with it off, I'd really have to assume a TOB/PP/clutch disc problem, and not a tranny problem.

 

[Bank of SHO]

I don't doubt the diagnosis. The frustrating thing is the TOB, pp, and disc look good to me. Scott said it may be an improperly assembled pp, but it looks like the old one.

I wonder if the problem lies with the clutch cable(related to the diagnosis, right?). Masho95, did you ever figure out your adjustment mechanism?

If my cable and or adjustment mechanism is bad, what is involved in replacing them? I don't want to reassemble the car only to have to start all over again.

 

[DHMag]

if you have a gap between the pressure plate and flywheel, youre asking for trouble. when properly torqued, the pressure plate will mate against the flywheel. you mentioned aluminum flywheel, im not sure if its the same, it itd seem to be youd be putting extra, unneeded force on the pressure plate bolts by having that bit of slack in there. the best way to line up the clutch disc when installing is using the alignment tool.

 

[AutoSHO]

You didnt mention checking to ensure the correct side of the disc is facing the flywheel; I know there is a specific direction and that the clutch wont release properly if it is installed backwards.

 

[Bank of SHO]

Okay, I spoke with Eddie at Southbend Clutch. Once he heard about the gap, he was pretty sure that is the problem. Good call DHMag.

The gap was slight and only in the area of the dowls. Everything was tight around the bolt locations.

Remember that Fidanza had installed six dowls in my flywheel and I had to cut three of them off with a Dremel. Well the remaining three I just found out are either too long or not fully seated. Per Eddie's suggestion, I trimmed the dowls and now the pp and flywheel mate up. There is still a slight gap by one of the dowls, but the other two are good. I'll wait until tomorrow to continue reassembly in order to give the aluminum a chance to regain its memory. I hope there isn't any permanent damage.

AutoSHO, the disc was installed correctly. The reason I disassembled the car a second time was to check for that. Thanks for the input though.

Thank you all for your help. I hope this solves the problem.

Tom

 

[gosho89]

Bank of SHO:
Okay, I spoke with Eddie at Southbend Clutch. Once he heard about the gap, he was pretty sure that is the problem. Good call DHMag.

The gap was slight and only in the area of the dowls. Everything was tight around the bolt locations.

Remember that Fidanza had installed six dowls in my flywheel and I had to cut three of them off with a Dremel. Well the remaining three I just found out are either too long or not fully seated. Per Eddie's suggestion, I trimmed the dowls and now the pp and flywheel mate up. There is still a slight gap by one of the dowls, but the other two are good. I'll wait until tomorrow to continue reassembly in order to give the aluminum a chance to regain its memory. I hope there isn't any permanent damage.

AutoSHO, the disc was installed correctly. The reason I disassembled the car a second time was to check for that. Thanks for the input though.

Thank you all for your help. I hope this solves the problem.

Tom

Tom,

Sorry I got in late on this topic, I have also had problems with my dowels. In my case the diameter of the holes were not drilled large enough for the dowels. It possible could be a quality control issue with these flywheels. Even after I corrected this I am still having problems with slippage and clutch chatter. I am kinda burnt out on the issue and have just been avoiding driving it until I feel I want to tear it down again and install a DXD clutch to try and correct this by applying more plate pressure (2100 lbs) as suggested by Eddie. There has been talk that the Fidanza wheel inserts aren't the correct diameter and are not making contact with the clutch discs completely. A vendor which handles the SHOSHOP light weight flywheels I was told noticed this, so that will be the first thing I will check once I get mine disasembled.

What vendor did you purchase your flywheel from?

Kerry T

<small>[ September 17, 2003, 01:09 AM: Message edited by: gosho89 ]</small>

 

[masho95]

Bank of SHO:
I wonder if the problem lies with the clutch cable(related to the diagnosis, right?). Masho95, did you ever figure out your adjustment mechanism?

Nope, haven't had time to play with the adjustment mechanism, I've been busy finishing my Zex nitrous installation. Just got to find a place to put the NMU and finish the under hood wiring and I'm done with that.

 

[masho95]

Bank of SHO:
The gap was slight and only in the area of the dowls. Everything was tight around the bolt locations.
There is still a slight gap by one of the dowls, but the other two are good. I'll wait until tomorrow to continue reassembly in order to give the aluminum a chance to regain its memory.

I'd definitely make sure that all 3 of the "extra" dowels are flush before reinstallation or else you're going to still have some problems. If at all possible I'd drill out or have a shop drill out the extra 3 dowels and remove them from the flywheel. There's only supposed to be 3 for a reason.

-Happy with my SS 8-lb flywheel (with only 3 dowels)

 

[SHO_Driver]

Well I'm glad that you didn't tear it down again for nothing! Seems like you've found the problem and have some spirited driving ahead. thumb

 

[Bank of SHO]

I bought the tz clutch and Fidanza combo from Southbend Clutch. Eddie has been apologetic and upset with Fidanza. I in no way blame Southbend Clutch. Eddie is really a good guy to deal with. When I spoke with him today, he remembered me and told me he has a face-to-face meeting with a Fidanza big wig to discuss these problems. I'll let him know about the incorrect insert diamater too as I forgot about this. In fact, after disassembling it, I noticed about a quarter inch burn mark on the outer edge of the disc. I assumed it didn't matter as it couldn't wear in deeper than the steel inserts.

Masho95, I made sure they were as flush as I could get them the first time. It turns out that they reside in an area where they don't contact the surface anyway.

I think this will be a sweet setup once it works. The limited amount of driving I did showed no chatter at all. The car just felt better aside from the shifting.

 

[Bank of SHO]

It's alive! ALIVE!!!

It was the improperly installed flywheel dowls that were causing my woes. Thanks Fidanza. The shifting is a little notchy, but the car shifts into every gear without trouble. I still believe that the clutch pedal adjustment mechanism is defective. It never 'clicks' or changes the engagement point. I'll start a new thread about this and a few other new, but minor problems.

I wish to thank you ALL for your help throughout this project. beer beer Without your insistence that the problem resided with the TOB/disc/pressure plate, I never would have given such scrutiny to the pp/flywheel assembly. It took a light and a side view to see the tiny gaps caused by the poorly seated dowls. It looked normal otherwise.

Extra special thanks go to masho95 for his patient, timely, and frequent help, and to Scott for his procedure and continuing help. Cheers guys. beer beer beer beer hail hail

Thanks,
Tom

 

[masho95]

Glad to be of any help. I'm happy to hear that you are now enjoying the fruits of your labor. Now if I could only get my car running the way I want it to.