Juicybaka
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Agreed not Charlie’s fault, he’s from Virginia 
Subwoofer add-in
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The Sony amp works fine with 2 ohm speakers in the front and rear, so you don’t need to worry about that. My wife has been running them in her Flex for almost 2 years with zero problems. The Flex is EXACTLY the same as the Taurus with identical amp and speakers. You can put 2 ways in the front. It makes no difference if the existing speakers is 1 way. The factory pillar tweeter is separately powered and is actually pretty good. If you really want a component type speaker, they make “coaxial components,” like the JL Audio C5-570x, that have a separate crossover and the option of mounting the tweeters in the speaker itself or separately, though I’m not sure the Sony amp has enough balls to power them well.
You need to get front door speakers. They are the most important in the whole system, and spend some money there. If you like JBL, I’d go with Stadium gto860. You will be much happier with how these sounds than ones in the 60-80 buck range. These are basically the same as my Infinity’s. They’re both made by Harmon.
I think I messaged you prior to going through with it since I only found one other SHO with an IB setup. I don't have a ton of pics, there are some here... https://shoforum.com/index.php?threads/bypass-sony-subwoofer-amp-on-2016.138018/page-2#post-1495177
The subs and baffle are the same but I have made a bunch of changes to other things since. Very happy I went IB, I kept most of the trunk space and it sounds great. First time entering SQ comps this year and I took 1st in class twice and came in second in class at NY Finals.
Juicybaka
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Ok, thanks for the info. Going to see if clarity is improved with the rear doors and deck speakers replaced. Just don’t want to turn this into costly project as I’ve been down this road before...
Completely agree with front speakers importance too. I had a Ford crew cab and only put Boston acoustic components up front and 1 sub. Sound was amazing! Wonder why BA doesn’t make car audio anymore? Thanks again!
Boston... There’s a name I haven’t heard in a while—really old school. Makes me feel nostalgic. I was out of the car audio game for 15 plus years until I got my SHO and got bit by the bug again. Now I’ve put systems in the SHO and the wife’s Flex and am looking to do the in laws cars now. Lol
Looks like Boston still makes some car audio gear. There’s some new stuff on eBay. It super high end though. I remember back in the day when PPI, Boston, HiFonics, Lanzar, MB Quart, etc. were the sh*t. A lot of the old school names are still around, but it’s turned into Chinese crap. It’s a real shame. It’s driven the price of the old stuff through the roof though.
Doing these new cars is a whole other learning experience. The same principles still apply. There’s just a lot of new stuff like CAN busses, Forscan hacks, DSP, etc. Be careful—I started out with just door speakers, and deck subs too. You’ll be broke before you know it. Lol
Juicybaka
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Yes, this could get dangerous quickly, but I learned my lesson from Suburban sitting in gagage for a 6 month build. And way too much involved for what I thought I was getting into. I stopped by one of the few car stereo installlers that are still near me and didn’t recognize 3/4 of the items on the wall. I was happy to see Alpine V power, and still is a nice amp. Phoenix Gold, not so much anymore.
It’s the damn bass! When Beastie Boys come on I don’t want speakers farting! Let’s see what remedy(s) fix this....
My SHO stereo build took a month and a half working on it pretty much every night until midnight.
There’s a lot of garbage out there now. Alpine is still great. JL is great—some of the other stuff that used to be awesome not so much. There’s a lot of mega dollar stuff like Audiofrog, Dynaudio, etc that I’d like to try someday, too. The best thing now is DSP. It’s amazing. You can take decent speakers and not a lot of power and optimize it to sound frickin amazing with a laptop.
I built a sound quality system in my sho. It sounds awesome with pop, country, classical, jazz, etc, but I also find myself listening to bass heavy r&b and rap I liked 20 years ago too. I guess it brings back my youth. I’ve got a JL Audio 13w3 in mine and find myself wanting more bass already. Lol. Don’t get me wrong. It hits hard and impresses the **** out of most people. It’s just like you get used to a fast car. You always want more. I just don’t want to give up my whole trunk.
