jmpSHO
SHO Member
I am about to buy the rear brake upgrade for 95 ATX and I was wondering how do I adjust the brake bias and do I actually have to adjust it?
adjusting rear brake bias
- Thread starter jmpSHO
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Do you have to adjust it is debatable, if you give yourself more front bias to even out the larger rear brakes, then you pretty much negate the upgrade. If you do nothing or add more rear bias you will just activate the abs more. If your abs doesn’t work the car will be more likely to swap ends on you. To adjust the bias, you would have to install dual bias adjusters to keep the separate circuits or re-plumb the brake system to have one bias adjuster, but then you lose the separate brake circuits. In my opinion, rear brake upgrades (with the exception of solid to vented disc) are really just for bling factor.
jmpSHO
SHO Member
My rear calipers are junk so I have to replace them anyways so I figured I would go with something better plus I hate the look of the small rotors. I only have 11.6 up front I'm just wondering if it's ok to run the 11.6 in the rear too without any problems. My proportion valve is new and works good as does my abs.
SeanMc
NoMoSHO
Unless you have the cobra front upgrade, there is really no reason to go with the 11.6 rear.
jmpSHO
SHO Member
So I won't see any benefit at all upgrading to the 11.6 in the rear?
You will get more braking in the rear and you see better stopping. If you do panic stop the ABS will kick in sooner as the rear end usually lifts in a panic situation and well your brakes will be better.
The rear upgrade is better suited to be matched with a 13" upgrade but you should still be okay.
St Louis SHO
Rollin' coal
How? All you are doing is replacing the little rotor with a bigger one.... This is very very debatable. The 11.6" rear upgrade is nothing more than an appearance modifacation.
- James
jmpSHO
SHO Member
I really do not understand how bigger rear brakes can not help you stop better.
SuperHO
Mental Patient
cuz overall, under normal driving circumstances, the rear brakes only do maybe 20% of the overall work...if that. ever notice how infrequent rear brakes need changing? i've had my 95 since 2005, and although i've done front brakes twice and upgraded to the 96+, i've only done the rears once, and that was shortly after i got the car cuz the calipers had seized. and i've probably put 60k on the car since then...and yes, they are in adjustment. *edit you really wanna be able to stop better, get a more aggressive pad/rotor setup and sticky tires. that'd be more effective.
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If you get the bias plugs then the rears will need changing more often. Stock the rears are seldom stressed but with the bias plugs you will get a lot more action out of them.
The bias plugs are the only rear brake mod I would mess with.
The bias plugs are the only rear brake mod I would mess with.
jmpSHO
SHO Member
Like I said earlier my rear calipers are junk so I figured I would go with something a little better since I have to replace them anyways and if a bigger rotor helps just a tiny bit I'm happy. By the way I do have good tires on my SHO and I have tried all types of brake rotors and pads from slotted to cross drilled and I haven't been happy with my brakes since I bought my SHO 5 years ago. I most likely will end up getting the stage 3 kit from SHO Source for the front anyways since that's what a lot of people on here recommend with the rear upgrade. Whether people agree with me or not I appreciate everyone's input in this thread.
St Louis SHO
Rollin' coal
It's all good. I run the 13" up front and 11.6" out back. All I was pointing out is that there is no performance increase going to the 11.6" out back. If you have 17" wheels, it will look a ton better 
You are moving the moment arm out. The longer the moment arem the more torque.
It is similiar to the Gen3 SHO upgrade. You move out the calipers but you get a slightly larger pad.
Bigger rotors could hurt your braking.
The reason for larger rotors is heat management or increasing brake torque. You will only get the advantage of heat management if you track your car, not that it is even needed on the SHO (I only see 300 degrees at the rears with my bias block tied up to give full flow to the rear brakes.) The reason a larger rotor has better heat management is the extra mass the rotor has. While mass is a good thing for controlling heat, it hurts you when you accelerate or decelerate. If you run a big brake kit, your single stop distance (street driving is a bunch of single stops) will most likely be longer than with stock brakes because there is more rotor to slow down. Its only after you have slowed down considerably, a couple of times in a row, in a short period of time that the big brake kit will have a shorter stopping distance than the stock brakes.
As for increasing brake torque...By using a larger rotor, you move the brake caliper out further from the center of the wheel, thus increasing the braking torque created when you brake. This is good if you want to stop faster. As already stated, with a larger rotor you increase the rotational mass associated with each wheel so it takes more brake to stop a bigger rotor. It also takes more to get the car going thus hurting your acceleration (as far as mass on a drive wheel, not so sure on a non drive wheel.) In any event you would be adding weight to your car.
Since heat isn’t an issue there is no reason to add mass to the rear rotors. There is another way to increase brake torque, and that would be to use a pad with a higher coefficient of friction than the stock/replacement pad. Only down side is slightly higher rotor wear and slightly more dusting. There arent too many companies that make better than oem replacement rear pads, Hawk is one (dont know the coeff of friction) and another is porterfield.
