ATX failure, what the **** went wrong?

[TROG]

I sure hope it works out for you and that the cost isn't too brutal on the pocket book.

Please accept my apology for dropping in here as I have no info to provide to you....just a bit of fear on my part! My ATX is at 135k and I'm concerned about all the SHO's on E-Bay with bad auto transmissions going for peanuts!
I
Anyone interested, please check out my thread regarding the ATX to MTX conversions. Please feel free to participate and ya,...no fricken' jokes about ATX problems,...man it's no fun being in these shoes, eh?

Thanks!
DAVE a.k.a. TROG

 

[ohfosho]

hey i'm not the only one! my tranny gently slipped its way away on dec. 22.

mine made noise as it was quiting. it did give me 2-3 days notice. it started to slip when i get back on the gas after coasting to a stop light, or corner, and then would slip and then drop into 2nd pretty hard. i thought that if i took it easy on her, she could at least make it till spring... but 2 days later, she slipped out of 2nd after average and steadily accelerating from a stop sign about 5 mins after start up. and 5 seconds later came back into gear. only to slip out again about 7-10 seconds later. so at this point, i was saying the damage has already been done, its a fair KMetered ATX, so keep going till i have to bug CAA to come and get me. so i pull into a parking lot shortly after the first drop outs and check everything. tranny fluid is at normal level, starting to darken. (i had checked about 1 week prior, nothing out of norm). traffic is not heavy, so upon getting going again, i notice that as long as i take off very slowly, it has not much trouble, there is slight jerking as it slips and catches, and once im slightly up to speed, its ok. so i hop on the highway, accelerating slowly, evenly, make it up to speed just fine. during my 20 min hwy trip home i had time to think and try a few things on my trip and found that i had full motor power (no slipping from tranny) while the car is in 4th... i tried about 5 times, even stomping the gas a few times, the car was locked into 4th...would not down shift to third. i did not slow down to the point where it would have to shift to third, as i wanted to make it home.

upon getting off the highway, i put it in neutral and coasted to a parking lot to check. (i really wasnt sure to trust it for city driving after pushing my luck on the hwy), so i stop, a cloud of smoke arises from the hood. so i check the fluid again. it is noticeably darkened now. so i'm 2 mins away from home and want the car in my driveway without bugging anyone for help, traffic is not heavy so i try and it is considerably harder to get up to speed, really jerking as it slips and catches now, but she makes it. i put it in 1st when i am going down the side street and once up to speed a bit, it didnt seem to slip when locked into that gear.

i'm really thinking the torque converter fryed on mine, but i'm not sure.

 

[TimboSHO]

to fix. remove transmission remove side pan on transmission remove oil pump cover and replace oil pump assembly. once the tranny is out it will take all of 10 min to fix, if this is infact your problem.


to test the pump remove a tranny cooling line and start the car. fluid should shoot about 10 feet under pressure. (at idle)


it is reading high because the fluid is not being pumped through the transmission

The transmission does not have to be removed to replace a pump shaft/pump assembly. It's tricky to do in the car, but saves a bunch of time over pulling the trans. The problem is, if you take the pump assembly and shaft out and they are OK, that means you have other problems inside and the trans does need to come out.
If the fluid reading is high, that means it's not pumping, no need to pull a cooler line.... nothing is going to come out, guaranteed.

 

[TimboSHO]

The guys at work (at a transmission shop) think that it has to be the pump shaft. Those shafts are known for failure, and they can break or the splines can strip. If the shaft breaks it is hard to get the half out that is closest to the torque converter, and you may have to remove it to do this. I would say if you have had no other issues with this trans and the fluid is nice and red, pull the side cover and replace the pump shaft (and pump if it is damaged). Good luck Chris! If you were closer to me or if I had the time to go to that side of the state I'd do it myself!

 

[SHO#7]

Pump shaft or stripped converter splines. Either way no pump movement. No pump means no fluid flow and would equal high fluid level.

Gonna have to take this one out to fix. Pull the transmission, look in the TC for stripped splines. See if you can spin the pump shaft on the transmission.

One or the other let go, sorry. Time for a rebuild

Mike

 

[SHO#7]

The transmission does not have to be removed to replace a pump shaft/pump assembly. It's tricky to do in the car, but saves a bunch of time over pulling the trans.

