93 atx engine stalls when I try to rev

Discussion in 'Gen 1 & 2 - Engine, Exhaust, Drive Line & AC syste' started by goryr88, Aug 12, 2017.

  1. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    I'm stumped. 93 ATX just finished the 60K. New timing belt, water pump, checked valves, CPS, plugs, wires, and acc belt. Put it all together last weekend and it ran fine except for fuel spraying from the regulator. I even revved it up to check the secondaries and they worked fine. Fast forward to today, I got the fuel leak fixed and put the intake back on and started it up. Very rough idle. Once in a while, it would pickup rpm and run fine, but then it would slowly die. Cannot give it any throttle, or it dies instantly. No check engine light either. Any ideas?
     
  2. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    bad seal from intake to head, pinched vacuum line in the back, wrong plug wire routing, belt jumped time... I would double check the plug wires and then go to removing the intake and reseating it. Make sure the couplers at the runners are loose as you can get a bad seal removing it and replacing it as one solid piece. Also check fuel pressure. All that stuff is at the top and is an easier place to start. I would also first pull codes even if you didn't see the check engine light
     
    tery and SHOdded like this.
  3. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    I'll check those in the morning. Plug wires are correct, because it ran fine last weekend. Please God I hope the belt didn't jump. I did not loosen any of the clamps on the runners last weekend and it ran fine. I did not loosen them this time either. Maybe I got a bad seal this time. Fuel pressure is good I believe. When I hit the valve, fuel comes pouring out, so I assume it is good.
     
    tery likes this.
  4. rubydist

    rubydist SHO Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    6,341
    Likes Received:
    2,047
    Location:
    Denver
    another possibility from the description provided is that you may have failed to reconnect the tps connector.
     
    tery likes this.
  5. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    I checked that. It is connected.
     
    tery likes this.
  6. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    Fuel coming out is a good sign but not an accurate reading. You can get lucky with the intake but eventually it will shift ever so slightly and you'll think everything went on correctly but it didn't. I found that out the hard way and is why I mention it often. Same with pinched small vacuum hose on the back side where you can't see very well. I tightened the intake down and did not even notice a small hose got in there and I crushed it real good. Just spit-balling ideas from my own mistakes over the years. You have to eliminate the easy stuff before you dig deeper

    Also you mentioned it ran fine and then you put the intake back on and it did not run fine so that is the logical place to start. At least to me
     
    tery and SHOdded like this.
  7. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    So, I took the intake off and loosened the runners and put it on again. It sat nice and flush before I put the bolts in. Torque it down to 17 lbs on all bolts in 3 step increments. Connect everything else and now it'll run great for 10 to 15 seconds and then quit. Still cannot touch the throttle or it dies. No vacuum lines are crushed. Changed tps and maf and it still does it. The hell am I doing wrong?
     
    tery likes this.
  8. rubydist

    rubydist SHO Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    6,341
    Likes Received:
    2,047
    Location:
    Denver
    now you will have codes, pull them and let us know what they are.
     
    tery and SHOdded like this.
  9. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    I agree. Take the car's help in pinpointing failures. Beyond that, was the car running well before the 60k? If so then you have to deconstruct what you did and see if there is an error somewhere or if a new part was faulty or an old part failed along the way. I wonder if the IAC is working properly? fuel pump? regulator failure? recheck the sparkplug wire routing to correct coil (happens more than you think), then look at the timing and the cps.

    Codes first. Codes always first. Value your time and your wallet and take the 10 minutes to see if the car will help you solve any problem
     
    tery, zoomlater and SHOdded like this.
  10. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    Ok. Here we go with the codes. it did run fine before the 60K. I'm gonna write these numbers in the sequence of the amount of times the check engine light blinked. It didn't work like I expected so here goes.