I just ordered some home theater bass shakers and am gonna try mounting those under the front seats. I’ve read really good things about them in cars, and they take up almost no space and take very little power. Bass is 90% feel of the vibration, so I’m crossing my fingers this will give me enough to be happy. I’ll post the results of my experiment once I get a chance to install them.
Joshw0000
SHO Member
Thanks for the pic and diagram. I've been working on a (cheap) stereo and didn't even know that was there. I was always taught to go 1st class or 3rd, but never 2nd or you'll regret it. Welp, I didn't listen.
I bought a Kicker 8" Hideaway sub for the trunk. Once I cranked the stereo loud enough to hear any bass I couldn't tell if it was the 8" or the factory subs. Turned down the 8" with the bass *** and it sounded the same. So I bought the 10" version (thinking I'll put the 8" on the golf cart). Same thing. I can't tell any difference over stock.
Now I'm debating on pulling the whole thing out and replacing with a Rockford P300-10" and re-wiring with 4 gauge wire (the Kicker came with 14GA).
I did want to ask you about the speakers that you tapped in to. For the Kicker I'm using now, I tapped into the 2 rear speakers. By tapping in, I mean I soldered to the prongs of the factory speakers (I hate splicing factory wires). I spoke to a local audio shop and they suggested that I tap into the single center subwoofer instead. What do you think? Tapping into the door speakers will sound better? Am I losing anything in how I currently have it wired (not splicing the wires)?
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I bought a Kicker 8" Hideaway sub for the trunk. Once I cranked the stereo loud enough to hear any bass I couldn't tell if it was the 8" or the factory subs. Turned down the 8" with the bass *** and it sounded the same. So I bought the 10" version (thinking I'll put the 8" on the golf cart). Same thing. I can't tell any difference over stock.
Now I'm debating on pulling the whole thing out and replacing with a Rockford P300-10" and re-wiring with 4 gauge wire (the Kicker came with 14GA).
I did want to ask you about the speakers that you tapped in to. For the Kicker I'm using now, I tapped into the 2 rear speakers. By tapping in, I mean I soldered to the prongs of the factory speakers (I hate splicing factory wires). I spoke to a local audio shop and they suggested that I tap into the single center subwoofer instead. What do you think? Tapping into the door speakers will sound better? Am I losing anything in how I currently have it wired (not splicing the wires)?
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SHOinVa
SHO Member
Thanks for the heads up, I read that somewhere else before, but was hoping it was a mistake or someone got a bad unit. I was thinking about doing the same thing, but now I see it's pointless. I think maybe it would work if you could find a place in the cabin to put it, my guess there's just not enough there for the trunk. Keep us posted if you find something that works. I don't want much but a bit more bass would be nice.
C/
Juicybaka
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Can anyone please reference me rear deck removal instructions. Not sure what might be hiding just popping push rivets and muscling out. Thank you
Joshw0000
SHO Member
Agreed. The 8" Hideaway and/or the 10" all-in-one are both pretty good subs. I think the 8" will sound very good on my golf cart since I only have 2 Kicker 6" speakers right now which produce only lows and mids. It'll be mounted under my rear seat, firing down so I think it's going to perform very well.
I'm currently using the wiring kit for the 8" on the 10" sub (they're interchangeable). I'm going to try adjusting my wiring to see if I can get any more bass out of the 10". If not, it'll get boxed up and go back to Walmart. Both subs are 100W RMS. They both have decent reviews and don't sound bad from the trunk of the car. But from the driver's seat, I can't even hear them. The factory 390W system over powers both of them. For less than $200 all in, I guess you get what you pay for.
If I can't get this 10" Kicker to perform any better, my next plan of action is to buy a 4 GA wiring kit to ensure I'm getting plenty of power and try a Fosgate P300-10. It's a 300W RMS sub with good reviews. It's also available in 12" (same 300W RMS) but I prefer the thump of 10" subs. They're about $175 on Amazon right now and seem to be the most powerful all-in-one on the market. If I'm still unhappy, I may just live with it or decide to spend a little extra cheddar on something like a Fosgate Punch 10", box, and amp. At least the wiring will be in place if I do make that decision down the road.