IMHO taking the whole transmission out is faster than fighting with that side pan. But, that is just me.

Mike

 

[95azSHO]

Please post results,cost, and time down. I have a 95 near 100,000 thats been acting up lately

 

[Huntervf]

UPDATE:

The oil pump shaft failed. The bearing for the shaft had worn, allowing the shaft to oscilate enough to snap. There was some minor damage to the pump housing, but there appears to be no other damage to the transmission, heat or otherwise.

The shop doing this work is amazing. They're well-acquainted with SHO automatics and are indeed doing the work without removing the transmission. Now, because of this they aren't able to fully crack the tranny open and check it completely, but the pan and magnet were absolutely clean, the valve body checks out and there's no sign of heat damage. The tech feels pretty confident that the rest of the transmission should be just fine, but we won't know for sure until it's back together.

We'll be replacing the pump, bearing and housing with a final cost in the $450-$475 range. Should have the car back in the next couple days.

 

[sho'd]

had those problems before.

its a atx and your wondering what the problem is ?

yeah i'm a little sick of these comments as well.

Hunter- glad to hear you got it fixed, and it didn't cost 1000's of dollars to do, good luck bud, hang in there, you may just get your house yet. best of luck.

 

[TimboSHO]

That is excellent to hear Chris. I'm glad they checked the pan before removing the side cover. That sounds like a pretty decent price as well!

 

[1995mtxsho]

Tim, is this the same as we seen in Brian's ATX you just pulled?

 

[TimboSHO]

Yep, that's the same failure (for those of you not at Brians when we pulled the trans off of the motor, we found a small piece of the pump shaft in the torque converter). Brian's fluid was kind of dark though as well, so it could have needed a bit more that just the shaft. Oh well, it's gone now!

 

[95azSHO]

Thanks for for the update and knowing that an ATX repair doesn't have to cost an arm and a leg. Now I just need to find the right shop ( a good one ) to have it looked at .

 

[Huntervf]

Well, I'm not out of the woods yet. The car is still in the process of being put back together, so I won't know if there's any other damage until it's back on the road. I am concerned because the car was run for 10-15 minutes total at various times with no fluid pumping through the tranny. The tech doesn't believe this to be a problem, and he has seen no indication of high temps in the valve body. If all comes out well, this will be a surprisingly inexpensive transmission repair, but as a guideline for others I think it should be noted that such a repair is generally the exception when it comes to ATX probs.

So Brian's ATX had the same failure? I wonder if that's a 93-only issue? Seems to me something like an oil pump shaft should NOT be failing like this.

 

[1995mtxsho]

Yup I picked the inch and a half long part of the splined shaft out of the T/C myself.. had about 1/16" of angled splines like it twisted a bit first and then let go in a clean break all the way around... I fealt it to be an odd failure... at the time, apearantly not.

 

[TimboSHO]

The guys at my previous job assured me it's a pretty common failure in AXOD-Es, AX4Ns, AX4Ss.... etc. I've only seen a couple during my time there, and they were both in Gen 3s. Whenever we rebuild them, we put a new pump shaft in them about 99% of the time for this reason as well.

 

[Huntervf]

New parts are installed and transmission seems to be shifting a-ok. I'm also having an oil change and power steering flush done since both were due, grand total $550.00. I'll be picking the car up tomorrow

THANKS THANKS to the many people who helped me out with information and physical help on this repair. Mr. A, Operdot, SHObill, somedude, SHOAZ... couldn't have done this without you

 

[SolidState]

lucky you. My 5th ATX Transmission died, so I threw the car away.

 

[F-22 Raptor SHO]

New parts are installed and transmission seems to be shifting a-ok. I'm also having an oil change and power steering flush done since both were due, grand total $550.00. I'll be picking the car up tomorrow

THANKS THANKS to the many people who helped me out with information and physical help on this repair. Mr. A, Operdot, SHObill, somedude, SHOAZ... couldn't have done this without you

Glad it turned out well. This is by far the best 93 atx I've ever seen.

 

[kzoosho]

Glad you got it going Cris. I got rid of what was left of my 93 last week .good luck with the car.