    3 3 7 3 3 7 1 1 2 2 1 5 7 2 1 1 1 2 2 1 5 7 2 1 1

    If I'm doing this right, I'm thinking

    337-EGR feedback signal is/was high

    122-TP low or possibly grounded

    157-Mass air flow signal is/was low or grounded

    211-ignitnion pip signal was erratic or missing

    Someone chime in and let me know what they think. Much appreciated.
     
    tery likes this.
  11. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    I'm not sure about the numbers but that's too many sensor failures to be normal. First thing I would check is the battery voltage and voltage with the alternator running. When there isn't enough juice weird stuff happens. I never had a belt off time so I'm not sure if/how that effects codes across the spectrum.

    Thanks to modern tech you can always try posting a vid with the flashes so people can double check your work. Usually if those codes are correct it's crazy electrical power problems, faulty computer, bad grounding issue etc. Also no experience with timing off significantly since the last motor swap I did was with an 80's car and no issues with that in any of my SHO's so someone else would have to pipe in on that
     
    tery and SHOdded like this.
  12. rubydist

    rubydist SHO Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    6,341
    Likes Received:
    2,047
    Location:
    Denver
    No wonder it won't run. Both the mafs and the tps are fubar so it has no idea how much air is going into the engine, so no idea how much fuel to give it. So its trying to give it idle fuel even when you open the throttle.

    Both the mafs and tps are on the same power circuit from the pcm. You will need to determine if there is power from the pcm to the mafs and to the tps, if its not being sent by the pcm or if its lost in the harness. Both are certainly possible. I am going to guess that the harness has a short somewhere and that the messing around with the intake manifold etc. has allowed that to appear, but its only a guess and you will need to find it and fix it.
     
    tery likes this.
  13. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    I'm gonna take the intake back off so I can get down there and see what I did...
     
    tery likes this.
  14. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    Everything looks good that I can see. Is there supposed to be a ground on the bottom of the support piece that you stick down there? I know the ground connects through the top part of the support. I am trying to upload a couple vids, but I can't believe the limit is less than 20mb.
     
    tery likes this.
  15. rubydist

    rubydist SHO Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    6,341
    Likes Received:
    2,047
    Location:
    Denver
    put the video on youtube and link to it here.
     
    SHOdded likes this.
  16. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    Ok. here is what the car does now. Runs great, but dies 10-15 seconds later.



    Here is the vid of the codes. Let me know if I'm missing something with the codes.

     
    SHOdded and tery like this.
  17. rubydist

    rubydist SHO Member Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2007
    Messages:
    6,341
    Likes Received:
    2,047
    Location:
    Denver
    so I get:
    current state codes
    337 = egr feedback signal is high
    stored codes
    122 = tps signal low, grounded or open
    157 = mafs signal low or grounded
    211 = crank sensor signal erratic

    Did you reset the codes (have battery disconnected) when you last pulled the intake manifold? If so, you still have the same issues. I am thinking that the crank sensor is bad and after it runs for a few seconds it quits working, which is causing the engine to die.

    I am also thinking that you have the same lack of power to the tps and mafs that I discussed above.

    If you did not reset the codes the last time you had the intake off, then you need to reset them, start the car a few times, and pull the codes again.
     
    SHOdded and tery like this.
  18. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    I agree. It's always best to check what is stored, clear it out and see what comes back. It doesn't sputter and seems to just cut out. I'm not sure if there is a pcm driver or wiring issue or if the crank sensor was bad out of the box. That is rare to fail out of the box but it has been posted on here before
     
  19. goryr88

    goryr88 SHO Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    124
    Likes Received:
    53
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT
    Location:
    Iowa
    I hope not. Brand new cps. Not really looking forward to tearing this all apart again...
     
  20. luigisho

    luigisho SHO Member

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2001
    Messages:
    7,401
    Likes Received:
    738
    Location:
    va beach,va
    Home Page:
    It ran ok before you did all the work?
     

Share This Page

If you wish to help keep SHOforum running, please click the donation button below