A little word of advice when you start to run your power... Pull your carpet up under the gas pedal (lower and to the right) and you'll see a grommet for the trunk release that you can poke through. I must have spent 2 or 3 hours just searching for a place to enter the firewall before I came across that. I didn't want to drill through because it's so tight and I didn't want to risk hitting something. And since we have SHO's, basically every factory location is filled with something (i.e. sunroof drain on passenger side).
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I'm currently using the wiring kit for the 8" on the 10" sub (they're interchangeable). I'm going to try adjusting my wiring to see if I can get any more bass out of the 10". If not, it'll get boxed up and go back to Walmart. Both subs are 100W RMS. They both have decent reviews and don't sound bad from the trunk of the car. But from the driver's seat, I can't even hear them. The factory 390W system over powers both of them. For less than $200 all in, I guess you get what you pay for.
If I can't get this 10" Kicker to perform any better, my next plan of action is to buy a 4 GA wiring kit to ensure I'm getting plenty of power and try a Fosgate P300-10. It's a 300W RMS sub with good reviews. It's also available in 12" (same 300W RMS) but I prefer the thump of 10" subs. They're about $175 on Amazon right now and seem to be the most powerful all-in-one on the market. If I'm still unhappy, I may just live with it or decide to spend a little extra cheddar on something like a Fosgate Punch 10", box, and amp. At least the wiring will be in place if I do make that decision down the road.
A little word of advice when you start to run your power... Pull your carpet up under the gas pedal (lower and to the right) and you'll see a grommet for the trunk release that you can poke through. I must have spent 2 or 3 hours just searching for a place to enter the firewall before I came across that. I didn't want to drill through because it's so tight and I didn't want to risk hitting something. And since we have SHO's, basically every factory location is filled with something (i.e. sunroof drain on passenger side).
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Juicybaka
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Thanks for that invaluable info! How may feet did you need to run wire to trunk? Will 18’ make it?
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Joshw0000
SHO Member
The Kickers came with a 20' cord I believe and I used pretty much all of it. So if I go to the Rockford I'll get a 4GA, 20' wiring kit.
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Juicybaka
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Ok, thanks I’ll order 20’ kit. Hoping to install rear deck and door speakers this weekend. Do you know of any diagrams or threads for rear deck removal?
Joshw0000
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I haven't replaced any of the factory speakers. Please post diagrams if you find them. I may end up doing that eventually.
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Juicybaka
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Ok, will do. I’m waiting for terminal connectors to arrive from crutchfield and sometimes they include vehicle specifics instructions. I tried search on forum and web but haven’t found anything
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Blood sweat and beers
It's a shame how many quality brands turned to crap. It's all relative though, while not cheap I don't think of Audiofrogs as mega dollar when things like the top of the like Focal Utopia and Morel Supremo exist. They out of the budget of most people either financially or simply the want isn't there to spend that kind of money for car stereo speakers. I would say running the Frog mids and hearing a decent amount of cars with them and other expensive SQ builds they are about the sweet spot as far as diminishing returns goes. I actually scored better at an SQ comp this summer than a Land Rover running the $5000 Utopia set, not that the Frogs are all out better but at that point the install and tuning become larger factors.
DSPs are huge improvement though. They have gotten cheap for a basic one and you are absolutely correct you can make halfway decent equipment sound hugely better. You need to have a little understanding of what's going on but not to much to make a big improvement. Better money spent over higher end speakers without one for sure.
Yup, I was happy now I want more. Exactly like a fast car, you just get used to it and thrill isn't there. If I go on vacation and drive a generic rental car for a week when I get home the SHO is a rocket again. And I find myself listening to stuff I didn't and also realizing how poorly some stuff was mastered that I didn't before.
I have them at home since in the sectional. I have adjoining neighbors and can't run a sub how I would like. They do well for what they are but I typically use them for movies not music. Just be sure you have them mounted rigidly to the seat for the energy to transfer through to you for them to work the best.