The reason for larger rotors is heat management or increasing brake torque. You will only get the advantage of heat management if you track your car, not that it is even needed on the SHO (I only see 300 degrees at the rears with my bias block tied up to give full flow to the rear brakes.) The reason a larger rotor has better heat management is the extra mass the rotor has. While mass is a good thing for controlling heat, it hurts you when you accelerate or decelerate. If you run a big brake kit, your single stop distance (street driving is a bunch of single stops) will most likely be longer than with stock brakes because there is more rotor to slow down. Its only after you have slowed down considerably, a couple of times in a row, in a short period of time that the big brake kit will have a shorter stopping distance than the stock brakes.
As for increasing brake torque...By using a larger rotor, you move the brake caliper out further from the center of the wheel, thus increasing the braking torque created when you brake. This is good if you want to stop faster. As already stated, with a larger rotor you increase the rotational mass associated with each wheel so it takes more brake to stop a bigger rotor. It also takes more to get the car going thus hurting your acceleration (as far as mass on a drive wheel, not so sure on a non drive wheel.) In any event you would be adding weight to your car.
Since heat isn’t an issue there is no reason to add mass to the rear rotors. There is another way to increase brake torque, and that would be to use a pad with a higher coefficient of friction than the stock/replacement pad. Only down side is slightly higher rotor wear and slightly more dusting. There arent too many companies that make better than oem replacement rear pads, Hawk is one (dont know the coeff of friction) and another is porterfield.
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SHOCH
Tommy Boy
I put the 11.6's on the rear and bias plugs a couple years ago just to fill the wheels, 17's looked empty. Porter won them at a convention so I bought them from him. They do look better/bigger but the reality is you're only using the outside half of the surface, and smart car people can tell it's for looks only when the fronts are the same size.
I use only Hawk HPS pads for the front, they don't have to be hot to work well, on the street the're fine.
Only problem I have is I REALLY have to watch those gen I caliper slider pins. I'm sure the weight slows me a little but I don't run for 1/4 mile time, and I can't imagine it being that much of a loss. I've roadcoursed a dozen days and have never had a rear lockup problem, but I don't rely on abs, I'm 43 and have driven ALOT of vehicles over the years.
Just my $.02.
I use only Hawk HPS pads for the front, they don't have to be hot to work well, on the street the're fine.
Only problem I have is I REALLY have to watch those gen I caliper slider pins. I'm sure the weight slows me a little but I don't run for 1/4 mile time, and I can't imagine it being that much of a loss. I've roadcoursed a dozen days and have never had a rear lockup problem, but I don't rely on abs, I'm 43 and have driven ALOT of vehicles over the years.
Just my $.02.
jmpSHO
SHO Member
I have 18 in. wheels and I'm doing the upgrade partly for looks and I was hoping for a little better stopping power. I still can't believe it won't help just a little but I guess I will find out for myself. I too don't think the bigger rotors will slow me down much.
Shoaz
Studly dood
The rear brakes contribute very little to stopping the car. I think they're there mostly as a parking brake.
On my old car (which got tracked a lot but also saw a lot of street duty) I changed front pads fairly regularly and never changed the rears. They just didn't wear. The same has been true with the Pumpkin (the current race car, which is track-only). The ABS failed a couple years ago and I pulled the bias valve to the OFF position to keep from locking the inside rear under trail braking. I've run that way ever since and it hasn't affected my lap times. I'm faster now with the rear brakes turned off than I was before, but that's probably because of other changes. Regardless, it's clear that I don't need more rear brake.
You really don't need upgraded rear brakes for performance. I can't see any reason to do it beyond appearance.
On my old car (which got tracked a lot but also saw a lot of street duty) I changed front pads fairly regularly and never changed the rears. They just didn't wear. The same has been true with the Pumpkin (the current race car, which is track-only). The ABS failed a couple years ago and I pulled the bias valve to the OFF position to keep from locking the inside rear under trail braking. I've run that way ever since and it hasn't affected my lap times. I'm faster now with the rear brakes turned off than I was before, but that's probably because of other changes. Regardless, it's clear that I don't need more rear brake.
You really don't need upgraded rear brakes for performance. I can't see any reason to do it beyond appearance.
Shoaz
Studly dood
Just the physics of weight transfer, especially on a front-heavy FWD car. Hard to get around that.
The Gen 3 subframe mod works so well because the geometry of the control arms combats front end dive under braking.
If you use the 11.6 Gen 3 brakes with the Gen 3 subframe and use bias plugs in the rear on stock solid rotors you will see the rear brakes be put in to use much more.
I would change the rears about every other time compared to the fronts.
If you use the 11.6 Gen 3 brakes with the Gen 3 subframe and use bias plugs in the rear on stock solid rotors you will see the rear brakes be put in to use much more.
I would change the rears about every other time compared to the fronts.
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