Gonna try to address multiple questions in one post here. As far as a power wire, 18’ will just barely do it if you’re careful with routing. The best place to to come through the firewall is where the factory harness comes though under the cowl panel at the base of the windshield. You have to remove the wiper arms. Then it just comes off by releasing plastic clips and a couple u shaped metal ones at the ends. Theres a top flexible piece and a bottom rigid piece. There’s a rubber boot in there on the drivers side you need to poke a tiny hole in and then you can feed a coat hanger as a pull for your power wire. It will come through the upper left dash area and end up above the steering shaft. You can feed it from the cowl area to the battery by going through the factory cowl drain. I will post a few pics at the end. 4 AWG is plenty unless you’re going crazy with power. Modern class D amps are very efficient and don’t need huge current. #4 will feed 1000 watts RMS with class D amps. I’d run a #4 even if you’re only going with a sub initially. You’ll thank yourself later when you decide to add another amp and you don’t have to rip the car apart again. Don’t ask me how I know. Lol
For instructions taking the car apart, the crutchfield guide is very good. You can get it for free if you buy anything from them. I wouldn’t attempt it without that guide or a service manual. There are too many expensive things you can break taking it apart, and the steps are pretty involved for taking the dash apart and getting thr rear deck out. It’s not hard. Just a lot of things need to be done I’m order.
As far as subs go, the Kicker hideaway sounds decent if it’s under your seat, but you’re not even gonna hear it in the trunk. The main problem with the kicker stuff with integrated amps is the electronics are crap. They are very unreliable. Just read the reviews. Look at this replacement amp board for the hideaway. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/183166321695 It looks like it belongs in a $20 boom box. Judging from the lack of stiffening caps, the power rail is weak as ****, there is no heat sink on the power transistors other than the tab soldered to the board. I can’t see how that board puts out anywhere near 150w. The heat sink just couldn’t dissipate that much energy.
For instructions taking the car apart, the crutchfield guide is very good. You can get it for free if you buy anything from them. I wouldn’t attempt it without that guide or a service manual. There are too many expensive things you can break taking it apart, and the steps are pretty involved for taking the dash apart and getting thr rear deck out. It’s not hard. Just a lot of things need to be done I’m order.
As far as subs go, the Kicker hideaway sounds decent if it’s under your seat, but you’re not even gonna hear it in the trunk. The main problem with the kicker stuff with integrated amps is the electronics are crap. They are very unreliable. Just read the reviews. Look at this replacement amp board for the hideaway. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/183166321695 It looks like it belongs in a $20 boom box. Judging from the lack of stiffening caps, the power rail is weak as ****, there is no heat sink on the power transistors other than the tab soldered to the board. I can’t see how that board puts out anywhere near 150w. The heat sink just couldn’t dissipate that much energy.
Joshw0000
SHO Member
I just re-ran the sub to the amp and tapped in to the front door speakers. I didn't get to test much as the garage is under the kids' rooms and its past midnight on a school night. I just made sure everything still worked. Fingers crossed that I can tell a difference tomorrow.
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I was looking at Precision Power stuff on eBay. It’s as cheap as Pyramid used to be back in the day. It used to be primo stuff. Ditto with HiFonics and MB Quart. I could go on forever. It is a real shame. I would rather see them out of business than what has happened to them.
I guess mega buck is relative. The utopia and supremo are just insane. I can’t see ever paying that for just speakers. Probably will try Audiofrog or Dynaudio next build though.
I had never messed with a real dsp before the SHO. There’s a bit of a learning curve to tuning one, but you can catch on pretty quick by just playing with it. I actually read a really good in depth article on tuning by an Audiofrog engineer before I made my first attempt and also read a bunch in various car audio forums. Then it was just trial and error with my iPhone running the Audiocontrol RTA app and an oscope and playing with the crossovers, EQs, phasing, and delays. I learned a LOT by doing it myself, and applied the knowledge to my wife’s Flex and got fairly inexpensive amps and speakers to sound pretty phenomenal. My rejected deck subs from the SHO are under her front seats by the way. Lol
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